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pdk is essentially a manual so Porsche replaced the outdated tiptronic torque converter technology (read here automatic transmission) with a super fancy manual transmission that has the capability of shifting auto. pdk has more in common with manual than tiptronic which is nothing like pdk.
not exactly. I know all the systems well (I'm sure you too)
This is a mistake that repeats itself.
The technology of the PDK transmission system (in terms of mechanical structure) is more "similar" to manual gear.
An automatic transmission system (in terms of mechanical structure) is "similar" to TIPTRONIC S.
In fact, both the PDK and the TIPTRONIC S have a computer, there is a D mode (automatic), the steering wheel is controlled and both have 2 pedals.
PDK is more similar to TIPTRONIC S (in terms of transmission - driving).
There is no connection between the PDK and the manual transmission system. Two different things.
Bottom line: PDK replaced the TIPTRONIC S.
It's written in all the books and Porsche says it too.
By the way, the extra price for TIPTRONIC S was $3420 and the addition of PDK $4080.
Did I mention I had an AMG with this great Tip transmission......yes, I did (page 1).
I’ll be clear...for performance, the TIP was a POS. That was with a supercharged 5.5L motor putting down 600hp. Pushing the buttons to change gears up or down was more of a “request” than a command.
Now off the track it is a decent trans and handled the extra torque in my setup with no issues.
People that write threads about how much they love their Tiptronic are doing so in hopes that they can convince themselves that they made the right choice. I know because I used to be one of those people. I was seeking validation but at the end of the day I didn't find it and eventually I gave up and got a PDK.
Hey now geez, I've wrote about it but I didn't need to convince myself, ok well actually I didn't write about how much I like it. I just tried to show that in the real world they cost more.
f911 - was that you on the track? if so folks can give you all the grief they want, I'm not a track rat, only enjoy it occasionally, but you whooped up on some big boys. Now don't let it go to your head, this tread will never end then .
I'm going to leave the office now and enjoy my Tip.
Hey now geez, I've wrote about it but I didn't need to convince myself, ok well actually I didn't write about how much I like it. I just tried to show that in the real world they cost more.
f911 - was that you on the track? if so folks can give you all the grief they want, I'm not a track rat, only enjoy it occasionally, but you whooped up on some big boys. Now don't let it go to your head, this tread will never end then .
I'm going to leave the office now and enjoy my Tip.
Lol, don't think that would be him. I think he just bought his 997 and that video was from 2010.
Hey now geez, I've wrote about it but I didn't need to convince myself, ok well actually I didn't write about how much I like it. I just tried to show that in the real world they cost more.
f911 - was that you on the track? if so folks can give you all the grief they want, I'm not a track rat, only enjoy it occasionally, but you whooped up on some big boys. Now don't let it go to your head, this tread will never end then .
I'm going to leave the office now and enjoy my Tip.
It's not me on the track. "Sample video".
I bought my Porsche a year ago Have an excellent weekend for everyone!
People that write threads about how much they love their Tiptronic are doing so in hopes that they can convince themselves that they made the right choice. I know because I used to be one of those people. I was seeking validation but at the end of the day I didn't find it and eventually I gave up and got a PDK.
Hi franky
All my life I drove cars manually. I looked for 997.1 (only 997.1) and looked for something different. Steering control. I shared my experience firsthand and based on accurate data from Porsche. I've never said that tip is better than a manual or pdk transmission system. These are different transmission systems and different times. The next vehicle will probably be the 911 pdk.. 911 surely ;-)
Sincerely
And we're back to referencing the article that only compares it in a Turbo car, where we all agree that because of the gear ratios and the Tips ability to keep the car in boost during the gear change that in a turbo car, it doesn't degrade the performance as much. You can't keep bouncing back and forth between comparisons of Turbo vs non-Turbo because you have a non-turbo, and the only article that had anything good to say about Tip is restricted to when it's in a Turbo.
Umm, let's see.
