Metal in Oil Filter and Blackstone high Copper
02-14-2018, 09:57 AM
#16
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Thank you for the ID of the particles, I didn't see anything that looked like this in the other threads. There were maybe 1 or 2 other pieces about the same size in different parts of the filter. Does this amount of material actually indicate a problem? Seems the other materials mentioned in the other threads just pointed to manufacturing/tooling excess being dislodged.
Also, how does leaking fuel cause this to get into the oil? The analysis shows little fuel in the oil.
Thanks again,
Also, how does leaking fuel cause this to get into the oil? The analysis shows little fuel in the oil.
Thanks again,
The way Lokasil works, you have an iron coating (Ferrostan) on the pistons that prevents the aluminum to aluminum contact with the raw (etched) aluminum bores. Once you loose the coating, it's not a question of if but rather when you will have cylinder scoring.
02-16-2018, 06:52 PM
#17
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Bad injectors wash cylinder bores down and if they are leaking, will pool fuel in the cylinder. Fuel is not a lubricant. We've just seen a direct correlation to bad injectors and scored cylinders in non-cold climate cars, so it's something to be aware of.
The way Lokasil works, you have an iron coating (Ferrostan) on the pistons that prevents the aluminum to aluminum contact with the raw (etched) aluminum bores. Once you loose the coating, it's not a question of if but rather when you will have cylinder scoring.
The way Lokasil works, you have an iron coating (Ferrostan) on the pistons that prevents the aluminum to aluminum contact with the raw (etched) aluminum bores. Once you loose the coating, it's not a question of if but rather when you will have cylinder scoring.
Thanks again for the explanations.
02-16-2018, 06:55 PM
#18
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Excess fuel washes down the cylinder bore (fuel is not a lubricant) and will further increase wear.
02-16-2018, 07:02 PM
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02-16-2018, 07:07 PM
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So the fuel is passing the rings when the engine is not running and damaging the pistons (skirts) on the crank/rod/oil side of the piston. If that was the case, wouldn't the oil analysis show fuel in the oil?
02-16-2018, 07:10 PM
#21
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The scoring happens when the piston skirt coating has failed. That's what happens first.
Yes, we install new aluminum sleeves with NSC plating (similar to Nikasil) and fit new pistons, when rebuilding the block.
It is possible to reuse the original pistons when and if there hasn't been a cylinder failure that damages the pistons. In that case, we have Calico Coatings coat the pistons and set up the bores off the coated pistons. However, new pistons are the best route, we only re-use the original pistons when complying with PCA Club Racing or other customer requirements to retain the original pistons.
Yes, we install new aluminum sleeves with NSC plating (similar to Nikasil) and fit new pistons, when rebuilding the block.
It is possible to reuse the original pistons when and if there hasn't been a cylinder failure that damages the pistons. In that case, we have Calico Coatings coat the pistons and set up the bores off the coated pistons. However, new pistons are the best route, we only re-use the original pistons when complying with PCA Club Racing or other customer requirements to retain the original pistons.
02-17-2018, 10:06 AM
#22
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I can't believe no one in here has not mentioned running a top end lube like ashless TC-W3 2-stroke oil. Thousands of others have been doing for years in cars that don't even have bore scoring issues, like the M96 does. They do it for other reasons that are a lot less serious. I have been guilty of running left over pre-mix in my 4 strokes many many times over my life. And of course always ran a" boutique" top end lube in my alky race car.( Because alcohol a VERY dry fuel). Seems like a no-brainer for anyone worried about bore scoring.
Last edited by Porschetech3; 02-17-2018 at 04:58 PM.
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02-17-2018, 04:14 PM
#23
^^ Today’s fuel does not have the lubricuty that fuel did years ago. For my cars I often add Lucas Upper Cylinder Lubricant (a couple ounces) at nearly every tankful. Been using it for years. The cars I own don’t suffer from bore scoring but I like the benefits of the Lucas product, also has a fuel injector cleaner.
I’ve been using it in my daily driver 2004 BMW 325i, 219,000 miles with zero drivability issues (original fuel injectors) and very little oil consumption beteween oil changes. Also use it in the ‘84 and ‘95 Porsches.
I’ve been using it in my daily driver 2004 BMW 325i, 219,000 miles with zero drivability issues (original fuel injectors) and very little oil consumption beteween oil changes. Also use it in the ‘84 and ‘95 Porsches.
