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997.2 3.8 Engine Failure

 
Old 12-24-2018, 06:11 PM
  #16  
cwheeler
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Ummm something has gone, but I don't believe that to be the bottom end. I think bearings give you gold looking flakes. And the amount of debris.... I'm still not convinced you have a blown engine.

Do the water pumps have metal impellers?

I'm just throwing darts....
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Old 12-24-2018, 06:26 PM
  #17  
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Don't start it, leave it be. Hopefully you have another form of transportation. Time to do your homework about repairing it.

Just wondering, you live in a northern climate. Do you do a lot of winter starting and driving? If so what were your warm up habits?
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Old 12-24-2018, 06:30 PM
  #18  
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Sounds strange that piston slap should occur so fast. Don't believe it is. As it's usually accompanied by excessive oil consumption.

I cannot really see metal shavings in the pic but then you should have them also in the magnet in the bottom of the filter housing.

I would definitely look further before going for a full rebuild.
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Old 12-24-2018, 06:54 PM
  #19  
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Lots of tiny metal flakes there. Something is up. As others mentioned, don't start the car again and have it towed to a good Porsche shop. Fingers crossed that it's salvageable.
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Old 12-24-2018, 07:36 PM
  #20  
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Doesnít sound like a grenadine motor to me. Too loud (if that makes any sense) for piston slap and the absence of codes signaling any impending doom. Did you get a fix on where the noise was coming from exactly? +1 on not starting it again to find out though. Get it towed to a good Indy.

Also, what type of Motul did you switch to? My motorcycle mechanic (ex Factory Aprilia team tech) told me Motul is suited to race/track bikes and cars, with very short change intervals. Told me to stay away from it for street driven vehicles with normal change intervals.
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Old 12-24-2018, 08:00 PM
  #21  
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Yuck. Sorry I was hoping it was something simple.

Are those black flecks on your finger? If so I would rule out water pump and go with Wayne's suggestion on the chain tensioner. On the .1 the chain tensioners are a caramel color so any wear results in brownish, black flecks in the filter (Im not sure if the .2 is the same). The metallic flakes in the filter could be from the chain beating itself to death.

If you are comfortable I would drain the oil and drop the oil pan to see if you can find any more debris. Or just flatbed it to your indy after xmas.
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Old 12-25-2018, 01:32 AM
  #22  
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The video sounds like a water pump or pulley to me. I would park it and get an oil analysis before tearing in to anything. If it comes back OK, fire it up for a few seconds without the belt and see if it goes away.
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Old 12-25-2018, 02:45 AM
  #23  
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Agree with those who advice not to crank it up again but flatbed it to your dealership or indy of choice for diagnosis. As I've said before, I've yet to read or hear about a complete 997.2 engine failure needing total rebuild or replacement. Not to say it never happened because it hasn't been posted on RL but statistics seem to be on your side. Good luck and please keep us posted.
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Old 12-25-2018, 10:40 AM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by cwheeler View Post
Ummm something has gone, but I don't believe that to be the bottom end. I think bearings give you gold looking flakes. And the amount of debris.... I'm still not convinced you have a blown engine.
Do the water pumps have metal impellers?
I'm just throwing darts....
Even if water pump failed internally, pieces of it aren't going to be that small - and they're not going to make their way into the engine oil.


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Old 12-25-2018, 10:50 AM
  #25  
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OP, it's hard to see from pictures what you are seeing. I think you've got to investigate further. I'd get another oil analysis done now while you're evaluating next steps. An engine expert is probably going to recommend dropping the oil pan for further investigation.
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Old 12-25-2018, 11:20 AM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by bronz View Post

The car currently has 76k miles.

What are my options? What kind of diagnosis can i do at home? Drain oil and look for shavings? The car doesnt have any faults or check engine on the dash.

What is the cost of new engine? Rebuild? 4.0 build?

Any suggestions on the shop around Chicago area?

Any advice is appreciated.
LN Engineering isn't too far from you.. I don't think they do repairs but are extremely knowledgeable and could recommend reputable local shops. Sometimes they (Charles Navarro) comment on engine related threads here on Rennlist. You may want to PM them and send a link to your video or this thread. He may comment publicly or privately with the OP about the possible failure and repairs needed as well as potential cost.
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Old 12-25-2018, 12:25 PM
  #27  
Charles Navarro
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We normally do not do repairs or rebuild engines, but from time to time we'll facilitate a rebuild - we can pull the engine but our space to store cars is limited as LN has displaced what used to be customer storage for Bilt Racing Service with our expanded manufacturing and warehousing.

For the DFI cars, we run the rebuilds through RND Engines. Engine gets pulled and sent off, and block comes back to LN for processing. Rebuild cost starts around $15,500 depending on what damage we find. Good thing is we have lots of cores if something is bad.

I'd be curious to see the used oil analysis from this engine.

Have you tracked the car at all or know the prior history?

For sure, with the engine having been making mechanical noises, that I would cease to operate it, so as to prevent any further damage.
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Old 12-25-2018, 02:33 PM
  #28  
Bruce In Philly
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2009 C2S 130k miles

Thanx for posting Charles, Ummm just curious, why do you have so many cores around? What kind of 997.2 failures do you see.

Peace
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Old 12-25-2018, 04:11 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by bronz View Post



At first it didnít seem like much metal, just normal random small flakes, but zooming in there is quite a bit there. Also what seems to be black plastic bits? Are you sure the IMS didnít just fail? Are the particles magnetic?
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Old 12-25-2018, 04:17 PM
  #30  
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The 997.2 DFI engine does not have an IMS.

Originally Posted by bgoetz View Post

At first it didnít seem like much metal, just normal random small flakes, but zooming in there is quite a bit there. Also what seems to be black plastic bits? Are you sure the IMS didnít just fail? Are the particles magnetic?
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