The Dark Side
08-23-2016, 10:49 PM
#16
As mentioned the 993 (and in general, classic car market) has peaked and some argue prices have started to decline. CNBC had an article on it today I believe, as a result of lower sales at Monterey. Might as well cash out if you really want a 996, given they seem to have plateaued.
08-24-2016, 09:18 AM
#17
Race Director
Forget the 997.1 (unless you like the looks) and stay with the 996. The 997.1 isn't out of the IMS woods and it is heavier and the interior is tacky compared to the more classic analog look of the 996.
Its all about your budget. When it comes to the IMS replacement, it is as much about who does it as it is about doing it at all. Early 99-2000 models have the smaller duel row bearing which has a lower failure rate...then there is the middle generation from 02 to 04 that has the second generation and is the source of most failures (still a small number over all)...then the 05 to 08 997.1 which after mid to late 05 have the third generation which is about as failure free as the early ones.
For a road car the 996 is great...light, agile, and it has a spare tire so you won't be stuck waiting for the flat bed and playing with a can of sealant. None of the 997s have spares so it is risk management time.
997.2s are not trouble free but I have been told by a well known shop that if you go that way, stay with the 09 and avoid the later ones.
If you are going to be spending 997.2 money...or even 997.1 money...look at a 996 tt...a great engine without the IMS issue, tons of fun/power...etc, etc. However if you are working on a tighter budget then the first two years of 996s offer one of the best bangs for the buck on the planet. You won't be sorry. My own choice is the RWD rather than AWD (turbos are AWD...an exception), coupe over Cab...and I'm an having a very nice time with tiptronic. I might go back to a manual but I have no real complaints...you can even heal and toe a tip and blip the throttle on downshift. Honest.
Its all about your budget. When it comes to the IMS replacement, it is as much about who does it as it is about doing it at all. Early 99-2000 models have the smaller duel row bearing which has a lower failure rate...then there is the middle generation from 02 to 04 that has the second generation and is the source of most failures (still a small number over all)...then the 05 to 08 997.1 which after mid to late 05 have the third generation which is about as failure free as the early ones.
For a road car the 996 is great...light, agile, and it has a spare tire so you won't be stuck waiting for the flat bed and playing with a can of sealant. None of the 997s have spares so it is risk management time.
997.2s are not trouble free but I have been told by a well known shop that if you go that way, stay with the 09 and avoid the later ones.
If you are going to be spending 997.2 money...or even 997.1 money...look at a 996 tt...a great engine without the IMS issue, tons of fun/power...etc, etc. However if you are working on a tighter budget then the first two years of 996s offer one of the best bangs for the buck on the planet. You won't be sorry. My own choice is the RWD rather than AWD (turbos are AWD...an exception), coupe over Cab...and I'm an having a very nice time with tiptronic. I might go back to a manual but I have no real complaints...you can even heal and toe a tip and blip the throttle on downshift. Honest.
And I suggest a rule that if you quote "a well respected mechanic", you must name said individual. early 9A1s are better now? Who said this?
08-24-2016, 09:22 AM
#18
Race Director
More simple? Potentially. Depends how your 997 is optioned. They can be done quite simply without pasm or any of the electronic doodads.
As for size:
996 wheelbase: 92.6"
997 wheelbase: 92.5" to 92.9"
996 length: 174.5"
997 length: 174.2" to 177.1"
996 width: 69.6"
997 width: 69.7"
996 height: 51.4"
997 height: 50" to 52.2"
In other words, they are essentially identical in size.
As for size:
996 wheelbase: 92.6"
997 wheelbase: 92.5" to 92.9"
996 length: 174.5"
997 length: 174.2" to 177.1"
996 width: 69.6"
997 width: 69.7"
996 height: 51.4"
997 height: 50" to 52.2"
In other words, they are essentially identical in size.
08-24-2016, 10:49 AM
#20
OP,
If your priority lies in reliability and having a good ac system and other creature comforts, yet want to retain some of the raw nature and tossability of the aircooled models and at the same time want a tremendous value, I would look at the '99-01 models as long as you can tolerate the risks of owning one.
