flash80

It's quite a slippery slope. I originally was looking at 996 C2, but after researching and seeing the C4S--had to have it. Would I have bought a 996TT if I could have? Probably--the potential to chip and get ridiculous power is soooo tempting. Not much can touch it for th $60-70k range. But, that is 20%+ more than the C4S' being looked at here. All of a sudden, you've gone from a $40k car to a $65k one. I will agree, that the law of diminishing returns hits a steep slope after the 996TT, though.

In the end, the wifey set a ceiling on my budget and I was scraping the stucco for sure on the C4S.

Either way, good dilemma to have....enjoy your new car, hopefully it'll be a C4S! j/k.

p.s. you may want to practice driving stick before jumping in for a test drive--doubt that the sales ppl would appreciate a burnt clutch.

pongobaz

Reading this with some amusement...boy are people polarized into 2 camps: TT vs C4S! First of all, beauty is subjective and some will prefer the busier "boy racer" looks of the TT rear end over the more classic Porsche look of the C4S.
An M3 smoking a C4S?...I don't think so. My brother had an '03 M3 and vs my '03 C4S, it just couldn't do it...especially when cornering was involved.
Yes the TT is faster, but how many of us can even come close to exploiting that everyday or even on a track for that matter. Take ANY box-stock NA 996 to the track, and unless you're Walter Rohl, there is more than enough power and speed to scare the crap out of you. By the time I grab for third gear, I'm already over the national speed limit fer chrisake!
A C4S with PSE will sound a thousand times better than a stock TT...turbos have a very muted sound...kinda like a Toyota Camry .
All kidding aside, they are all great cars. Porsche makes so many variants of the 911 so that there are flavors for every taste.
Pick your poison wisely...it's addictive!

arr0gant

No, the 2002 C4S the OP referenced is listed at $54k and the TT can be had for a thousand or 2 above that. All I was saying was you'd be a fool to buy that car when a similar, lower mile TT can be had for the same or a couple thousand more.

I'll say it ONE MORE TIME. THE 996 911 TT is the GREATEST value on for any car for what you get, ANY CAR!! You get a legendary Porsche with SUPER CAR performance in the $50's. You get a bulletproof Turbo GT1 derived engine that is modifiable and bullet-proof up and past 700BHP. Same goes for the whole car being able to handle that power.

arr0gant

Couple of snips from E46Fanatics when BenChoi was an M3 owner and dissed the C4S all over the place.

The 1st snap was after I responded to him when he said the M3 was the far better looking car and way more aggressive than the C4S. He was saying he'd so much rather have the 2004 M3 than the 2002 C4S.

Second clip he's telling me I have no chance against an M3, when all I said was it would be a good race.

demosan

bitterazn,

As others have said, the price seems high and I'm not sure this car has the PSE
( porsche sport exaust ) option. I thought that all PSE options included the dual tip exausts and I don't see them on this car. As an ex-bostonian, HC dealerships are always a bit overpriced IMHO so you have leverage here and you should use it as there is lots of inventory out there.

I have the same car without the sport seats and no PSE. If you send me a PM I willsend you the 2002 ordering guide with pricing you may find useful in your search/negotiations.

demosan

DanJK

PSE does not include standard dual tips.

We all like to defend our own ride. I drive a c4s for example and love it most of the time, but you would be nutz not to move to a tt if the price of admission was only a couple k. Learn to drive a turbo and the so called lag is negligible in real world.

bitterazn

Just to add some fuel into the fire, I'm not sure the pricing comparison is entirely fair.

For example, just using the Porsche website search, it becomes pretty clear that the one I went to see was pretty overpriced. Other '02 C4S's w/ CPO are in the high $40s to low $50s (I'm not sure if the difference is regional or due to options).

A search for '02 TT's w/ CPO are in the high $50s to low $60s. So I don't think the step-up is just a few thousand - it's more like $10k (20%+).

arr0gant, I'm not sure if you're referencing examples like Hungry4$$$'s '01 TT offered at $53k? While that's a great car, it's a bit different from what I was looking at. Namely, it's a year older, w/o CPO, and a private seller. I think comparable '01 C4S's go for low $40s on AutoTrader, so again the step-up is ~$10k.

Not saying anything about whether the incremental performance is worthwhile, just commenting that I'm not sure it's no-brainer "value."

Benjamin Choi

arrogant, i don't appreciate you going back and stalking my posts from way back from another forum and bringing up yet AGAIN here at rennlist. it's real nerd style and that is why i will never engage you beyond www cuz you're flat out weird esp for a mid 30s dude, but no question i'll back up what i said.


-the e46 M3 can keep up with the 996C4s in the straights, in the turns as their performance stats are in the same league just as both of these cars can keep up with a 996TT or whatever else faster car out there becaues it comes down to the driver.

