Looking for Big Brake setup
06-13-2002, 12:52 AM
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Looking for Big Brake setup
Anyone know of the best big brake setups out there for the TT other than the GT3R setup?
Or is there any upgrade available for the existing standard brakes to significantly increase stopping power...IE: Brake lines, Calipers, pads, etc...
Thanks.
Or is there any upgrade available for the existing standard brakes to significantly increase stopping power...IE: Brake lines, Calipers, pads, etc...
Thanks.
06-13-2002, 10:08 AM
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the GT3R is not for a street car. It is for a long endurance race cars. and it is to heavy.
You want the 6 pot calipers from te new GT3 cup car. They are almost the same as in the new GT2 but not keramic.
they run 350 mm rotors. the rear is ok and do not need upgrade not even for the RING!
Konstantin
You want the 6 pot calipers from te new GT3 cup car. They are almost the same as in the new GT2 but not keramic.
they run 350 mm rotors. the rear is ok and do not need upgrade not even for the RING!
Konstantin
06-13-2002, 10:26 AM
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Thanks, where is a good source for them. Is it a Porsche MS part? Have a Part number?
Does it also have a Rear kit for it too?
Are the ceramic ones better?
<img src="confused.gif" border="0">
Does it also have a Rear kit for it too?
Are the ceramic ones better?
<img src="confused.gif" border="0">
06-13-2002, 05:58 PM
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I have had problems with overheating the standard 996 Turbo brakes at Nürburgring. As I write, the ceramic brakes should be being installed on my Turbo. It shall be interesting to discover the back-to-back differences between the two systems. I'm expecting no more overheating problems but let's see if that is what I get.
FWIW, my guess is that had I swapped the street pads for a slightly higher temp race set of pads then this would have completely solved the pad-fade problem.
There is an advantage to using the smallest brake system that is satisfactory. The bigger the brake rotor, the bigger the caliper the more unsprung weight you have. This is not good.
I find Greg's comments on not adding braided brake lines interesting. Initially I was going to do this on my car but was convinced to hold off. Now I will wait and see how it is once the ceramics are added. I haven't been too happy with the softness of the peddle and was thinking that this might be a solution. Instead, for the moment I am just going to upgrade to higher temp DOT4 brake fluid (useful I think on higher temp ceramic brakes).
I would think that 6-piston calipers would add to the soft feel.
S.
FWIW, my guess is that had I swapped the street pads for a slightly higher temp race set of pads then this would have completely solved the pad-fade problem.
There is an advantage to using the smallest brake system that is satisfactory. The bigger the brake rotor, the bigger the caliper the more unsprung weight you have. This is not good.
I find Greg's comments on not adding braided brake lines interesting. Initially I was going to do this on my car but was convinced to hold off. Now I will wait and see how it is once the ceramics are added. I haven't been too happy with the softness of the peddle and was thinking that this might be a solution. Instead, for the moment I am just going to upgrade to higher temp DOT4 brake fluid (useful I think on higher temp ceramic brakes).
I would think that 6-piston calipers would add to the soft feel.
S.
06-13-2002, 06:37 PM
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Hi Shank,
I was fortunate enough to have been able to, and to have, ordered the PCCB's during the few months that they were available from the factory as an option on the 2001 model (this was in Europe, they were never available in North America).
Of course, the car came through with steel brakes and a letter promising to fit the PCCB's when available. I've been pushing them and now Porsche has agreed to provide the brakes for my car. Supposedly I will be the first in Belgium though I've seen/heard of one or two German Turbos with them. (I got them by destroying the brakes I had and then demanding that they either give me the PCCB's now or replace everything under warranty.)
I'm in Connecticut at the moment so I don't have my records at hand but if I recall correctly the option price was about €5800 excluding VAT.
I think only a very special customer could get these off the shelf from Porsche. There are more than a few people in Europe who are owed them and obviously they are having trouble meeting even this commitment. It took a lot of pressure by me and my dealer to get these. In fact, I worry what will happen if I ever need replacement parts.
I don't know exactly whether they are identical to the GT2 PCCB's. I've heard that the install kit is a slightly different kit. But whether this means that they aren't 6-piston I don't know.
6-piston or not, I'll be satisfied if they can take all of the heat I can put into them and keep on working. That's the test as far as I'm concerned. Of course, what happens when the temperatures go through the roof is the next question. I'm guessing that the ultimate limit will become the temperature of boiling brake fluid but we'll see.
I'm pretty excited to get back to Belgium and test them out!
S.
