One part of the program that I developed was the core exchange portion. Dealing with cores like this was new to me; because, my Flat 6 Engine Program never deals with them- we build the customer's existing engine. We also do not reuse most factory components, and they are thrown away, so our necessity for cores is hardly any; limited to blocks, cranks, and crank carriers.

That said, I do know how I see people get royally screwed by core charges and I know the complaints that I constantly heard from people who had bought exchange engines. I also know whats fair when dealing with cores, and I know how important they are to the RND program.

The RND program cannot function without cores. This mass production program is not like others, where a bunch of engines are taken apart and all the parts mixed up, then pulled out of the mix to build an engine. With the RND program an engine is assigned a process number, it is disassembled and is then evaluated by the same assembler who will be reassembling it.

Several sheets are used to grade the core and these will follow the engine as it is processed. These sheets are entered into a data base and any component thats questionable is then further reviewed by the Program Manager. If the component is deemed unserviceable, then a photo is taken of that component and added to the data base.

The entire engine is then ultrasonically cleaned and further inspected. If the remainder of the components meet the criteria they are placed onto a large cart, each numbered with the process number. The block and heads are then numbered and the block goes to LN Engineering to be fitted with LN Nickies cylinders.

After a few weeks the block returns from being processed and then it meets all of the new OE components supplied by SSF Auto Parts along with the cylinder heads that have also been completely rebuilt. All of these items are then finally ultrasonically cleaned, and prepared by the prep specialist. They are placed onto an assembly cart and rolled into the assembly area where they will be placed next to an engine stand. The prep specialist bolts the block half onto an engine stand and then the assembler will build the engines one at a time. The assembler has his work checked by quality control at 4 critical stages of assembly by a second pair of eyes and hands.

Engines are processed in batches, and 8 engines make one batch. After 1/2 batch of engines have been assembled and finally checked by quality control, those 4 engines are then placed into their crates and 4 more engines (the remainder of the batch) is fitted to the engine stands and assembled, and crated. Once the engines are fixed to the crate, the Program Manager finally inspects them once again and includes all the support materials, to include a USB key filled with information, like user manuals and etc. This includes instructions for the shop installing the engine and also the vehicle owner. Engines are then shipped in batches to the SSF warehouses across the country.

Now, about core charges:
It is possible to have a core pre- qualified!! Contact the sales team for more information.

With a program like RND cores are the ONLY thing that makes it work. Last year RND bought every core on the market to start this massive program. Of those anything that was questionable was tossed out. None of the cores that we sourced that had cracked heads, had those heads repaired, (they were entered into inventory for a rainy day, when cores are not available and cracks must be repaired) and were fitted with other heads from the massive core bank that the program has built up. The same with blocks, and other components. The engine is a premium unit, so any core that is not premium can't be used.

When a core engine is returned the RND disassembly and prep department is given 10 days from receipt to disassemble, inspect and turn the reports into SSF concerning the condition of this core. This is a very fast turn around time, as dealers will often hold someone's money for 6 months while the core is shipped back to Germany for evaluation.

With the core disassembled and photo documented, each core evaluation sheet will be supplied with the photos of the component that was deemed "bad'. SSF has a core menu sheet that breaks these components down based on their realistic cost of replacement and that amount of money is then held from the core deposit. This is different than the factory, as today you get money back, or you don't.

Doing things this way means that unless someone has a massive catastrophic failure, they will get some money back. The majority of people have gotten most or all of their money back. SSF is not a money hungry company; they are very fair and balanced, and they don't operate on a shoestring budget.

So if someone lost an IMS Bearing they'd usually owe for a replacement IMS assembly as well as a couple of oil scavenge pumps. These are usually what an IMSB failure will take out. If someone had a 10K core charge, they'd only lose what the costs of those 2 scavenge pumps and the IMS assembly. The rest would be returned.

Again, the components that had failed will be documented with photos and entered into the data base for that particular engine, and held forever with a cross reference to that engines M# serial code.

To me, nothing gets more fair and balanced than this way of doing business. Cores are essential for RND to work; because each engine is built from it's original base components, and because, without cores, engines cannot be produced.

Again, cores can be submitted for pre- qualification before an engine purchase. The dynamics behind this get pretty detailed pretty quick. If someone decides not to move forward with the engine purchase they simply pay for the core processing fee and they can have their disassembled engine back. Those figures are not something that I know, or deal with.