OTOH, if you're getting out of a 993 for max comfort, refinement, and touring, and would want to error on the safe side, I would shoot for a 997.2 with the DFI motor in it. They still have little issues here and there but not nearly enough compared ti the previous generations.
If you do the research, I think you will find that the 996 is very close in dimension to the 997.
Good luck on whatever you decide.
If your priority lies in reliability and having a good ac system and other creature comforts, yet want to retain some of the raw nature and tossability of the aircooled models and at the same time want a tremendous value, I would look at the '99-01 models as long as you can tolerate the risks of owning one.
OTOH, if you're getting out of a 993 for max comfort, refinement, and touring, and would want to error on the safe side, I would shoot for a 997.2 with the DFI motor in it. They still have little issues here and there but not nearly enough compared ti the previous generations.
If you do the research, I think you will find that the 996 is very close in dimension to the 997.
Good luck on whatever you decide.
08-24-2016, 11:01 AM
#22
Nordschleife Master
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To the OP, you have to ask yourself what would you gain by jumping to a 996. If it's the maintenance and reliability of the 993 that seriously concerns you, then jumping to a 996 won't solve these two core problems because you'll find that you're spending as much money in preventive maintenance (e.g. IMS, RMS, etc.) for the 996. As everyone knows, the value of the 993 is shooting out of the roof and although you have the less desirable cabriolet, it's still worth a nice chunk of change my friend. Have you ever thought of just holding onto it for value sake? I mean in 10 - 15 years, you could potentially see the value jump close to $100K. That would be a nice retirement, huh? Right now, it's not uncommon to find a decent Mk1 996 for under $20K, but remember, you'll more than likely spend $5,000 easily getting it to a point where you feel confident that it won't leave you stranded on the side of the road. I don't want to put anymore rennlist poison in your head, but the 993 was the last air cooled car; therefore, it will gain demand due to the numbers dwindling over time and when supply is low and demand is high, you'll be able to cash in some day. I leave you with one personal example, when I was a kid, my father's neighbor offered to sell his practically brand new 1977 Porsche Carrera Turbo for only $14,000. That was a lot of money back then and so my dad turned him down. Today, it's not uncommon to see '77 turbos sell for more than $150,000 at auction.
Cheers!
Cheers!
08-24-2016, 11:48 AM
#23
Rennlist Member
And while I'm equally annoyed that every post you make is critical, derogatory or negative, I am at least comforted by the fact that most of the time you don't bother coming out of your little hole.
08-24-2016, 11:52 AM
#25
Nordschleife Master
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Now I understand "Quadcammer Mode".
Slakker, ignore him... he's one of those kinds that gets a high off of sardonic comments.
Slakker, ignore him... he's one of those kinds that gets a high off of sardonic comments.
08-24-2016, 12:03 PM
#26
08-24-2016, 12:39 PM
#28
Rennlist Member
08-24-2016, 12:56 PM
#29
Rennlist Member
Are you bipolar? Seriously? You spend half your time asking about 997s and the other half suggesting that the 996 is better. And thats not to mention the 37 or so other inaccuracies in your post.
And I suggest a rule that if you quote "a well respected mechanic", you must name said individual. early 9A1s are better now? Who said this?
And I suggest a rule that if you quote "a well respected mechanic", you must name said individual. early 9A1s are better now? Who said this?
It is my search and research of 997.1s that led me to reconsider the 996. Please be more specific about the other 37 inaccuracies...happy to discuss them with you. Since I could not put quotation marks around a specific set of words, and because I had not asked the mechanic for permission to quote him, I did not give his name. But don't take my word for it, do your own research. My feelings are too avoid the 2010 through 2012 997.2s and go with an 09...if that becomes my choice. And notice I was able to reply to you without resorting to childish name calling.
08-24-2016, 01:21 PM
#30
Race Director
Quadcammer may sometimes be a ball-busting curmudgeon, but I'm not certain he's sardonic.
Example: Oh, damn, 5CHN3LL just dumped one of his sardonic replies in Hurdi's "how to nail Home Depot gutter guard to your 996 before endoing into a concrete divider" thread.
I like you more when you post "Blow me, a**hole" and storm off for a month to lick your wounds (and buy, and subsequently sell, and then buy back a 911)...