Okay. I’ll take your word for it. But Palmdale really has nothing to do with 9eleven’s HP numbers.

I agree somewhat with what you are saying about Dynojets (typically)…but not Mustangs. They and Dyno-Dynamics read lower than all of the other brands of chassis dynos I’ve used. But regardless…I’m not a big fan of chassis dynos anyway. I like Trap Speed. The big black dyno is the most honest and accurate wheel HP ‘dyno’ around.

I have no reason too. I have the dragstrip. That’s all I need.

Boost was kept to only 1.1 BAR. And my car was very strong at high speed with K16’s. Which is why I could beat that chipped X50 so decisively. I also stayed within 1-2 car lengths of a 615 rwhp Cobra (who ran 11.2 @ 129). Video below. Remember, my car only had intake, exhaust and tuning in this race. It was also full weight, AWD, running 93 octane, and had two people inside (3rd race I started in wrong gear).

http://media.putfile.com/Stage-2-TT-...Stage-1-X50-TT

 

Just for information, I did what you requested and discussed with Todd. Todd reconfirmed to me that K16s will go nowhere beyond the numbers I gave.

He did also say that there are cases where drag pros like M-Phibian and a couple of others we know about can defy the laws of trap speed calculators and the resulting HP from the calculations. But they are not defying the laws of physics, and extracting more HP from a K16, it is only due to the way the car is being driven and moment of inertia (dual mass flywheel etc..).

I have the exact calculations of why a K16 on a 996TT can't go beyond 510FWHP or so.

 

 

Well Jean, you definitely have a cheerleading squad. I'm still waiting for a trap speed from any 996tt by a European tuner. Anybody, anybody, show us a trap speed with any tuned 996tt in Europe.

 

9Eleven

And you can wait if you want, you might not find one. They don't drag race in general. Do you take this as a sign of incompetence or weakness from their part? Do so if you wish. The car, the ECU and most likely the program that you have in your car is European, if you drag race your car and get a trap speed reading, please post it and you will have posted a European trap speed. The same applies to my friend KPG who has a fantastic setup, it is a european upgrade program, so there you have a trap speed from Europe...

Remember, my engine is from a US tuner and I don't live or care about Europe, only my name is European, just like yours, so turning it this way makes no sense.

I have not seen anyone doubting the numbers you posted as far as performance is concerned, I have my opinion about the HP you are putting down, and you have another, which is perfectly fine. I certainly don't understand where this is going.

The Cheerleading squads usually go together with guys who want to be popular and not those who can be dry like me and say the things that no one wants to hear, so Rickard seems to support what he believes in and not people, which is entirely up to him. Do a search and you will see we don't often agree with each other him and I.

 

Well as much as I love and respect Todd, we're just going to have to agree to disagree on this one. My drag racing 'prowess' has nothing to do with me beating chipped X50's from a roll, or staying 1-2 car lengths behind 615 rwhp Cobras.

Crap...what started all of this in the first place? I forgot. Oh, that's right....it was 9eleven's HP figures. Ya, he's making 550.

Oh and Jean...I still love you too....you stubborn european.

 

You are right, 520FWHP is about correct

I am only half-bread european, the other half is the bad one

 

Okay…I looked at all of these numbers again, and I think I may have found where we all actually agree (amazing!).

9Eleven’s dyno shows 482 rwhp on a Dynojet. But when I enter his 127.6 mph Trap Speed and his weight into my calculator, I get 467.5 RWHP. Now, I trust my calculator much more than the Dynojet, so I think the Dynojet is reading about 15 rwhp high, which is typical for a Dynojet.

So I think (hope) we can all agree that his RWHP is 467. It takes that much power to move his car at it’s current weight (with him inside) through the traps at 127.6 mph.

Now, the problem (i.e., argument) is in the conversion from RWHP to FWHP. That’s where the debate lies.

I’ve been using 15% for drivetrain loss, which is what I’ve always used for RWD Porsche’s (and 20% for the AWD cars), but that may be a bit high. If drivetrain loss was indeed 15%, he would need 550 FWHP to give him 467 rwhp.

HOWEVER……if I use 12.5% like 9Eleven and EVOMS use, I get 533 FWHP needed to have 467 RWHP. And 533 FWHP seems to be believable to everyone here.

This is one reason why I hate dealing with FWHP. Unless an engine dyno is used, you always have to convert from RWHP or AWHP. And if the conversion factor is wrong, the FWHP number ends up wrong. I like sticking to HP at the wheels. It’s so much simpler to work with, and is truthfully all that really matters since it’s what propels the car forward.

Now...one thing it doesn't explain, is my Stage 2 car trapping 126. It would have absolutely, positively needed at least 470 AWHP at 3,550 lbs to Trap that MPH. So either the car was making 570 FWHP with 17.5% AWD drivetrain loss, or it was only making 510 FWHP with 8% AWD drivetrain loss.

 

You don´t seem to get it, here in Europe we don´t dragrace as much as in the US and the Porsche people hardly do it at all, here the porsche people drive the car at the track not the strip

 

So true..

Im not a cheerleeder of Jean but this time he has right, not so often but this time....And im a stupid swede so i have a hard time to explain what i mean sometimes in Englisch that was why i was happy ablut what Jean wrote, he put the words inmy mouth...

I think we should take this discussions in Swedich in stead then we will se...

 

We in the US do both. Makes for some very well-rounded drivers.

 

Yes i know, i have done alot of dragracing in the past

 

Scott,
that was the problem, it is the stupid conversion factor of dynos.
It is very difficult to pin down, and again although a little heated,
You, Jean, and the arrogant TB, add very much DATA and THOUGHT to this board and
it is much appreciated!!
As for your stage 2 car and trap speed, it appears to be an anomaly that NO ONE can reproduce.
(and this was before Todd touched your car I believe)
MK

 

Show us a timeslip with a trap speed.

 

Of my 8,67@167 in my street supra or what..?