I was fortunate enough to have been able to, and to have, ordered the PCCB's during the few months that they were available from the factory as an option on the 2001 model (this was in Europe, they were never available in North America).
Of course, the car came through with steel brakes and a letter promising to fit the PCCB's when available. I've been pushing them and now Porsche has agreed to provide the brakes for my car. Supposedly I will be the first in Belgium though I've seen/heard of one or two German Turbos with them. (I got them by destroying the brakes I had and then demanding that they either give me the PCCB's now or replace everything under warranty.)
I'm in Connecticut at the moment so I don't have my records at hand but if I recall correctly the option price was about €5800 excluding VAT.
I think only a very special customer could get these off the shelf from Porsche. There are more than a few people in Europe who are owed them and obviously they are having trouble meeting even this commitment. It took a lot of pressure by me and my dealer to get these. In fact, I worry what will happen if I ever need replacement parts.
I don't know exactly whether they are identical to the GT2 PCCB's. I've heard that the install kit is a slightly different kit. But whether this means that they aren't 6-piston I don't know.
6-piston or not, I'll be satisfied if they can take all of the heat I can put into them and keep on working. That's the test as far as I'm concerned. Of course, what happens when the temperatures go through the roof is the next question. I'm guessing that the ultimate limit will become the temperature of boiling brake fluid but we'll see.
I'm pretty excited to get back to Belgium and test them out!
S.
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06-13-2002, 10:05 PM
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@FixedWing
the solution to your problem is easy and it is called: get the brake cooling ducts that the cup car has. You do not need bigger brakes you need a better cooling the smae problem had the GT3 too.
nobody needs bigger brakes than the new cup car.
there is a reason why Porsche install these in teh arce car and not the keramic PCCB.
Otherwise check cjv post . they tend to crack. Maybe Porsche solved teh Problem now but I never heard of this. Lats time we testetd both the PCCB and the 996 TT brakes both were the same but whne the were hot the PCCB was better. No in braking performance but in fading resistance.
@ shank
you can get the race brakes only through a race team. they are no available now as Porsche couldn't make so many. or you can try <a href="http://www.movit.de" target="_blank">www.movit.de</a> they may have them but expensive.
I think we will have them in 1 month but I can not promise that.
Konstantin
the solution to your problem is easy and it is called: get the brake cooling ducts that the cup car has. You do not need bigger brakes you need a better cooling the smae problem had the GT3 too.
nobody needs bigger brakes than the new cup car.
there is a reason why Porsche install these in teh arce car and not the keramic PCCB.
Otherwise check cjv post . they tend to crack. Maybe Porsche solved teh Problem now but I never heard of this. Lats time we testetd both the PCCB and the 996 TT brakes both were the same but whne the were hot the PCCB was better. No in braking performance but in fading resistance.
@ shank
you can get the race brakes only through a race team. they are no available now as Porsche couldn't make so many. or you can try <a href="http://www.movit.de" target="_blank">www.movit.de</a> they may have them but expensive.
I think we will have them in 1 month but I can not promise that.
Konstantin
06-14-2002, 01:03 AM
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[quote]Originally posted by cjv:
<strong>Shank, The Racers Group installed my GT3R brakes. They were obtain from TRG through Race Technologies. <a href="http://www.racetechnologies.com" target="_blank">www.racetechnologies.com</a>
<img src="graemlins/icon501.gif" border="0" alt="[icon501]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>
CJV, didn't they have difficulties installing that? Also, I understand it was an expensive experience. If you were to do it all over again, what would you do about brakes.
Thanks
<strong>Shank, The Racers Group installed my GT3R brakes. They were obtain from TRG through Race Technologies. <a href="http://www.racetechnologies.com" target="_blank">www.racetechnologies.com</a>
<img src="graemlins/icon501.gif" border="0" alt="[icon501]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>
CJV, didn't they have difficulties installing that? Also, I understand it was an expensive experience. If you were to do it all over again, what would you do about brakes.
Thanks
06-14-2002, 01:34 AM
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FixedWing said a bunch when he talked about fade at the Ring! I changed to Pagid Yellow pads on my Turbo R for a particular Texas road race where I had 122 turns,many requiring very hard braking from very high speeds.The road coarse was 120 miles and certain turns required slowing from 200+ to 115 very quickly. The Pagid pads did the job for my purposes!
06-14-2002, 10:05 AM
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[quote]Originally posted by cjv:
<strong>Ask Andreas, what he thinks of the stopping power of this car? He drives a modified 996tt. I believe he will tell you something like....this is the only car I have ever been in where the braking power has left my stomach behind.
