Looking at 2005 997 with 106k
11-27-2018, 10:59 PM
#31
^^^When my 2007 C4S went in for clutch and RMS 3 weeks ago, my indy pulled the IMS shaft/inspected it and looked in excellent condition, resealed shaft and also removed the rear seal on the bearing which is recommended for more oil flow into bearing.
*From Jake Raby's post couple years ago:
"The M97 engines have now been in service for over 8 years. The IMSB failures that we see 8 years in with these engines barely registers on the scale with what we saw at 8 years, or even 6 years time in service with the M96 engines. Back in those days we were the only guys researching the IMSB failure and developing fixes for it and comparing the figures today tells us the story."
*From Jake Raby's post couple years ago:
"The M97 engines have now been in service for over 8 years. The IMSB failures that we see 8 years in with these engines barely registers on the scale with what we saw at 8 years, or even 6 years time in service with the M96 engines. Back in those days we were the only guys researching the IMSB failure and developing fixes for it and comparing the figures today tells us the story."
11-28-2018, 10:38 AM
#32
Rennlist Member
Why not? Any chance to replace seals & increase lubrication is a no brainer even if failure rate is miniscule.
Also the reason I spent an extra $500 to replace the clutch when I was only replacing RMS due to slight seepage. Also inspected flywheel.
Do as much as you can while transmission is removed.
And always remember, majority of RL 997 IMS posts are small % of owners who experience problems and live in a gloom and doom world.
996 a totally different story and why I replaced the IMS bearing in all (3) 996 C4S's I've owned.
Also the reason I spent an extra $500 to replace the clutch when I was only replacing RMS due to slight seepage. Also inspected flywheel.
Do as much as you can while transmission is removed.
And always remember, majority of RL 997 IMS posts are small % of owners who experience problems and live in a gloom and doom world.
996 a totally different story and why I replaced the IMS bearing in all (3) 996 C4S's I've owned.
11-28-2018, 02:59 PM
#33
Why not? Any chance to replace seals & increase lubrication is a no brainer even if failure rate is miniscule.
Also the reason I spent an extra $500 to replace the clutch when I was only replacing RMS due to slight seepage. Also inspected flywheel.
Do as much as you can while transmission is removed.
And always remember, majority of RL 997 IMS posts are small % of owners who experience problems and live in a gloom and doom world.
996 a totally different story and why I replaced the IMS bearing in all (3) 996 C4S's I've owned.
Also the reason I spent an extra $500 to replace the clutch when I was only replacing RMS due to slight seepage. Also inspected flywheel.
Do as much as you can while transmission is removed.
And always remember, majority of RL 997 IMS posts are small % of owners who experience problems and live in a gloom and doom world.
996 a totally different story and why I replaced the IMS bearing in all (3) 996 C4S's I've owned.
11-28-2018, 04:57 PM
#34
Rennlist Member
I guess my point is, 8% failure or 1% failure what is really the difference from a phycological standpoint? Despite the low failure rate you still acted on it, really no different than one with an early 997 or 996 would. The difference is if you have the smaller bearing you can replace it with a new dual row ceramic bearing that supports the same load as the larger single row.
0-1% failure rate to me is nothing and really no different than any other normal wear and tear item
*I look at and have experienced Porsche engine issues from a big picture - Not sure how long you've been a Porsche owner but in my 35 years, aircooled 911's (which I've owned several of each model) had way higher failure rates on engine related items:
- 78-83 911sc head studs & chain tensioners - required top end rebuild & chain guides upgraded
-78-83 911sc Transmission syncros failing - required transmission rebuild
-1985/86 Carrera worn valve guides - required head rebuild
-964 engine seals - '89.'90,'91 models - required engine re-seal
-993 clogged air passages - required head rebuilt
Those failure rates were probably 95% of cars manufactured and required major engine work which at the time was equivalent to 40-50% of the cars market value so I just don't see a 1% failure rate as being something to be concerned about.
11-29-2018, 04:54 PM
#35
Rennlist Member
So boring when I'm right and debate ends...oh well
11-29-2018, 07:20 PM
#37
One, you and I have two different perspectives on life if you can’t find something better to do then debate on forums. Two, if that is how you want to see things, zero sweat on my end
FWIW, I appreciated the data on older 911s, sometimes people loose perspective
.
