swingwing

sandwedge

Very nice. Subjective of course but if that was my car and I had the same wish list as you do I would start with a set of 19" wheels instead of another set of 18's. Most agree that 19's is the sweet spot wheel size for the 997. Then lower it with springs or coil overs along with spacers. You already have the right idea about waking up the exhaust so just a matter of which parts to use. Gotta do both the side cans and the center muffler though. One or the other alone won't make you happy. Since you already have a dedicated track car I don't see any reason to go much beyond that.

josserman

Petza914

I would be very surprised if the forged 19" Champions I have for sale are heavier than the 18s you're looking at buying. If that's the case, not only will they look better, but the reduced sidewall flex of a lower profile tire will give you better handling than you'll achieve with the 18s that have taller sidewalls and since you're considering coilovers, you're obviously interested in improved handling.

These are the wheels weights of the champions
Champion RS171 Front wheel 19x8.5 et 53 weight is 20.75 lbs
Champion RS171 Rear wheel 19x11.5 et 62 weight is 21.8 lbs.

The 11.5" wide rear will flatten the contact patch a bit more than the 11" too even on the same width tire, so it's actually like running a slightly wider tire for more grip. With a 911 and all that weight in the rear, extra contact patch back there helps.

GSXR750

josserman

Yes a larger contact patch will provide more grip, however the larger diameter will reduce acceleration. However, as I stated before, I've spent countless hours testing on the race track with tire temp and all sorts of other aim data readings (slip angle calculations from g-force and steering angle, acceleration formulas, sectional track times, g-force, and more), the reality is most people can't push a car hard enough to actually use all the traction the wider tire will provide, and tires simply won't come up to full temp. The only time you should really consider a wider diameter is if your tire temps are too high and the tires can't grip/car sliding around too much, and BTW environmental factors and the tracks play a significant role in this too. BTW, why do you think all the cup car guys are running 18's..

The other important factor is tire cost. Of course on a street car you're not going through 10 sets of tires in a race season, but still probably changing summer tires once every year.

Now of course, we're talking about street cars here, not race cars, so the finite differences are irrelevant, but still can be used as a guideline, **** most race teams are funded on that principle alone!

Appraiser

Great minds think alike; I had an S2000 for 5 years that I autocrossed - was built with Ballade Motorsports in Orange County. I bought my 911 for double duty (DE and weekend cruising) and have been enjoying it for the past few years. I'm actively looking for a race car specifically a retired Spec B Honda Fit, if ya know of one. The 911 is lots of fun but expensive to track relative to cheaper cars and I don't see myself reducing track time; so I need something cheaper

My 997.1 has the following:
Fister D exhaust - excellent muffler; I elected to get it black ceramic coated (~$700 with exchange).
IPD 3.6l plenum - I don't notice any difference (~$250 used)
7 & 15 mm spacers - car looks nice(r) ($190 new)
GT3 rear sway bar - cheap and makes a noticeable difference ($100 used)
front & rear adjustable drop links - front is Rennline, rear is Torque Solutions; they strike me as similar quality, could be in my head but I thought the steering off center was a little nicer/heavier after set for my weight (~$220?f and $120r ebay)
BMC air filter - I don't notice any difference ($80 new on ebay)
964RS motor mounts - pieced it together, added a little NVH and crispness, mufflers changed timbre slightly too ($200ish all parts/hardware assembled)
FF Orange trans insert - added a little more NVH on top of the mount ($85 new)
GT3 shift **** - looks nice(r) ($gifted)
Rennline pedals - looks nice(r) and with the throttle extension I can be lazier rolling my ankle to blip the throttle ($200ish new)
Coco Mats - looks nice(r) ($gifted)
Tranzit Blu - purchased on Amazon I think, I use it only for bluetooth audio streaming; sounds ok to me (for the price at least) ($70 new)
3rd Radiator - shop around on price, helps with summer temp on track; I see an average 10 degree drop across the board ($180 new)
GT3 front brake ducts - very cheap mod, dunno if they do much though ($15? new)
GT3 brake master cylinder - easy mod, I found the brake pedal a little stiffer over the course of the day on track ($240 new)

