harris

can anyone identify what kind of mods, does every stage include?

thanks

MidnighTT

The tuners do not agree on what "stage 1", "stage 2", etc, mean. One tuner's stage 2 might produce the same power and cost about the same as another tuner's stage 3. Your best bet is to gather as much information as you can on each tuner's stages; such as what is included with each stage, what is the expected power curve (NOT peak power, but the whole torque vs rpm curve!), and cost.

Tuner A may aim for a wider torque curve, which usually means the peak power is lower than Tuner B's kit for about the same money. Tuner B may want to hit a big peak power number, even if it means that low rpm torque (2500 to 3500, for example) is lower than Tuner A.

If your car is primarily a driver, or autocrosser, or road race track car, I suggest going for the wide torque curve rather than big peak power. The car will be more enjoyable to drive. But if you like street racing, or want to stomp a buddy with a new Z06, the big peak power option will generate better acceleration numbers (1/4 mile ET, 60-130 times, etc.

So there's $.02 worth from a guy who hasn't finished his first cup of coffee.

Jeff

harris

I always though and knew that torque is what makes a car more enjoyable
thanks for the help.

harris

Joe Weinstein

Stage 1 is typically a reprogramming of your chip to deliver 1 bar instead of .8 bar.
That is the single most effective and cost-effective power modification in history,
in my opinion. Depending on how much farther you want to go in future, you can
get a good program for a stock car for well under $1000 and gain you over 50 hp.
If you want more tuning options and support later on, you will get what you pay
for with more expensive tunes, including multiple programs you can switch out
at the push of a button, and more ability to tune for the one-off unobtainium
hybrid turbos you just got from NASA.

Stage 2 typically adds a freer-flowing exhaust with cats, and also maybe a more
open air filter and box. The programming for stage 1 is usually completely
satisfactory and unchanged in this configuration. This should cost several
thousands, and gains you maybe 20-25 hp and a louder car.

Stage 3 usually changes/alters the turbos, adds headers (of arguable value) and
changes programming. Some tuners make other intake changes. There are some
very successful tuners that say the stock headers are fine for up to 600ph.
Once you start changing turbos and intake you can start getting some serious
power gains. You may have to start weighing/discussing the tradeoffs between
ultimate top-end power vs. instant torque and/or lack of lag at street RPMs
and roll-ons.

Stage 4 typically involves stronger rods and maybe head work, and more
extensive intake work, headers if you don't already have them, and power
levels that are are frankly immoral.

There are other mods that are for reliability that are done soon too, such
as diverter valves and shift kits . Different tuners will alter the intercooler
at different stages, and even at stage 1 you may find yourself needing a
stronger clutch.

Chuck Jones

Thanks Joe: That was one of the more concise and undertandable explanations of the various stages I've read. However if you have a CPO warranty....will the addition of a Stage I or II tune void the warranty? I still have a year left on my CPO and wouldn't want to compromise my ability to take advantage of my warranty should the need arise.

You mentioned the diverter valves....which is something I'm told is an easy upgrade...however again will the installation of better diverter valves compromise a CPO warranty? I tried searching for the answer but didnt' get any hits on voiding warranty with diverter valves.

DublinOh

You shouldn't lose warranty unless the modification can be shown to be the cause of the problem. However this is open to interpretation. If Porsche says that the diverter valves caused your block to crack (unlikely) you have to convince them otherwise (difficult). This is my understanding, two cents, etc.

Chuck Jones

This is like the justice system working from the standpoint of the presumption of guilt...and having to prove your innocence. So what you're saying is that Porsche "could" claim that the diverter valve was the direct cause of failure X....and you'd have to prove that it had nothing to do with the failure?

That seems illogical given the fact that from what Iv'e read, the replacment diverter valves like Bailey or EVOM are actually superior in construction than the OEM....but would still be subject to Porsche's complaint about them being the cause of the failure?

Joe Weinstein

I would expect to have to fight for warranty coverage if the breakage had anything
to do with power delivery, from the valves to the axles, if you raised your power.
The best stealth mode would be to talk to Kevin at UMW and get the multiprogram
flasher, which will allow you to set it to the stock program if it is to visit the dealer.
I would then replace the exhaust (The Europipe II is the best but pricey nowadays).
They would have a hard time blaming the exhaust, though that doesn't say they
might not try. DVs can't hurt the warranty, they are just better than stock.
After that, I would consider handling improvements, and invest $30/weekend
to attend 10 or 15 PCA autocrosses to really start to know how to drive the car.
Once you find the possibilities of skill development, you know you're on the path
to real competence, and that takes away the urge to make the car 'special'. It's
*already* special, plenty special, and you'll beat most everyone with it if you're
good, but you might be beaten in the canyons by a Datsun 1200 if it's set up
with a good driver and you haven't trained...