It makes a higher HP & torque, larger displacement car (an S) slower on every single test than the lower HP, lower torque, lower displacment base car (non-S),
gear shifts are noticeable slow where you press the button and wait for it to occur, entering a corner,
you can't skp gears and go from 4th to 2nd under heavy braking, without going to 3rd on the way by,
it's not as engaging or involving to drive,
etc
etc
etc
Sorry, not a chance. A skilled driver doing laps in identical cars with only the transmission being different will be much, much faster in the MT car, even with 1 hand on the wheel and 1 hand on the shift lever.
Just because in both the Tip and PDK the driver can have both hands on the wheel does not make them comparable - lots of crappy sedans from the 90s and early 2000s had shift control buttons on the steering wheel for their torque converter automatic transmissions, which is what the Tip is, but that doesn't make them cars that should be driven on the track.
Show me an article or in-car footage of any serious Porsche racer from the 993, 996, or 997.1 era choosing to equip his race car with a Tiptronic transmission rather than a MT. Hurley Haywood, Derek Bell, Walter Rohrl, anyone - crickets - that's what I thought.
As I said in an earlier post, the only reason to choose a Tip car is because you can't drive or don't want a MT and you can't afford the trade-up to the PDK generation. It's not a transmisison that should be in a 911, and even Porsche realized that so they came out with the more advanced PDK. They then found out that they also need to keep the MT alive when they dropped it in the 991.1 GT3 and had to bring it back in the 991.2 GT3 to keep the purists happy - I don't recall seeing them bring back the Tip to keep anyone happy.
I'm glad you love your car and transmission so much, but am now done with this thread as I'm tired of
Hi bro
For you, I attach an old video (Poor quality) But, conveying the message in a good way. On the track (997 carrera s tiptronic s -Latest version)
...Show me an article or in-car footage of any serious Porsche racer from the 993, 996, or 997.1 era choosing to equip his race car with a Tiptronic transmission rather than a MT. Hurley Haywood, Derek Bell, Walter Rohrl, anyone - crickets - that's what I thought...
Dear Friend. I saw it and I could not help thinking of you ..
Another interesting project that I did not know about (with TIPTRONIC - an old version of that period).
By the way, just so you know, I really appreciate you. Your knowledge is vast and I personally learn a lot from you. I'm not trying to compete with your knowledge. I am talking from experience and it is important for me to share what I learn about this system for any rennlist that is used in tiptronic S or considering buying.
New update:
[I'm just talking about driving in manual mode with Chrono Sports]
In technical driving or driving on a track, I noticed that the transmission intervals are significantly shortened with gas and brake work correctly.
As we use a manual transmission system when at times we decide to move the gear calmly or quickly. Also in TIP S, the use of the meridian during acceleration (raising gear) improves significant transfer times.
In addition, in braking (recommended in a straight line) gear down on the foot on the brake improves the downshifting. It is very important to perform the gear reduction in the appropriate RPM.
In PDK it is much easier. The computer does everything quickly and in every situation. In TIP S, gear shift and gear shift times vary and are more dependent on the driver, using brakes, gas and should be more attentive to the engine.
This may sound funny but the TIP S is more manual than the PDK which is more than AUTO. The driver in TIP S should be more involved in driving for proper utilization of the transmission system.
In addition, I recommend starting driving in first gear (download to first only in absolute stop mode).
It improves transfer times as well. Also, braking with the left foot is very useful but it has been a matter of preference.
Dear Friend. I saw it and I could not help thinking of you ..
Another interesting project that I did not know about (with TIPTRONIC - an old version of that period).
By the way, just so you know, I really appreciate you. Your knowledge is vast and I personally learn a lot from you. I'm not trying to compete with your knowledge. I am talking from experience and it is important for me to share what I learn about this system for any rennlist that is used in tiptronic S or considering buying.
New update:
[I'm just talking about driving in manual mode with Chrono Sports]
In technical driving or driving on a track, I noticed that the transmission intervals are significantly shortened with gas and brake work correctly.
As we use a manual transmission system when at times we decide to move the gear calmly or quickly. Also in TIP S, the use of the meridian during acceleration (raising gear) improves significant transfer times.