02-18-2018, 10:47 AM
#24
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^^ Today’s fuel does not have the lubricuty that fuel did years ago. For my cars I often add Lucas Upper Cylinder Lubricant (a couple ounces) at nearly every tankful. Been using it for years. The cars I own don’t suffer from bore scoring but I like the benefits of the Lucas product, also has a fuel injector cleaner.
I’ve been using it in my daily driver 2004 BMW 325i, 219,000 miles with zero drivability issues (original fuel injectors) and very little oil consumption beteween oil changes. Also use it in the ‘84 and ‘95 Porsches.
I’ve been using it in my daily driver 2004 BMW 325i, 219,000 miles with zero drivability issues (original fuel injectors) and very little oil consumption beteween oil changes. Also use it in the ‘84 and ‘95 Porsches.
02-18-2018, 08:12 PM
#25
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I'm currently working on a paper discussing this exact topic and the lubricity of fuels as it pertains to our Porsche cars, with a focus on the older models not originally designed to run ethanol fuels. It will be published via the LN newsletter probably next month.
02-18-2018, 09:17 PM
#26
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And is my favorite gasoline providing the extra lubricity our cars need in their additive package already?
"According to Shell researcher Ed Nelson, the company’s V-Power Nitro+ claims to add “protection against wear and corrosion to the detergents our gasoline already contains” by adhering to affected parts for better lubrication while keeping water in the gasoline from doing the same for reduced corrosion"
"According to Shell researcher Ed Nelson, the company’s V-Power Nitro+ claims to add “protection against wear and corrosion to the detergents our gasoline already contains” by adhering to affected parts for better lubrication while keeping water in the gasoline from doing the same for reduced corrosion"
02-19-2018, 11:48 AM
#28
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I'm a big proponent with high performance and vintage engines to run a fuel additive with every other tank for fuel. I run Driven Carb Defender in the older cars and Injector Defender in newer cars. Likewise, if cars sit for 30 days or more without use, some sort of fuel stabilizer is a must. The e10 fuels don't have the shelf life of non-ethanol fuels.
02-19-2018, 11:59 AM
#29
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QUOTE=Charles Navarro;14812618]I just gave a talk at Porsche Tech Tactics this weekend in Easton, PA, and we touched on this.
I'm a big proponent with high performance and vintage engines to run a fuel additive with every other tank for fuel. I run Driven Carb Defender in the older cars and Injector Defender in newer cars. Likewise, if cars sit for 30 days or more without use, some sort of fuel stabilizer is a must. The e10 fuels don't have the shelf life of non-ethanol fuels.[/QUOTE]
Charles, Got any good links for vintage air cooled applications. I'd like to read up on this.
I'm a big proponent with high performance and vintage engines to run a fuel additive with every other tank for fuel. I run Driven Carb Defender in the older cars and Injector Defender in newer cars. Likewise, if cars sit for 30 days or more without use, some sort of fuel stabilizer is a must. The e10 fuels don't have the shelf life of non-ethanol fuels.[/QUOTE]
Charles, Got any good links for vintage air cooled applications. I'd like to read up on this.
02-19-2018, 12:23 PM
#30
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QUOTE=Charles Navarro;14812618]I just gave a talk at Porsche Tech Tactics this weekend in Easton, PA, and we touched on this.
I'm a big proponent with high performance and vintage engines to run a fuel additive with every other tank for fuel. I run Driven Carb Defender in the older cars and Injector Defender in newer cars. Likewise, if cars sit for 30 days or more without use, some sort of fuel stabilizer is a must. The e10 fuels don't have the shelf life of non-ethanol fuels.
I'm a big proponent with high performance and vintage engines to run a fuel additive with every other tank for fuel. I run Driven Carb Defender in the older cars and Injector Defender in newer cars. Likewise, if cars sit for 30 days or more without use, some sort of fuel stabilizer is a must. The e10 fuels don't have the shelf life of non-ethanol fuels.
Specifically on Fuels, I wrote and published this on FB and our newsletter a while back:
http://web-extract.constantcontact.c...bd334eb5e5.jpg
If you check out the LN Facebook account, there a few other articles on oils and such. All good reads. I try to publish mostly technical stuff to our subscribers, rather than spamming daily specials.