Intercooler concerns
02-12-2010, 09:30 PM
#17
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02-12-2010, 09:36 PM
#18
You can find it out by either run a theoretical model or practically measure the values. Looks by themselves are a bit deceiving and if your nephew is more than a bolt-on type of guy he should know this too. I wonder if he really knows what makes an intercooler work well and where the performance bottle necks are.
02-12-2010, 10:08 PM
#19
Race Director
02-13-2010, 06:51 AM
#20
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Seriously, you won't get any data unless you do it yourself....
02-13-2010, 08:31 AM
#21
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02-13-2010, 10:33 AM
#22
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Seriously...really who is going to tap and thread or weld a nipple for a gauge before and after the intercooler in the piping to do a pressure loss measurement or the same for IAT...SECAN who build $30,000 intercoolers for the Porche Race team dont even do this.
IAT can be measured if you go with a full standalone...but again...$10K...
So back to my original statement..
Yasin
IAT can be measured if you go with a full standalone...but again...$10K...
So back to my original statement..
Yasin
02-13-2010, 11:01 AM
#23
Race Director
Seriously...really who is going to tap and thread or weld a nipple for a gauge before and after the intercooler in the piping to do a pressure loss measurement or the same for IAT...SECAN who build $30,000 intercoolers for the Porche Race team dont even do this.
IAT can be measured if you go with a full standalone...but again...$10K...
So back to my original statement..
Yasin
IAT can be measured if you go with a full standalone...but again...$10K...
So back to my original statement..
Yasin
I'm actually amazed at how much more advanced mustang owners are when it comes to making power properly. Datalogging things like IAT 1 and 2 and pressure drop are extremely common.
02-13-2010, 03:47 PM
#24
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Can't you get the AIT from the OBD2? The stock intercooler has a temp sensor, aftermarket ones must have one for the ecu to work properly? Would have thought pretty simple to do with a obd2 gauge - no? My Scan gauge II can read AIT from the OBD2...
02-13-2010, 03:57 PM
#25
Race Director
right, you can then compare to ambient (which is not a bad way to go), but ideally you would want to measure iat post-turbo but pre-cooler, and then iat post cooler. Most reputable IC makers would do this, and test pressure drop. This should not be up to the end customer.
It kinda bothers me that tuning companies for high end cars can typically get away with a little engineering, and mostly flash and a high price tag to imply quality and performance, without actually doing a lot of testing. For the prices these companies charge, these items should be tested every which way.
As I mentioned before, the mustang tuning community (which has a lot of bad companies) generally forces parts manufacturers to provide hard data on parts. Dyno numbers, track times, Iat information, etc etc are always requested. I think Porsche owners owe it to themselves to request this kind of information from the porsche tuners. Otherwise they will continue to get away with selling shiny parts that may not be terribly effective at a high price.
It kinda bothers me that tuning companies for high end cars can typically get away with a little engineering, and mostly flash and a high price tag to imply quality and performance, without actually doing a lot of testing. For the prices these companies charge, these items should be tested every which way.
As I mentioned before, the mustang tuning community (which has a lot of bad companies) generally forces parts manufacturers to provide hard data on parts. Dyno numbers, track times, Iat information, etc etc are always requested. I think Porsche owners owe it to themselves to request this kind of information from the porsche tuners. Otherwise they will continue to get away with selling shiny parts that may not be terribly effective at a high price.
02-13-2010, 05:36 PM
#26
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the issue is the relative obscurity of the 993tt. the 996tt as a tuner platform is very advanced, largely due to increased # of cars and hence the increased market for parts. by the same logic it is easy to see why competitiveness in the mustang aftermarket has driven the aforementioned levels of advancement (as well as attracted the bottom feeders). as you can see from the pics, 993tt intercoolers aren't off an assembly line, they're built by hand and often designed & tested in the same fashion. btw, if you really want to see a small aftermarket check out what's available for the noble.
02-14-2010, 01:14 AM
#27
I like the look of the Protomotive I/C, so I'm not really looking to dump it. More or less looking for an explanation is all. Still wondering why they reduce the size of the inlets and then flare out again? Maybe I'll call Protomotive and see what there explanation is.
02-14-2010, 12:45 PM
#28
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I like the look of the Protomotive I/C, so I'm not really looking to dump it. More or less looking for an explanation is all. Still wondering why they reduce the size of the inlets and then flare out again? Maybe I'll call Protomotive and see what there explanation is.
I would stand by Todd's work in a heartbeat...
02-18-2010, 12:38 PM
#30
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I'm quite surprised looking at the pics, for some reason i always thought that Proto used bar and plate cores, but they are clearly tube and fin. The stock one is actually tube and fin too, which i mistakenly thought was the opposite. All the best coolers are bar and plate though right, Secan etc?