In addition, in braking (recommended in a straight line) gear down on the foot on the brake improves the downshifting. It is very important to perform the gear reduction in the appropriate RPM.
In PDK it is much easier. The computer does everything quickly and in every situation. In TIP S, gear shift and gear shift times vary and are more dependent on the driver, using brakes, gas and should be more attentive to the engine.
This may sound funny but the TIP S is more manual than the PDK which is more than AUTO. The driver in TIP S should be more involved in driving for proper utilization of the transmission system.
In addition, I recommend starting driving in first gear (download to first only in absolute stop mode).
It improves transfer times as well. Also, braking with the left foot is very useful but it has been a matter of preference.
This is a very screwy post.
The Tiptronic, S or not, is a traditional torque converter automatic.
The PDK is two manual transmissions shifted by a computer.
With the except of lower cost, simplicity and possibly durability the Tiptronic has no advantages over a PDK. It doesn't rev match as well as a PDK. That requires a lot of workarounds by the driver so I can see what you mean in terms if it requiring foresight and planning but you really are analyzing the heck out of this.
Performance: Tiptronic ≤ Manual < PDK.
Involvement: Tiptronic < PDK ≤ Manual
This is a very screwy post.
The Tiptronic, S or not, is a traditional torque converter automatic.
The PDK is two manual transmissions shifted by a computer.
With the except of lower cost, simplicity and possibly durability the Tiptronic has no advantages over a PDK. It doesn't rev match as well as a PDK. That requires a lot of workarounds by the driver so I can see what you mean in terms if it requiring foresight and planning but you really are analyzing the heck out of this.
Performance: Tiptronic ≤ Manual < PDK.
Involvement: Tiptronic < PDK ≤ Manual
Excuse me. But you probably do not understand.
I'll explain myself the way you explain to a little boy.
currently. There are 3 types of transmission systems in the world:
1. Traditional manual (mechanical transmission system). No need to explain to you.
2. Traditional auto (classic torque converter). No need to explain to you.
3. Evolution of the automatic with manual control. This includes various technologies.
(Some are based on an improved torque converter and some are based on enhanced dual clutch or singel clutch and etc).
The evolutionary of automatic with manual control include:
Sportomatic, Based on electricity / hydraulics
tiptronic, based on torque converter
tiptronic s, based on torque converter
Aston Martin's transmission system, based on a torque converter
Corvette's transmission system, based on torque converter
dsg, based on clutch
smg, based on a clutch
pdk, based on a clutch
f1 singel clutch, based on clutch
f1 dual clutch, based on clutch
And etc
Common to all. It is automatic with manual control !!!
The fact that a particular technology is based on a torque converter or a clutch does not mean that it is a regular automatic transmission system or a standard transmission system.
Auto Normal This is automatic.
Both PDK and TIPTRONIC have automatic functions. That's why they call them "automatic".
But the two sets of gears are an automatic evolution
The torque converter has advantages and disadvantages
The dual clutch has advantages and disadvantages
If you'd like, I'll explain them to you
TIPTRONIC and PDK and F1 and etc are not similar to any standard manual transmission system. They are similar to an automaton with manual control.
I own two Tip Porsches, and I'm not even going to comment in this silly thread.
You're right David. I'm sorry I opened it. The goal was to share experience and drive correctly with tip. Soon Pdk 3 came out with new technology and then missed the pdk of 997. Just sad...
Thanks for all these technical info about TIPTRONIC S.
I have just sold MY 996-4 TIPTRONIC , after 11 years of very nice GT use, and now I'm selling also my 993-4 manual, because I cannot push
any more the clutch, and I was thinking to search a 997.1 Turbo Tiptronic and I'm very happy to hear that the Tiptronic S works very well
on the 997.1 TT and so I wonder if it works very well also on the 996TT ??
Because I'm in the middle between 996TT or 997TT....
Here in Italy Tiptronic is not loved, the most part of guys go for a manual, so it is easier to search to buy a 911 with TiptronicS...
THANKS and Ciao !
09-21-2017, 04:35 PM
.
now and enjoy my Tip.