Again, the program was developed with all the common issues relating to cores and etc as a reality. Everyone knows that for this program to be successful that it has top operate in a very forward manner with core charges assessed fairly and agreed to up front. The buyer will agree to all the details of the engine at the time the order is placed; before SSF collects a dollar.

Direct all your questions to the contact page at www.rndengines.com or to the toll free number. Please don't send them to me, my part with RND has been completed for quite some time.

Don't base your feelings toward the expense of these engines only from the Pelican listing that was referenced. Call your local shop and have them inquire to get you a price for your specific engine. This program is designed to work through shops who will provide installation of the engine, remove your core and ship it back to SSF. It will always work best if the process is handled in this manner.

This is a solid program for a stock displacement engine replacement. Remember, the most expensive Porsche engine you can buy, is the one that you pay the least amount for.

 

dporto, it's $23.6k+ $13.8k, not minus. Go to pelican and add a reman alternator to the cart and tell me what you see about the core charge

 

Yowza! So, you have to come up with $37,400 up front, and then keep your fingers crossed as to how much of the core charge you will get credited back?

Sorry, I just don't see any sanity in going this route.

 

That's because there is no sanity in going this route when you can drive one home for $15k.

My 911 will be put out in my pasture with my other appreciating project cars, if/when it ever implodes.

I may even pull the frunk lid off and plant daisies in there. Other landscaping recommendations from knowledgeable RLer's welcomed.

 

Nevermind, someone above posted before me.

 

Again, prices for engines and cores will vary by shop. The first price I had seen posted was here in the thread.

This isn't for everyone, and all involved have known that since the beginning. I see guys invest 20-25K into a car that has a street value of 15K (or even less than 10K if its a Boxster) all the time. The vast majority of my 1 year backlog at Flat 6 is filled with these consumers; just like it was when guys were spending 10-15K for an aircooled engine for their 912 or 914 that was worth 3-7K. Now those cars are worth something and the engines are even more expensive to build than an M96.

Vehicles have value in different ways, to different people. If someone only looks at the KBB value, thats one group, and they usually don't love the car. The people who love the car, and understand the difference between cost and value will benefit from this program.

Some people sell the cars as a roller in a broken state... Those are excellent opportunities for a new owner to enthusiastically purchase and fit with an RND or Flat 6 engine. Ask Sneaky pete about this avenue, he has just experienced it first hand.

Oh and BTW- Turbos are not immune to engine issues and guess what? A 996TT engine thats built will cost as much as the car is worth, too. I know, because we build those too.

 

What I seem to be reading is that if you have a good core the RND engine will still cost around 23000 from Pelican, is this correct. If it is and you have a good core why not just get a RABY engine for around 20000 since its less money and a better engine. I must be wrong about something.

 

I confirmed today with SSF that the 23k price is incorrect. They will be stating prices in an upcoming post. I have not been able to find the engines on Pelican, can someone post the link?

The most expensive RND engine is several thousand dollars more than the cheapest Flat 6 Innovations engine. The two have no comparison other than the same cylinder plating process. They are built for differing purposes entirely, and should never be compared.

 

I see the glass is half full...and getting fuller. We are not talking about Bug Eyed Sprite trackter motors...these engines are sculpture...they sing like a tenor...but machines break or wear out. Even if the engine cost you $20k...when you put it in the car, what else could you have bought that will equal the package? Here are people trying to address a problem and solve a need. As a result you have more choices than before. I'm thrilled.

 

People on this forum are just trying to get an idea about what the range of costs are. Obviously if these engines are 23000 even if you have a good core there won't be many beating down the door to get one. I along with others think that releasing any information about these engines should include an accurate cost breakdown, surely it can't be 5000 dollars different between dealers. I guess it will be known shortly but until then rumors are spreading and that isn't good for the sellers or buyers.

 

Jake, the link was posted in post #42.

 

These engines are definitely a hair under $20k depending on which engine you're looking at. The core charges range from $7k to $10k.

-Jason

 

So if I am correct these engines will cost a hair under 20000 dollars if you have a good core. If you have a bad core could cost up to 10000 dollars more. If this is correct why would anyone choose one of these engines over a RABY engine as prices would be very close. Maybe a hair is defined as 5000 dollars which might change the dynamics.

 

That is correct. The advantage is, they're in stock today.

-Jason

 

If the intermediate shaft is damaged, the price reduction of the core will be the cost of a new shaft or the cost of a new one? This question goes for all the other parts that are not reusable too. If a used part pricing is used, what is the price list for that?