Need help on a tire question *updated*
06-30-2010, 11:33 PM
#16
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07-01-2010, 01:03 AM
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07-01-2010, 02:03 AM
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you must have less than 3 deg of camber to cord on the outside?
07-01-2010, 10:22 AM
#20
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I bet you could manage 6 DE days @ 4 to 5 HC a day on a set of Hoosiers, IF you broke them in properly and managed them carefully throughout their on-track life. Breaking them in properly means running one partial session on them, slowish at first then getting up to speed and doing one fast lap (4-5 laps) then taking them off the car and storing them for a minimum 24 hours (preferably more...like the next race weekend), in a relatively cool area, away from the sun. Store them off the car between weekends and store them inside, again out of the sun.
This of course means an extra set of wheels at the track every time you need to break in a new set.
Although I never tried to get extra days out of them, I did find this break-in method kept the tires a LOT more consistent during a 35-40 minute race and made for a faster set at the end of their pre-determined (by me) life.
So that's, what - 24 to 30 heat cycles? I bet it's doable but they'll be toast at the end.
My typical Hoosier usage is: Saturday, break in a new set and take them off, set aside. Bolt on the previous weekend's Sunday race set and practice/qualify. Bolt on the previous weekend's Saturday broken-in set and race. Sunday, practice on the Saturday practice/qualify tires, qualify and race on the Saturday race tires. This set then becomes the next weekend's Saturday qual/race set. Not exactly budget friendly (was a lot better when Hoosier had that great NASA contingency) - and not what I'd do for a DE - but it's fast! - Basically one set a weekend, but three sets in constant rotation, then they are done, sold to a DE guy if I can.
This of course means an extra set of wheels at the track every time you need to break in a new set.
Although I never tried to get extra days out of them, I did find this break-in method kept the tires a LOT more consistent during a 35-40 minute race and made for a faster set at the end of their pre-determined (by me) life.
So that's, what - 24 to 30 heat cycles? I bet it's doable but they'll be toast at the end.
My typical Hoosier usage is: Saturday, break in a new set and take them off, set aside. Bolt on the previous weekend's Sunday race set and practice/qualify. Bolt on the previous weekend's Saturday broken-in set and race. Sunday, practice on the Saturday practice/qualify tires, qualify and race on the Saturday race tires. This set then becomes the next weekend's Saturday qual/race set. Not exactly budget friendly (was a lot better when Hoosier had that great NASA contingency) - and not what I'd do for a DE - but it's fast! - Basically one set a weekend, but three sets in constant rotation, then they are done, sold to a DE guy if I can.
Last edited by SRL; 07-01-2010 at 10:40 AM.
07-01-2010, 11:16 AM
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All right guys, great responses. I do appreciate it. The issue was I needed a new rear wheel and if I was ever going to go up to 315's and probably Hoosier's, now was the time.
If I took good notes you guys get:
SRL 6-7 days
Allan J 5-7
996 FLT 4
Mooty 5
PJS996 3-4
Lets call it 5 maybe 6 days or 25 heat cycles and Hoosiers are done one way or the other. That is basically $250+ per day for Hoosier's.
All I have ever run is MPSC. My alignment is spot on and I never cord a shoulder or anything, they just eventually lost too much grip.
I run them 15 days +/- depending on how the schedule goes. That is at least 60 heat cycles. Yes, way past "prime" but they have tread and I make them work. I believe after 8 days I can see the drop in performance but it is gradual.
To put it into dollars, MPSC's cost me $85 a day. Basically Hoosiers would cost me $5000 more a summer doing 30 days.
I believe I have my answer.
Point-bys for Hoosier's; I'll buy you guys lunch unless like Mooty, you are all addicted to Ramen for lunch.
Thanks gents,
Dennis
If I took good notes you guys get:
SRL 6-7 days
Allan J 5-7
996 FLT 4
Mooty 5
PJS996 3-4
Lets call it 5 maybe 6 days or 25 heat cycles and Hoosiers are done one way or the other. That is basically $250+ per day for Hoosier's.
All I have ever run is MPSC. My alignment is spot on and I never cord a shoulder or anything, they just eventually lost too much grip.
I run them 15 days +/- depending on how the schedule goes. That is at least 60 heat cycles. Yes, way past "prime" but they have tread and I make them work. I believe after 8 days I can see the drop in performance but it is gradual.