What I have yet to install:
Recaro SPG Profi XL - fits me great, I need to figure out the best way to clear the airbag warning after swapping seats though ($950 used with full hardware)
Brey Krause Harness Truss - I didn't want to commit to a roll-bar when my wife and I still use the car for date night and weekend trips ($300 used)
Spoon subframe collars - $280ish new? Someone said going through Blackhawk Japan directly will be cheaper - I purchased through ebay
Porsche X51 headers - bought used on ebay ($40)

What I have yet to purchase:
Phenix Engineering billet shift bushing - for a Sunday project ($65 new)
Schroth harness - to finish the seat ($330 new)
FVD front camber plates - I need more negative camber, the tires are wearing out on the edge faster now. There's several different units to choose from; Rennline, Elephant Racing, Tarett, etc. I think FVD is one of the cheapest ($410 new)

Items I'm on the fence about:
Springs - Admittedly I like the 4x4 practicality of the car especially over gators and surface streets pot holes when not on track. I like the factory suspension on track, too, even at 62k miles. But the extra camber and turn-in would be nice.
Brake pads - I don't have any issue with the factory braking; I use Motul RBF600 and oem supplier pads and rotors for 8+ track days without issue, but I can't help wonder if the grass is both greener and shorter on the other side.

Puts the grand total around $5,300 assuming some gifts and overage over the past 2.5 years or so.

I couldn't say if my car is quicker than it was before; I never timed myself, I just go for fun and compared to others on track... well sometimes I am faster than the S cars, sometimes slower, sometimes I keep up with the GT3's and sometimes I get smoked by a 944. Different track, different drivers, different days. I think it "feels," looks and sounds better than when I purchased it and am very happy with the total package. Plus all the time in garage was well worth it - it's my hobby and zen garden away from work and family. One thing I like about the C2 car is the tires, too. I rock the 235/265 18" factory wheel and sizes with Potenza S-04 which are under $800 for a set. I may not have as much mechanical grip but it is comfortable at speed, communicates well enough and easy reel it back in when they let go. The tire feels really well matched for the car in general. I like where the limit is. It's challenging to drive a 911 quick, in my opinion, and this keeps me more honest and smoother behind the wheel. Not sure if 997.2 is the same but the PSM is not fully defeatable in our cars; I took it to a wet skid pad and it would inadvertently always cut in with it "off". I keep it on 75% on track anyways, not that it matters much.

This is one of the few cars I fit in that is fun to drive quick, looks timeless and is reliable. Next week my wife and I are taking it on a 1,060 mile 6-day road trip. It'll be loaded up with suitcases, car parts (I'm collecting the harness truss on the way down!) and tools/track gear. The penultimate day I'm at Laguna Seca for a DE while my wife hangs out at the beach. That's the great versatility of the car. It works as intended.

Looking forward to see your car shape up.

sandwedge

You said you already have a dedicated track car and that the objective here is to make the 997 sound better and look cooler rather than focusing on performance. That's why I suggested 19" wheels instead of 18's. Despite what you said your priorities were with the 997 it sounds like performance still is more important to you although as Petza914 pointed out, whether or not you get better performance with the 18's than the 19's can probably be debated. As for looks which you listed as one of your first priorities, I bet at least 90% of those posting here will vote for the 19's.

josserman

sandwedge

Well..."not the larger the better". Much discussion about this here over time. Consensus seems to be that 20" is too much and that 19" is spot on in terms of looks. As for performance, Porsche shipped all their 997 GT cars with 19" wheels from the factory which you have to think means something.

Doug H

Perhaps it means general purchasing public likes the look of a larger wheel on Porsches GTX cars made for the street just as you noted. Not all are shipped with 19s as was pointed out on the GT3 Cup cars which are not made for the street are a no compromise track car. Unsprung/rotational weight/mass, however, is a big deal on most of the NAs in normal city driving due to the somewhat anemic torque curve.

As OP, I too used to do extensive point by point data logging on many different tire, wheel, pressure and etc. combinations on open tracks where one can be within inches of all point driving. Interesting to see how different set ups excel in one area, but not others and how lines and points can change with the addition or subtraction of rotating mass and weight. Miss those days of having too much time on my hands and dang near unlimited budgets for such ridiculousness.

Just because Porsche delivers it from the factory for the street does not mean it cannot be made any better/faster/quicker or more stable.

josserman

AutoquestMotorsports

Very nice car and I like the gameplan! I have a few recommendations, PM'ing you to chat : )