Super D

Hi Guys,

In the midst of embarking on a 996 upgrade project, I've been researching the tuners/manufacturers overseas a bit and am wondering if anyone has significant experience with their products. Any opinions of the quality of Ruf, Roock, Cargraphic, Strosek, Techart and other European tuning products beyond what's been written in magazine articles?....Meaning, I'd like to hear from people who've actually used their products to upgrade the performance of your Porsche. Please share your "highs" and "lows" of the experience.

I'm trying to cut through hype and find out what REALLY works well in terms of:

• Body/Aerodynamics: good fitment and material
• Suspension: handling improvement over OE, quality and serviceability
• Wheels: finish quality, durability, lightness, desirable offset and width
• Powertrain: power, drivability, installation ease, service support
• Interior: quality of materials and fit, durability over normal use

I know there are plenty of race and tuning shops here in the US that can install parts that do similar things to what the Euro's offer, but I'm primarily concerned here with looking at European-made upgrade products in this case and getting real-world experiences, good or bad.

THANK YOU for your candid input! Much appreciated.

CLL ACAB

Which model do you have?

Super D

'99 996 C2, but this isn't really a model-specific question, it's more of a picture of experiences upgrading any models that I'm after. Some people may've upgraded a 993 or 996 C2 or TT and I want to hear about all of it. At some point, I'll get a TT also to upgrade, so all of the input is really important. Thank you.

Sloth

I think I would stick with Ruf or Techart. Not a big fan of Strosek style and Rook does not have the best reputation. Not even sure Rook is still in business, I thought they were closed down.

Super D

I shouldn't have used "opinion" in the thread title, what I'm really hoping for is for first-hand accounts of user experience. This isn't a question of style so much as quality material, fitment and engineering thoughtfulness--I've outlined the factual questions in bullet points above. Sloth, thanks just the same for your thoughts anyway. Any other posts, please keep it to first-hand experiences with the products. Thank you very much, I'm looking forward to hearing your experiences as related to the bullet points above and any additional commentary you find important to share.

Super D

SORRY...I forgot to include GEMBALLA! (Gearshift was engaged, but brain was stuck in Neutral!)

They're also a good one to consider since they do approach things similarly to Ruf in terms of engineering and aesthetics combined. Add them to the list of considerations and those users I'm hoping to hear from. Thanks!

TT Gasman

Ruf. The rest of the tuners are a bunch of also rans, to borrow and old racing saying.

jetskied

I seen Gemembella cars and the body kit fits good and looks good if your into that. From what I'm told that many of the tuners use more or less the same suspension componets. I'm told most of them use H&R, but some of the tuner might have valved the shocks different. You willnotice a big handling difference in new shocks and springs, but it also depends how much stiffness can you handle. As far as engine upgrade I have been pondering it for sometime now and the short answer is that nonee of it helps significantly. I talked to Andial (builds engine for Porsche Motorsports NA) and they sadi the most significant upgrade is the X51 or adding cams with a ecu to your enginge. The problem is that these upgrade are worth only about 25 HP and cost over $10K. The best value is supercharge, but I am warry of its reliability. Exhaust is purely for sound RUF is the best sounding, but you cant go wrong with the OE PSE. As far as wheels it a personal choice. Most of the tuners have them manufactured by a rim company like Speedline. (RUF). I like the HRE style and finish, but its not the lightest wheels. Fikse and Kinesis also makes good forged wheels.

Super D

Not so--both Cargraphic and Gemballa have extensive professional racing experience actually in GT3 and GT2 internationally. Ruf is classified as a manufacturer in Germany, so they are a bit different in that respect, but it's really semantics. I'm going to sit tight and hope someone chimes in that's actually had experience using the products in question on their own cars.

Thanks for the opinions, everyone, but that's not what I'm going for here. If anyone has a web link or resource they can recommend to find real comparisons and first-hand usage input, that's much appreciated.

Is there anyone out there who has ACTUALLY USED the tuner products and done a full upgrade to their 996 and/or purchased a completely built car?

fahren affair

oh really, like which teams?

i agree with dj 996 on ruf, and i'm speaking with someones elses' experience. the best upgrade for a base 996 is to just buy a gt3 or gt2--as the factory delivers it... but that's just my un-informed opinion.

TT Gasman

I had a Ruf exhaust some time ago on my 996, it was very high quality, better than OEM. Just too pricey nowadays with the exchange rate.
How's that for personal experience.

Super D

I'm not a race historian, but a quick online search for Gemballa popped up GrandAm team with Randy Pobst at the wheel, and Cargraphic GT2 racing at Hockenheim. They've been racing 911s for years in Europe. Please, I don't mean to (and am unwilling to) debate racing here, that's off the topic. I want to find someone, anyone who has modified their c2 with upgrades from these tuner product companies who can share their experience. As for the "attention *****" icon, that's very funny, I didn't see that one until now.

Is my post in the wrong forum? Is there another one that deals specifically with mod's that would be better? Let me know, thanks everyone.

Super D

Thank you! Finally a first-hand report, however small. That's what I'm looking for. Have a good day, and let me know if you think I should post somewhere else to find more tuner mod users who could chime in.

Fanman

Didn't the Gemballa 650 own the Nurburgring record for modified cars for quite a while ?

I have the Gemballa exhaust for my 01' C2 and it is very nice. Great exhaust tone, and very good fit & finish.

All that being said the retail price on a lot of stuff from Ruf, Techart, Car Graphic, etc. is very high. You pay a lot, you get a lot.

You are in San Diego, you might want to give www.evoms.com a look. They have a great reputation with the people that they have worked with, and they are an easy drive for you as they are over in Arizona. They have a nice GIAC ECU upgrade/CAI package, or if you are looking for something more substantial they have a very good supercharger install.

Good luck

Super D

Yep, and actually that record was set in a STREET car, not a fully-prepped race car, all the more shocking. Thanks for the feedback on the exhaust. As for EVOMS, I spoke w/them and it sounds like the SC system hasn't been torture tested on track yet, and that's one of my criteria. I don't want to pump up the motor and grenade it. Initial reports of their system look good, but I'm a slow adopter so I'll wait to see how durable it is long-term--kinda like upgrading a computer OS...I wait 'til all the bugs and patches are stabilized before installing mine and torturing it. In the case of my car, I'll maintain it well, and will drive it hard on track, so I want to use upgrades that are proven under heavy activity over a long test period. This durability, in addition to good fit, finish and materials is what I'd call a really good product.