-i would never pick your '01 x50 TT over my c4s; if i wanted a 996TT i'd have one just like many others here. your interior (lightly optioned), your bone stock exterior is absolutely boring to a guy who likes his cars visually modified. i wouldn't be happy with the visual part of your car both inside and outside as that is a larger factor for me in my ability to love a car than outright hp/tq which the TT has more of than the n/a c4s and on top of that, i don't like turbo engines as it IS laggy period. for the $ i spent to get my c4s to where it is today, man, i could easily be in a nicely optioned 997S model with aerokit, but that's not my thing right now, timing was off, i'm not patient (no regrets)

-more often than not people will certainly pick a 996TT over the 996C4S no question so get your panties unruffled. i need the entire package to be great and not just in the power dept. we all have a 911 for the cohesive package, right? else we'd all be rolling on leaf springs in the back.

-it's absolutely not uncommon to call the 996 c4s the best looking of the 996 lot even when up against the beautiful gt2 which is my fav as it is rwd and as an awesome factory aerokit and not the weak ducktail in the back of the regular TT

pongobaz

Yup...it all comes down to the driver. The advantage in the C4S and TT, is that the awd is so sure footed and composed, it makes it a breeze to drive fast in the twisties.
I also think that the TT's are such a bargain now because of the enormous depreciation hit they've taken due to the huge amount that were produced. 996 TTs were available for a full 5 model years, while the 996 C4S was only around for 3.5 model years IIRC.

arr0gant

Wierd esp for mid thirties dude why? Cause I call you out on your BS? I just like to point out your hypocrisy. You told me how you disliked C4S's over at the M3 board because they were too slow, had the RMS issues, had "0" chance of beating an M3, among all the other things you said. Then you bought one a couple months later. ****, i've seen you tell a member here how ugly his wife is, when he proudly posted a pic of his new Porsche with her in it. NO RESPECT, NO CLASS, HYPOCRITE!

I've seen you do it time and again. You pick out all the things about someones car that you don't like and drop a nuclear bomb and wonder why they hate you. To me it's comical. To say things like, the TT is too laggy, who wants all that power, your interior is too bare, the duck wing is ugly? Where do you come up with this ****? Have I ever said one thing bad about any of your cars? Has anyone? Then why do you continue to?

I think after the 1st 50 people put you on ignore list, you calmed it down a little. Then it seems as if a lot of people just kinda gave up and started to except you for the douche you are. I just find it funny how you continue to spew your blather and when it comes up to bite you in your ***, you get all defensive. You are who you are, and im sure in real life you're just as "douchey" as you act on the board here at Renn. I think we've just come to expect it.

Pugnacious P

Bitter, I agree 10G's is nothing to sneeze at, but with your original posting of 54k the price for an early TT is commensurate. But the more you shop, the more you will find varying prices and varying options. The best thing to do is take your time. The right car will come along. They are all great cars.

Benjamin Choi

It's called live and learn and it's obvious I am a porsche fan, but still to this day i assert as on day 1 that the E46 M3 is in the same performance class as the carrera. period. and i often refer (fondly) to my carrera as the porky4s as i would if i had the turbo a gt coupe. now the GT3... that's PORSCHE 911 to the fullest.

and bud you can say whatever the **** you want about my cars whatever. u think i actually give a flying fuq? WHAHAHAH but it's hard to because i even admit damn i do up a car RIGHT.

and you make this so personal it's hilarious man really. chill dude. i'm just an alias online. i treat you like one. treat me like one.

and i couldn't care less who puts me on ignore or not. seriously, i'd tell them, change the damn channel and they did. they're weeding out their nerd selves for me. all i do is do what i do --> be me, consistently.

anyways, back to bitter... like i made my original list, it's the 911 widebody or nothing. TT is something to consider, but i can see why one would want a c4s over the TT very clearly cuz that was me. i'd take a decently optioned/modded c4s over a lightly optioned (like arrogant's) TT every day of the week +1. it's that gray. 911s vary so much with options/condition it's insane.

it's not like you're buying a bottega veneta suitcase. you're buying a house. the whole package with its myriad of parts and conditions. i trust that we are helping bitter choose wisely.

arr0gant

I wouldn't dis your car, because I think it's hot. But to even put the C4S into the class of a TT, is to me, ridiculous. $125k car v $85k car that can NOW be had for a couple K diff? Cmon....and YOU wanna nitpick the "duck tail" or a few extra options? I simply think it's ridiculous, and I think I'm not alone. Once again, as someone who's owned both, I don't see how you can put them in the same league. You're simply outclassed on this one, and I think a person who wants a C4S and can get a TT for 5 or $6k more would be FOOL not to. Just MY 2 ****ing sense!!

PS. Sometimes I like to be douchey, too!!

arr0gant

http://youtube.com/watch?v=OYUKJCDOFME

Top Gear C4S and Turbo

Benjamin Choi

It's clear that Clarkson doesn't like the 911 forced induction or N/A. I'm like him along this front. Ferrari over Porsche.

And since you've brought up automotive reviews, if you read up on evo mag, they give the 996 C4S a 5 star rating.

The Turbo and C4S are close enough that there is no out-classing going on just as I find the 997C4S and 997TT... close enough that I'd cross-shop both like we are doing here.