Luxter

I have a few questions related to Joe Gibbs DT-40 5W-40 lubricant and hope to hear from Flat 6 Innovations and/or LN if possible.
First, do you have VOA and sample UOA available.
Could you describe the advantages of DT-40 over the following lubricants:
1. Redline 0W-40, 5W-40 or 10W-40 all with high ZDDP, moly content (except 5W) and high HTHS
2. Motul 300V 5W-40 and 10W-40 with high HTHS, adequate ZDDP and moly
3. Amsoil AMO 10W-40 with high ZDDP and high HTHS
4. Motul 8100 series X-Cess and X-Clean (A40 freigabe)
Many thanks in advance,
=L=

dotframe

Riad

x2

Scats

x3

soverystout

To the OP:

Really? You do realize that 10W-40 of any brand is not the correct weight to be used in these cars?

0w-40, 5w-40, 5w-50 (mobil 1 5w-50 only) are the oils that should be used.

Flat6 Innovations

I won't write a book about this, because I headed up the development of this oil ONLY for our engine program. Until last month we have refused to sell the oil to the public and only used it in our reconstructed, big bore engines. I honestly do not care if we sell it otherwise, so I won't sit here and tell you that its the best thing since sliced bread and try to convince anyone to switch to it. There is nothing that I hate more than BS online arguments with armchair experts that don't even change their own oil, which is what has occurred since we have began to sell the oil at retail. I will tell you that our engines are required to use the DT40 oil while under warranty.

This should give you a bit of a comparison concerning the shear and oil film strength of DT40 Vs. M1. This test was just carried out Monday by Lubrizol and the report just made it to Lake Speed at Joe Gibbs Racing Oils yesterday. He sent it my way as soon as he received it. Do some google searches to understand the table below, as I lack the time to give a seminar here.


We developed this oil after rigorous testing in the lab, on the street and on the track and it was done ONLY for the benefit of OUR ENGINE PROGRAM. LN and I carried out all of this test work, collected all the UOA and tried many different 5 gallon pails of "secret sauce" custom blends before this formulation was agreed upon. I could care less about selling it to the public at all, but I got tired of people getting pissed off when they'd call and we told them "We only sell the oil to the owners of our reconstructed engines, please tell me the FSI serial # of the engine you are servicing today". Life was much easier when we only cared about our engines.

Plain and simple we are concerned with shear at elevated temperatures and thats what separates the men from the boys concerning the M96 engine. Last year this oil was used in a select few Grand Am cars and those cars were the ONLY cars that ran all season with ZERO engine failures and did so without running accusumps, deep sumps or any other devices. The other guys were running every band aid possible and had failures despite their efforts- because they haven't learned what we have. That makes me smile :-)

If you'd like to purchase the oil, we'd be glad to sell it, but I won't promise anyone unicorns and rainbows to sell them a quart of oil.

Luxter

Thank you Jake, I understand your frustration.
I never mentioned M1 0W-40 in my question, nor I try to start another oil war. I also change my own oil and in fact do care about engine wear and its longevity.
From your past posts Jake, I remember that you weren’t happy with any of the oils presently available on the market. Each of them had some “issues” if you will, making it less than perfect for 996/997 engines. I was hoping to have you explain in more detail which of those issues were associated with which oils and how DT-40 addressed them to your satisfaction.
I think it would help the community to see a VOA or a sample UOA as well although plain numbers from UOA don’t reflect overall performance of any oil.
Thank you for your time and effort again.
=L=

Luxter

Yes, it is.

soverystout

sigh.... I hope you are not referring to your owners manual. Oil recommendations in there have been replaced many, many times.

This list really doesn't mean much since we are all past the Porsche warranty but this link will take you to a recent list of all Porsche approved oils for for the all of the cars (not including the Cayenne) from 1984 on.
It's the A40 list, you have to scroll past the C30 list.

http://www.pedrosgarage.com/Site_3/P...oved_Oils.html

Luxter

With all respect, you are confusing "weight" with "Porsche approval".
10w-40 is perfectly fine, so is 15W-40. In fact all oils under M1 5W-50 viscosity curve will likely do fine with variocams as long as 40 & 50 weight.
Go to Mr. Widman's site and plot your own oil and see how it compares with 5W-50.
None of 10W-40 oils are currently A40 approved. I can agree with that statement.
In past even 10W-60 was approved (1999 IIRC). Ohhh, Porsche....