To put it into dollars, MPSC's cost me $85 a day. Basically Hoosiers would cost me $5000 more a summer doing 30 days.
I believe I have my answer.
Point-bys for Hoosier's; I'll buy you guys lunch unless like Mooty, you are all addicted to Ramen for lunch.
Thanks gents,
Dennis
07-01-2010, 12:32 PM
#23
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All right guys, great responses. I do appreciate it. The issue was I needed a new rear wheel and if I was ever going to go up to 315's and probably Hoosier's, now was the time.
If I took good notes you guys get:
SRL 6-7 days
Allan J 5-7
996 FLT 4
Mooty 5
PJS996 3-4
Lets call it 5 maybe 6 days or 25 heat cycles and Hoosiers are done one way or the other. That is basically $250+ per day for Hoosier's.
All I have ever run is MPSC. My alignment is spot on and I never cord a shoulder or anything, they just eventually lost too much grip.
I run them 15 days +/- depending on how the schedule goes. That is at least 60 heat cycles. Yes, way past "prime" but they have tread and I make them work. I believe after 8 days I can see the drop in performance but it is gradual.
To put it into dollars, MPSC's cost me $85 a day. Basically Hoosiers would cost me $5000 more a summer doing 30 days.
I believe I have my answer.
Point-bys for Hoosier's; I'll buy you guys lunch unless like Mooty, you are all addicted to Ramen for lunch.
Thanks gents,
Dennis
If I took good notes you guys get:
SRL 6-7 days
Allan J 5-7
996 FLT 4
Mooty 5
PJS996 3-4
Lets call it 5 maybe 6 days or 25 heat cycles and Hoosiers are done one way or the other. That is basically $250+ per day for Hoosier's.
All I have ever run is MPSC. My alignment is spot on and I never cord a shoulder or anything, they just eventually lost too much grip.
I run them 15 days +/- depending on how the schedule goes. That is at least 60 heat cycles. Yes, way past "prime" but they have tread and I make them work. I believe after 8 days I can see the drop in performance but it is gradual.
To put it into dollars, MPSC's cost me $85 a day. Basically Hoosiers would cost me $5000 more a summer doing 30 days.
I believe I have my answer.
Point-bys for Hoosier's; I'll buy you guys lunch unless like Mooty, you are all addicted to Ramen for lunch.
Thanks gents,
Dennis
i am faster with nitto or khumo than mpsc (though some argue mpsc is stickier, not for me)
07-01-2010, 12:56 PM
#25
I have a set of MPSC with 12 heat cycles and I agree with the others, they've fallen off dramatically (even though I'm not to cords yet). next up will be a set of NT-01's in 245/315, MPSC's are stock sizes.
07-01-2010, 01:15 PM
#26
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All right guys, great responses. I do appreciate it. The issue was I needed a new rear wheel and if I was ever going to go up to 315's and probably Hoosier's, now was the time.
If I took good notes you guys get:
SRL 6-7 days
Allan J 5-7
996 FLT 4
Mooty 5
PJS996 3-4
Lets call it 5 maybe 6 days or 25 heat cycles and Hoosiers are done one way or the other. That is basically $250+ per day for Hoosier's.
All I have ever run is MPSC. My alignment is spot on and I never cord a shoulder or anything, they just eventually lost too much grip.
I run them 15 days +/- depending on how the schedule goes. That is at least 60 heat cycles. Yes, way past "prime" but they have tread and I make them work. I believe after 8 days I can see the drop in performance but it is gradual.
To put it into dollars, MPSC's cost me $85 a day. Basically Hoosiers would cost me $5000 more a summer doing 30 days.
I believe I have my answer.
Point-bys for Hoosier's; I'll buy you guys lunch unless like Mooty, you are all addicted to Ramen for lunch.
Thanks gents,
Dennis
If I took good notes you guys get:
SRL 6-7 days
Allan J 5-7
996 FLT 4
Mooty 5
PJS996 3-4
Lets call it 5 maybe 6 days or 25 heat cycles and Hoosiers are done one way or the other. That is basically $250+ per day for Hoosier's.
All I have ever run is MPSC. My alignment is spot on and I never cord a shoulder or anything, they just eventually lost too much grip.