<img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>
Yes, Andreas told me that he almost threw up from the stopping power and that his stomach twisted
As per Konstantin's link, I contacted MOVEIT.com, and this is what they have:
For the 996 turbo, Movit has 380x32 kit to work with modified 996tt calipers or new 40/44mm 2pc calipers (stock is 36/44) for $4295.00. A
6-piston setup is probably available but cost will be around $6000. SD
Wonder how much installation is. I also requested pictures from them.
<strong>Ask Andreas, what he thinks of the stopping power of this car? He drives a modified 996tt. I believe he will tell you something like....this is the only car I have ever been in where the braking power has left my stomach behind.
<img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>
Yes, Andreas told me that he almost threw up from the stopping power and that his stomach twisted
As per Konstantin's link, I contacted MOVEIT.com, and this is what they have:
For the 996 turbo, Movit has 380x32 kit to work with modified 996tt calipers or new 40/44mm 2pc calipers (stock is 36/44) for $4295.00. A
6-piston setup is probably available but cost will be around $6000. SD
Wonder how much installation is. I also requested pictures from them.
06-14-2002, 12:31 PM
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[quote]Originally posted by Roland:
<strong>FixedWing said a bunch when he talked about fade at the Ring! I changed to Pagid Yellow pads on my Turbo R for a particular Texas road race where I had 122 turns,many requiring very hard braking from very high speeds.The road coarse was 120 miles and certain turns required slowing from 200+ to 115 very quickly. The Pagid pads did the job for my purposes!</strong><hr></blockquote>
hi local
are you doing that texas race again this year? or any of the nevada races?
<strong>FixedWing said a bunch when he talked about fade at the Ring! I changed to Pagid Yellow pads on my Turbo R for a particular Texas road race where I had 122 turns,many requiring very hard braking from very high speeds.The road coarse was 120 miles and certain turns required slowing from 200+ to 115 very quickly. The Pagid pads did the job for my purposes!</strong><hr></blockquote>
hi local
are you doing that texas race again this year? or any of the nevada races?
06-14-2002, 02:50 PM
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Howdy Local,
We are running at Wendover Nevada next week! Go to openroadracing.com & check it out! I will probably target 170 average for that one since I am running solo without navigator!
We will also run @ Battle mountain & Elko in July and August. The Battle mountain event is really cool. CJV will be joining us soon.
R
We are running at Wendover Nevada next week! Go to openroadracing.com & check it out! I will probably target 170 average for that one since I am running solo without navigator!
We will also run @ Battle mountain & Elko in July and August. The Battle mountain event is really cool. CJV will be joining us soon.
R
06-14-2002, 04:11 PM
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[quote]Originally posted by Konstantin:
<strong>@FixedWing
the solution to your problem is easy and it is called: get the brake cooling ducts that the cup car has. You do not need bigger brakes you need a better cooling the smae problem had the GT3 too.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I do think you have a point Konstantin though I am also aware that the brake cooling problem was somewhat fixed by Porsche after the original GT3 which clearly had a big brake cooling problem. Also, I'm not sure how easy it would be to add this to a Turbo with its less available frontal area.
For me, pad fade wasn't yet a major problem though obviously it was going to get worse as I improved. For the moment at least I do think better pads would have done the trick. I was really quite surprised when I experienced this.
I think I would counsel anyone to stay with the original setup until they had a good reason to change it. If brake fade is not a problem then I just don't see the point. All you are doing is increasing the unsprung weight on the car (except in the case of ceramics which obviously decrease unsprung weight -- probably their single biggest benefit).
S.
<strong>@FixedWing
the solution to your problem is easy and it is called: get the brake cooling ducts that the cup car has. You do not need bigger brakes you need a better cooling the smae problem had the GT3 too.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I do think you have a point Konstantin though I am also aware that the brake cooling problem was somewhat fixed by Porsche after the original GT3 which clearly had a big brake cooling problem. Also, I'm not sure how easy it would be to add this to a Turbo with its less available frontal area.
For me, pad fade wasn't yet a major problem though obviously it was going to get worse as I improved. For the moment at least I do think better pads would have done the trick. I was really quite surprised when I experienced this.
I think I would counsel anyone to stay with the original setup until they had a good reason to change it. If brake fade is not a problem then I just don't see the point. All you are doing is increasing the unsprung weight on the car (except in the case of ceramics which obviously decrease unsprung weight -- probably their single biggest benefit).
S.