FWIW, I appreciated the data on older 911s, sometimes people loose perspective
.Last edited by bgoetz; 11-29-2018 at 09:44 PM.
11-29-2018, 08:57 PM
#38
Three Wheelin'
Here's the car. Shows 5 owners. It should have the small IMS due to the early year production. Good service records to me.I love the cream CAB, but I want PDK or TIP
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/l-Used...ting=223521987
https://vinanalytics.com/car/WP0AA29905S716066/
https://www.carfax.com/VehicleHistor...AA29905S716066
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/l-Used...ting=223521987
https://vinanalytics.com/car/WP0AA29905S716066/
https://www.carfax.com/VehicleHistor...AA29905S716066
11-29-2018, 09:40 PM
#39
That looks like a great car and would definitely have the smaller IMS given the product date. At 106k and no issues I might consider seeing about getting $3k knocked off and then either not having the IMS done and just enjoying the car. Or taking it to a LNE certified installer and giving them $3k to do the IMS and clutch. IMO having a certified installer do the work adds value to the IMS service.
11-29-2018, 11:09 PM
#40
Rennlist Member
Maybe you can see my perspective on things when it comes to the gloom and doom talk of our beloved 997's - When compared to early 011 ownership, 997's are a walk in the park
11-29-2018, 11:23 PM
#41
Forums and all the negative PR however really makes proactively doing something whether replacing a bearing or removing a seal make sense. The value in the resale world coupled with doing something you were going to need to do anyway (clutch) really makes it hard to just not do it, despite and personal risk threshold. For that reason I will begrudgingly give in to the hysteria.
That was where I was going with my original comment
11-30-2018, 12:21 AM
#42
Intermediate
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Here's the car. Shows 5 owners. It should have the small IMS due to the early year production. Good service records to me.I love the cream CAB, but I want PDK or TIP
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/l-Used...ting=223521987
https://vinanalytics.com/car/WP0AA29905S716066/
https://www.carfax.com/VehicleHistor...AA29905S716066
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/l-Used...ting=223521987
https://vinanalytics.com/car/WP0AA29905S716066/
https://www.carfax.com/VehicleHistor...AA29905S716066
Looks really clean and nice!!
Get it with IMS done or lower it!
11-30-2018, 01:40 PM
#43
Rennlist Member
That looks like a nice car and if they throw in the clutch replacement when they change out the IMS, seems like a fair deal - Why not have them throw in a set of front brake pads and sensors too! OR pay them for the labor to install.
If they give you any crap about the cost of clutch, tell them they can order brand new OEM Sachs Clutch Kit & RMS including shipping from RennPart in SC for $533. Get the brake pads and sensors from RennPart too!
What the hell, maybe pick up water pump & Thermostat have them install that too unless there is a service record for it being done?
If they balk, remind them it's the holidays and everyone should be a in a giving mood!
Good luck!
If they give you any crap about the cost of clutch, tell them they can order brand new OEM Sachs Clutch Kit & RMS including shipping from RennPart in SC for $533. Get the brake pads and sensors from RennPart too!
What the hell, maybe pick up water pump & Thermostat have them install that too unless there is a service record for it being done?
If they balk, remind them it's the holidays and everyone should be a in a giving mood!
Good luck!
11-30-2018, 01:48 PM
#44
Rennlist Member
I actually couldn’t agree more, I think we were maybe just misunderstanding each other a bit. FWIW, I have an early 05 997 and I personally don’t think either years are that big of a deal.
Forums and all the negative PR however really makes proactively doing something whether replacing a bearing or removing a seal make sense. The value in the resale world coupled with doing something you were going to need to do anyway (clutch) really makes it hard to just not do it, despite and personal risk threshold. For that reason I will begrudgingly give in to the hysteria.
That was where I was going with my original comment
The 996 Forum was a lot worse but always entertaining.
Not to mention the new member jackasses who have nothing to contribute but unsubstantiated BS
11-30-2018, 02:05 PM
#45
Drifting
Also, if I am grandfathered in to the old-school group, can I still reserve the right to occasionally post unsubstantiated bull$hit? Sometimes it's just fun.