sandwedge

I said yesterday: Seeing this thread again I would take it one step further and wouldn't even start it, much less drive it. Sounds like the problem has been going on long enough where you have no way of knowing what percentage oil/coolant you have where there should be 100% motor oil.

TheBruce

Actually this reminds me of a similar case I heard about from my dealer:

- The local PCA president was at an AutoX event and his expansion tank started overflowing.
- He thought it just overheated so had it towed to his indy who couldn't figure it out. Every time the car got to temp the coolant system would overflow.
- They eventually admitted defeat and brought it to the dealer. It was diagnosed as a cracked cylinder liner, which resulted in the coolant system over pressurizing.
- Luckily they were able to get a goodwill replacement, on account the guy was the PCA president...and this was his third engine.

dgjks6

BigDaddy1969

Thanks for all the posts. I agree - looking back on it, I should have stopped driving at the first incident.

The car is in the shop now. Engine out. No signs of external leaks.

I woke up this morning thinking if it's not the head, and the head gaskets don't often fail, then it's possibly the cylinders. I'll probably find out this afternoon... will update the thread

BigDaddy1969

The result is: It's a cracked BLOCK!

Does this mean I have to do a full engine replacement? or get a refurbished engine? What options do I have that are not $20,000?

Petza914

I'm sorry to hear this, but suspected that was the case from the evidence.

The shortest turnaround with dependability upgrades Nickies, etc is probably the option from RND Engines, but I'm afraid they're around that number. Buying a used motor is a crap-shoot where you don't know the history and could have scoring, a crack, or another issue.

doclouie

That is a tough pill to swallow. Sorry bud. You will need a new block and a full rebuild. You will be 15-20k into it unless you sell it as a roller and then I hear you only get like 8k for one in perfect shape. A used engine will run you 12-15k and you will have no idea what problems it will give you. Time to start new.

Bruce In Philly

Bummer...... I would contact Jake Raby or another reputable builder. Jake is more than generous with his time...... There a many threads discussing cost of options. I won't repeat my story but I ended up selling my Boxster as a roller and just purchased another car. My Boxster had 197K miles so the math was upside down. The buyer found a junk yard engine and was very happy albeit there is risk.... not sure of his cost but I think all in it was around $12K but I am not really sure. Popular indys sometime have a line on a recently wrecked car and may be able to get you a great deal...... work the phones. Good luck.

Peace
Bruce in Philly

TheBruce

BigDaddy - im very sorry to hear that. How did they diagnose it? I would call S-Car-Go and Hi-Tech in San Rafael if you want some additional opinions/pricing.

@Petza914 and the rest of you pros - how does a block get cracked, and what does that technically mean? Not something we've ever seen on this board before I dont recall.

Petza914

I believe the most common cause of a cracked 997 block is from a failed water pump where at some point, the plastic impeller fins broke off and circulated through the narrow passageways that the coolant needs to go through. If those larger pieces of the impeller fins lodge in a passageway and block it from coolant flow, it becomes extremely hot right there (called a hot spot) and the heat stress can crack the block.

The other thing that can happen is a final result of bore scoring where enough metal gets scraped away and lodged between the piston and cylinder wall that the wall is galled and the piston kind of gets stuck when it's trying to move. The explosive force is going to move the piston one way or the other so something has to give - that's when either the block cracks or the connecting rod breaks.

Lastly, the D-chunk failure is also a kind of cracked block, but on the inside cylinder wall. This is where the cylinder sleeve actually slides up (gets pulled up by the piston's compression stroke) to where it rises out of the block a bit then a piece at the top breaks, and the shrapnel bounces around on top of the piston destroying the motor.

In the OP's case where the car seemed to be running fine, I'm betting it was parts of a coolant pump impeller fan lodged in a passageway. That's why it's important to PM these pumps prior to failure (50-60k mile PM interval). Once they fail, the bearing has enough play in it to where the impeller is contacting the housing. In some cases, if the bearing wears slowly and the wear angle increases progressively, it just wears away the impeller fins, making some plastic dust which continues to circulate just fine. But if the bearing lets go fairly quickly, that's when a chunk can break off and get lodged in the coolant passages, creating a hot spot and possibly a cracked block.

TheBruce

Thanks Pete ^

JAGMAN1

Bad news. It serves as a good reminder to all of us that the coolant temp sensor is located in one spot. And therefor will not indicate if part of the block is overheating due to restricted flow. I think some of us would've tried to push a bit further given the "normal" temp readings. Good luck

BigDaddy1969

OK! So - I got some options now on what to do - would love some advice. The car is worth about $40,000 (maybe), so I don't want to put in $30k of engine.

I'm wondering if I want to just put in an engine and sell it? OR... If I want to put in an engine and keep it for a few years. Any thoughts?

The options I'm interested in below are:
1. My Mechanic's guy: Used 42k mile engine. $13,200 delivered all complete. He's "never had a problem with their engines" - Pros: Cheap, fast, (somewhat) trusted source. 6 mo (or 1 year) warrantee. 42k miles is good. Cons: Used engine with no rebuild brings risk - will I have the same problems in a year?
2. MBMotorsportsrepair.com - rebuilt engine for $15,000 plus delivery from FL to CA. I give them heads and all, they fit it, and send it back. Pros: Rebuilt engine, not crazy money. Cons: Takes 4-6 weeks, shipping might be a LOT across the country. Not sure on rebuild quality
3. LA Dismantler: $20,000 rebuilt engine. Pros: known supplier, rebuilt engine. Not $30k (is that a pro??). CA shipping Cons: $20k is a lot of money!!!
4. DC Automotive: $11,800 - 2006 997.1 - Pros: Cheapest option (maybe - shipping from NC to CA might be $1k each way?). Cons: could be an IMS waiting to happen. Hidden costs. not rebuilt.

5....? Trade it in as is (w/ cracked block) at a Porsche dealer to see if they give me $40-15=25K for the trade in? Then I'm in the same financial position but can upgrade without doing all the work...

Bruce In Philly

Hmmm.... something to think about.... your next car... what would it be and how long will you keep it. The reason I ask this..... I sold mine as a roller and purchased a newer used 2009 (DFI engine) with the plan to keep it for 15 years. My roller had high mileage so the car was not worth much and probably would not last 15 years like getting a newer one. Planning on keeping it 15 years makes dumping the old and getting another, newer, lower risk car much more appealing. If you put another engine your car, regardless of the price or option you take, how long would you keep it?

Peace
Bruce in Philly

BigDaddy1969