John D II

The strane thing is, not all RUF exhausts sound like this. Some do and some don't.....mine does not. I recall Jack saying that only certain peoples cars made this sound and nobody was certain why. Tip angle was a possibility discussed.

PorschePhD

You are correct John. They are all opened up and modified and the original baffles are removed and changed. It wouldn't take anything other than a different angle to create a different flow thus causing a different sound. The one I tested was like stock with a different growl. Others have complained they were too loud and sold. So they can be different.

Oak

John, thank you for the link. Yes, that is true not all the Ruf have this sound at WOT. I have had both types of Ruf's and the first set did not make this sound. Both had no resonance and virtually sounded nearly stock slightly deeper in tone, and sounded nearly indentical at idle and normal drives, but at WOT one had the large roar while the other had the scream. Both looked indentical from the exterior.

sharkster

Over the past year when I was at the shop we installed every single type of exhaust and did multiple dynos on them too... I will say one thing (ok maybe a couple), the ONLY two that did not resonate (and especially on Tips) was the Europipe Quiet Stage II and the RuF Exhausts. Both made gobs of power on the dyno over the stock exhausts also. Every other exhaust had "higher" levels of resonance that would bother certain people more than it did others. If someone came in asking me for advice on an exhaust and brought up the words "worried about resonance" then those are the two I would always recommend and that way avoid any possibility of people being unhappy and having to change only a couple of weeks later. The Tiptronic has a good bit more resonance due to the RPMs on the freeway and those were the only two to pass a long list of customers

No affiliation or anything just sharing my experiences....

Oak

sharky, my experience's have been similar. to incinuate the ruf makes no power or lose power is not correct. Almost makes one think there maybe an agenda.

Jean

I don't know about RUF, but I know that Cargraphic exhausts are developped by RS Tuning with extensive dyno sessions, and they have proved to be the most efficient on 993TTs. RS Tuning is definitely up there with RUF to say it conservatively. The quieter the exhaust, the less drone and resonance obviously, however most often than not, the more backpressure.

Oak

jean, seems like more power = more noise. I think of Ruf as a custom tuner manufacturor, building cars to higher much more stringent TUV standards. RS is a tuner more geared towards track/racing. Both cross over into a fine grey area street/track. Hard to really compare them as equals.

sharkster

Of the five RuF exhausts we put on TT's we dynod three of them and everytime it did make power. Based on how quiet it was I was suprised at how much HP and TQ actually. I'd be using it myself if I wasn't such a wally and always looking to save weight (hence my ghetto straight pipes lol). When I grow up I think I'll do one or the Europipe.... I believe CJV was using it until he figured out more power was made with the Europipe (down low especially).

Oak

Sharky, The weight of the Ruf is much heavier than the Cargraphics, I was surprised at the weight difference. I understand the weight thing, you can really go overboard. Before you know it you have a car you hate to drive on the street! It's hard to remain pragmatic once you start to chase it.

That was my main appeal towards the Ruf. Stock sound at idle and normal driving very minimal to no resonance. The Cargraphic definatley made power but it seemed like way up top, out of the optimal torque range of the turbo engine. Where as the Ruf made the power low-mid range where the turbo engine makes the most torque. With the Cargraphic exhaust it seemed like I had to over rev the engine to keep torque up and boost up, but felt like the torquepower was out of optimal range of the engine.

sharkster

I know what you mean. Let's face it, I've been absolutely sensible about my "Tip" from day one- NOT! Every few days I think to myself why didn't I get a GT2 or a 6speed or.... just a race car instead of butchering my own Then again I realize I make no sense to myself. I've got a few more silly goals with the Tip before I think I seriously will pull back some of the crazyiness on it and the first thing will be to get my hearing back, loose the flames and go back to my wife enjoying a conversation in the car again

In fact, I've already been eyeing a couple of take offs in the form of RuF and/or Europipe. It's not like I can't change that stuff out for the straight pipes in an hour or two anyways

omega

have europipe loud and s cargo headers sounds great ... not to loud ever went for the lager headers as i remember i my have gained a little lag but was afraid rod damage with the smaller ones any coment ??? THANKS STEVE

Jean

Oak,

your comments make a lot of sense concerning the exhaust. I just thought I should highlight that while RS is maybe the number 1 Porsche race builders in the world, they also have a large percentage of their business related to street cars and hence TUV approved. Cargraphic is only "one" of their long standing partners, you would be surprised to know that many tuners go to RS for the development of their packages.

All of these racing houses realized that they need to diversify and increase their margins to survive. Manthey is another example with the creation of Manthey Motors, a spin-off of Manthey Racing.

The specific unit that Stephen tested seems to have yielded negative results, it happens with the best exhaust builders too, it can also be a function of what other components it was used with.

clubrcr

Maybe ever car is different, but my cargraphic exhaust helps make power in the lower range of the RPMs. I haven't had motor on a dyno, but have had the Fabspeed Loud, stock and now the cargraphic. This exhaust seems to bring the car alive. The car spools ups a lot sooner (of course with the 100 cell cats and less back pressure) and seems to bring power and full boost on with having to run the revs up too high. It makes driving the car in traffic a lot more fun.

I think the resonance/drone is very subjective, but this exhaust, for the money, and worksmanship is up there with the best.

PorschePhD

Oak, you think everyone has an agenda. Amazing! Honestly I take offense to the comment based on the amount I help and expect nothing in return. To suggest I have an agenda is irresponsible and plain wrong. I have spent a lot of time testing and pulling data on products of all sorts. I can sell Ruf, in fact I sell some of their products. I will not sell their muffler..modify your own stock unit for a lot less. There are also others I sell that I will not sell their TT exhaust either. My suggestions come from data, not something pulled from the sky or a butt dyno.

I stand corrected that the peak number on the dynos I have on this computer show a 3 HP gain and a loss in TQ by 6. What should be noted is this is the trend of the charts with the RUF. The peak up top and the low in the middle compared to the stock muffler. It shows a strange air flow in the system that does not pass until the air thins out. I have other dynos I can post when I get to the office.

As I said before if you or Alex have different results then please by all means post the dyno sheets so that collective data can be taken. In fact I will rerun the test again on our Mustang and post the results. You want to help by sending yours in? Again, fly up here and we can do it together so you can be present.


Here is a stock muffler base

Red Comet

I've been on the fence for months now trying to decide between the Cargraphic and Europipe exhausts. I've been told the Europipe makes lots of power down low, how does the Cargraphic perform?

Would any issues arise from running a stock or Stage 2 car without cats (http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/s...hreadid=27852)?

Thanks!