I run them 15 days +/- depending on how the schedule goes. That is at least 60 heat cycles. Yes, way past "prime" but they have tread and I make them work. I believe after 8 days I can see the drop in performance but it is gradual.
To put it into dollars, MPSC's cost me $85 a day. Basically Hoosiers would cost me $5000 more a summer doing 30 days.
I believe I have my answer.
Point-bys for Hoosier's; I'll buy you guys lunch unless like Mooty, you are all addicted to Ramen for lunch.
Thanks gents,
Dennis
Cheaper than michelin heatcycle well forgiving better in wet.
John
07-01-2010, 02:18 PM
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Okay, you guys are making me waffle a bit here now. The 888's do not have the grip of the MPSC and ultimately neither do the NT-01's, I suspect if we talk same sizing.
What is different here now though is you have all succeeded in making me consider a 12" replacement rim so I could do 315 rears from maybe NT-01, Khumo or Hoosier.
Why I am even considering this now is this:
Even if the NT-01 (and 888) are less grippy of a compound than MPSC I am thinking maybe the shift up from 295 to 315 offsets that some, if not completely (??)
So, there is now a bit of a new question on the table. Does 4 MPSC's in stock sizes feel better then a set of NT-01's in 245/315 sizing?
Interesting.
If they are close, the NT's are $100 cheaper than Michelin's and perhaps with that combo on 12' rears I could take a look at a set of Hoosiers a season.....NO MORE!!!
My wheel order has to go in today so I need to pull the trigger here. One last question:
Has anyone run a 295 MPSC on a 12" wheel?
Thanks
What is different here now though is you have all succeeded in making me consider a 12" replacement rim so I could do 315 rears from maybe NT-01, Khumo or Hoosier.
Why I am even considering this now is this:
Even if the NT-01 (and 888) are less grippy of a compound than MPSC I am thinking maybe the shift up from 295 to 315 offsets that some, if not completely (??)
So, there is now a bit of a new question on the table. Does 4 MPSC's in stock sizes feel better then a set of NT-01's in 245/315 sizing?
Interesting.
If they are close, the NT's are $100 cheaper than Michelin's and perhaps with that combo on 12' rears I could take a look at a set of Hoosiers a season.....NO MORE!!!
My wheel order has to go in today so I need to pull the trigger here. One last question:
Has anyone run a 295 MPSC on a 12" wheel?
Thanks
07-01-2010, 02:25 PM
#29
i cannot give too much input on the wheel sizes etc but i will share my experiences (apologize this doesnt directly answer your questoins):
i run stock gt3 wheels and 245/315 NT01 combo and love it. i've also tried 245/305 RA1 combo and R888s and both were awesome! grippy, long life as i could never heat cycle them to death just run to cord with amazing grip, cheap entry price, what more can you ask for?
based on my experiences when i tried the 235/295 MPSCs, they were NOT any grippier (not that i could tell) than NT01, RA1, R888. i dont know if that's because of the smaller size when compared to the other tires? for me, i could never really get that sweet spot with them. they also didnt last as long, they started to lose grip after some time as if there were just too many HCs on them, and the entry price was quite a bit more.
no brainer for a budget guy like me
i run stock gt3 wheels and 245/315 NT01 combo and love it. i've also tried 245/305 RA1 combo and R888s and both were awesome! grippy, long life as i could never heat cycle them to death just run to cord with amazing grip, cheap entry price, what more can you ask for?
based on my experiences when i tried the 235/295 MPSCs, they were NOT any grippier (not that i could tell) than NT01, RA1, R888. i dont know if that's because of the smaller size when compared to the other tires? for me, i could never really get that sweet spot with them. they also didnt last as long, they started to lose grip after some time as if there were just too many HCs on them, and the entry price was quite a bit more.
no brainer for a budget guy like me
07-01-2010, 02:31 PM
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[edit: Re 888 vs NT-01: Searching archives usually reveals more positive reviews of NT-01 vs 888. 888 needs to be shaved otherwise deal with squirmy tread at the start. However, 888 should be better in the wet. I dunno, in wet use Yoko AD08....]
Last edited by AllanJ; 07-01-2010 at 02:34 PM. Reason: added 888 vs NT-01 blurb