Flat6 Innovations

I reviewed your UOA. I would like to send you a study that I recently carried out on this topic that includes teardown pictures from an engine that had similar UOA values of iron and copper.

If you can email me at jake@rabyenginedevelopment.com I'll get it to you next week.

Ahsai

Hi Jake,
Email sent. Really appreciate your help and expert opinion and I look forward to your study. I'm already using your magnetic drain plug and a low temp thermo. I'm currently trying to assess the general health of my engine and see if anything needs to be done.

I have been using Motul for the past 4 years with oil change every 5000 miles/1yr. All maintenance are up to date and engine always warmed up before being pushed.

Again thanks for your help

Ahsai

This is the latest oil report, about a year from my original post.
The iron and copper levels have come down a bit but still in the same order of magnitude. Engine feels strong and smooth, no oil leak, no strange noises, etc. The only thing is it's burning oil at ~1,600 miles/quart, which it's been doing since new. Quite a bit of oily grime build up under the outside of the throttle body where the PCV vent line plugs into it. My theory is a lot of oil vapor is sucked in through that vent line due to the sub par AOS.

2013-02-02 oil report edited.pdf

Flat6 Innovations

You need to check the vacuum readings within the crankcase, it sounds like you have a weak/ failing AOS as this is the first symptom thats usually apparent.
This effects fuel trim values and impacts engine management.

The ONLY copper within these engines is the dermis layer of the rod and main bearings. Iron high followed by copper being high is classic and we know what causes it. Here is a picture from my study that shows this very clearly. The engine studied had 47K miles on it, was one owner, never tracked and always serviced. The classic recipe for unexpected failures. We saved this one and I am testing it after reassembly as we speak.

Ahsai

Thanks for your expoert info, Jake. That makes a lot of sense. I started UOA only last year and already saw BOTH copper and iron that high so maybe the wear had started even earlier. So what to do? Just switch to DT40 and keep doing UOA?

I also heard the oil cooler is also made of copper/brass but can hardly imagine they will shed material constantly.

I measured the crankcase vacuum last week via the oil filler tube. It read ~6" water so not too bad. Long term fuel trims are at +5% on both banks so not bad either. No oil leak around RMS/IMS. Everything looks so perfect....except the UOAs

Flat6 Innovations

based on the position of the oil/ coolant heat exchanger in the oil system, if it sheds material that goes straight to the rod and main bearings as unfiltered oil... This material has always come from the bearings in my previous experiences and we are seeing more and more of these occurrences now.

Ahsai

Thanks Jake. That makes sense. So any way to keep the wear down to a minimum from now on to prolong the life of the engine?

I assume I will need to watch out for low oil pressure and any rod knocking noise from now on. Maybe it's the best opportunity to try out DT40 and keep doing UOAs....

targa996

I'm also burning a quart around every 1.5k miles .. @ 61k now .. Higher than I would like but everything seems ok .. Mobile 1 ow40 ...

Last oil analysis showed slightly high copper but nothing black stone was too concerned about. Smog passed with no issues. I put some of the consumption issues down to 0w oil on cold starts ..oil consumption is less per mile on long runs ...

Ahsai

Thanks for the info, Targa. When you said slightly high copper, is it anywhere close to 20+ ppm like mine in 5k miles oil?

KrazyK

Everytime you guys post these and JR responds, Im afraid to start my car for fear of it imploding or blowing its guts through the pan.

But seriously, I would be concerned about the oil analysis and excessive oil consumption. Your engine might be a candidate for the flush and fill with JG DT40, then get a new analysis just to see what happens.

Ahsai

Sorry to raise your stress level a bit, Krazy. You read my mind about trying out DT40 since there's nothing much I could do at this point (well, may be to add Jake's full flow oil filter adaptor and use better filters). I already have the LN magnetic oil plug.

Btw, Jake had mentioned before there are 20+ modes of failure for these engines so in a way I was not too surprised about my situation...

Flat6 Innovations

And thats why I am checking out from forum contributions. I see the worst of the worst and nothing comes to us just needing "service work".

Ahsai, once damage is done, its done and it will not get any better without intervention. Right now you have no other symptoms so finding someone in your area that has mechanical aptitude and common sense would be advisable. Technicians know how to plug in a scan tool into your vehicle, unfortunately thats not going to alleviate your issue.

Ahsai

Thanks Jake for your advice. I understand that what's damaged is damaged. I would not expect the engine to cure itself. Now it's a matter of finding a way to slow down further wear or find other ways to get rid of the problem.

targa996

Copper was 23 iron 11 ppm with 4700 miles on engine

Ahsai

Thanks Targa for sharing your info. I appreciate it.