mooty

bora, you might know better, but i can't get any bimmer to have the pedal feel of a p car?

for now the e36m3 will stock caliber, what pads do you suggest (track use only). later i may move AP caliber. thoughts?

bora

John

With the sliding calipers, it is hard but not impossible to get the pedal feel of a P-car.

I would use the solid guide bushings from bimmerworld, stainless steel lines
and run the PF97 pads front and rear. If you can't find PF97, then I guess their PF01 compound would do as well.

You do have to keep the solid bushings well lubricated.

https://secure5.nexternal.com/shared...&RowID=46&All=

I still can't get over how wonderful the pedal is in the GT3, I don't know how much of it is the PCCBs, but it is the pest pedal I have ever used.
Very short travel and modulated by pressure. Just perfect.

Bora

ben in lj

"I still can't get over how wonderful the pedal is in the GT3, I don't know how much of it is the PCCBs, but it is the pest pedal I have ever used.
Very short travel and modulated by pressure. Just perfect."

you're gonna think i'm on drugs, but my friend ("SPR") recently upgraded the brakes on the front only of his 99 C2 to stoptechs and they honestly feel as good as the PCCBs in my CGT and the ceramics in my old Stradale. the feel, the bite, etc really surprised hell out of me, and they were cheap. only downside is they squeak whereas the CGT and CS don't.

bora

Stoptechs are great. I keep pestering about making a rear PCCB replacement kit
for the GT3, but they say the market is too small.

I don't know if the Turbo Stoptech four wheel kit fits the GT3, but their stuff is really nice.

ben in lj

well that is probably true owing to much better heat properties of the carbon. another data point, his fronts were smoking (almost consider the term "heavily" to be appropriate) the other day after spirited mountain driving but he reported no fade. not sure which set up he has but the calipers "barely" cleared his 18" carrera 5 spokes.

skl

I had a E46 M3 with SMG2 before the GT3, having had several 911's before that. The M3 is a great car for the money, but it isn't a 911- as mentioned above, it's like comparing apples and oranges. I got tired of the SMG after a couple months and was longing for the 6 speed again. Sure the GT3 is somewhat raw, but what a kick. BTW, I also race a spec Miata in SCCA. It handles great, but sure could use more power , especially after getting out of the Porsche! I just afraid to put the Porsche out on the track with a lot of traffic considering the investment, but I just installed the "real" seats and a techequipment bar with Schroth belts, so I guess it's inevitable...

///Mous3

With respect I will say that, you are not getting twice the car by paying double. E46 M3 is out-the-door, a little under US$60,000 where as a GT3 is almost double (or even more to those with deeper pockets)

Saying that the E46 M3 feels like a SUV after driving a 996 GT3 does sounds like a sales pitch AND in my opinion, more of a self-assurance.

Both cars are capable of well beyond the talents "most" drivers have. Even at the stock trim; period.

P.S. Have you guys seen Top Gear comparison between 996 GT3 RS and Modena Stradale?

Now, THAT'S a fair comparison.

frayed

The fact that an E46 M3 and a GT3 provide a performance envelope beyond the grasp of many drivers is likely true. However, that fact is completely independent of what some have stated here: The M3 feels like the heavy GT car it truly is; the subjective driving experiences b/t the two cars are worlds apart.

As a long time BMW owner and former BMW loyalist, I was hoping the E46 M3 was the proper spiritual successor to the E36. Since it wasn't, I didn't buy one. I'm assured that the next gen M3 (E90) will continue the theme; it'll be larger, heavier, more powerful, and provide an even more distant driving experience. It'll eat brakes and tires like candy with any sort of track use, and the new V8 will have teething problems.

ben in lj

oh "the price" argument which is always introduced when all else has failed. i thought only those lame a## auto magazines dinged cars for that in their comparisons. that's almost as bad as the time one of those rags picked the M3 in the sports car comparison because it had back seats and a trunk.

ps. don't know what happened at top gear, but i've seen considerable comparsion between the base GT3 and stradale along with a bunch of people who own both and have had both at the track, and the regular GT3 hangs (if not more) right with the stradale.

ben in lj

yep, each iteration gets more and more "GT"'d. something similar occurs with 911s though too - unless you get one of the GTX offerings.

frayed

While I agree, while I'm new to Porsche, and despite all the whinings about dry sump this, wet sump that, PSM this, PSM that, my thought is that Porsche still 'gets it.' The GT3 proves that (in spades), and I think the the upcoming C7S will prove it again (I personally hold out hope for a clubsport/RS version).

BMW, on the other hand, has moved toward a market segment previously occupied by Benz (and Benz moving toward BMWs market segment).

When I bought my first BMW, the dealership was selling Tshirts with the slogan "Friends Don't Let Friends Drive Mercedes". Funny, I thought, and telling that discriminating enthusiasts clearly understood and appreciated the difference b/t the marques. These days, the difference is not so clear and the new cars are to me less engaging than the car they replace.

FWIW, I think the 997S rawks, and is more engaging than its predecessor. The same cannot be said of the M3.

Anyway, my apologies for the rambling, I guess I'm just trying to avoid my mountains of work in my office this morning.

mooty

i have had my share of M powered cars. they are wonderful however, imo, GT3 is more than 2x the car e46m3 is. the stock suspension, steering feel and pedal feel alone is worth the difference in price.

frayed, you are right that bmw is moving to mass mkt and getting soft as we can see from e30 to e36 to e46 and the original m5 to the e39m5. but as much as i love porsches, they are getting fat and lazy too. 996 (non gtx) are not nearly as raw as 964's or the older 3.2L or SC.... maybe we should all start buying older cars ;-)

ben in lj

[QUOTE=frayed]While I agree, while I'm new to Porsche, and despite all the whinings about dry sump this, wet sump that, PSM this, PSM that, my thought is that Porsche still 'gets it.' The GT3 proves that (in spades), and I think the the upcoming C7S will prove it again (I personally hold out hope for a clubsport/RS version)./QUOTE]

as i said "unless you get one of the GTX offerings". btw, that the GT3 IS one of the GTX offerings merely proves that statement correct but doesn't negate the GT statements made about non-GTX offerings.

frayed

Hey, no argument here. I'm here learning the ropes in a C2 while gleaning what I can from all the GT3 owners' experiences.

bora

Having owned and driven all three generation M3s, the only M3 that compares with
the GT3 is the first generation M3.

E46 M3 is a nice car, just not the car that GT3 is.