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My opinion is that if it can be returned to original with no evidence that it was ever altered, then there should be no value impact. If you take off a set of wheels and then put them back on, that does not impact value. If you take off springs and them put them back on, no impact. If you replace a maintenance item with OEM, no real impact. If you have access to the original shocks and springs, either because you keep them or they are still available from Porsche, you shouldn't have a problem. Selling the car with the non-stock springs should degrade value by at most the cost of getting the original springs back on the car.
In my case, I replaced the suspension on my car, but kept the original parts and will put it back on if I ever sell. I hate the SUV look and handling, but also agree that the value is lower unless I put the stock suspension back on:
Great looking S! Agreed and this why I kept the stock suspension, mufflers, rear undertray, wheels that I took off even though I knew I’d never put it back on for myself. I figured one day if I ever sold it someone may want it.
Originally Posted by 993TurboSMy opinion is that if it can be returned to original with no evidence that it was ever altered, then there should be no value impact. If you take off a set of wheels and then put them back on, that does not impact value. If you take off springs and them put them back on, no impact. If you replace a maintenance item with OEM, no real impact. If you have access to the original shocks and springs, either because you keep them or they are still available from Porsche, you shouldn't have a problem. Selling the car with the non-stock springs should degrade value by at most the cost of getting the original springs back on the car.
In my case, I replaced the suspension on my car, but kept the original parts and will put it back on if I ever sell. I hate the SUV look and handling, but also agree that the value is lower unless I put the stock suspension back on:Beautiful S you have.
I agree for the most part regarding the originality of a low production "S" model, but do you really think anyone with a non "S" is ever going to put the original stock suspension back on their car once they've upgraded it? Unless the stock suspension you have removed is in unused perfect working condition, why would you put it back on? The struts and shocks on these cars notoriously had a very short life. Anyone buying one of these 20 year old cars would know the suspension was shot if it was original.
Unless you have changed your engine and transmission with a different serial#, every modification (bolt on parts that is) is reversible.Slate993TT has a very nicely modified car. He mentioned that he modified the engine to gain another 100HP. Ruf has been doing it for years with great success. Ruf 993TT's command big money and they are modified extensively. Do Ruf cars get a pass because they have the Ruf name attached to them? Why is a Ruf with 500HP worth more than a non Ruf with 500HP? Just wondering............__________________
Bradford I agree with your points, it's kinda artificial. Certain name brand 'upgrades' - ruf/andial seem to command a premium. I guess there's some history behind those names. It's the same though with 'options' in a used car market, rarely do expensive 'options' add significant value to used cars. Never made sense to me. Having said that, I did buy a stock/original Ferrari 328, stock 928 and stock nsx too... You know that preowned Aston Martin poster with the hot women and caption about being 'used but do you really care?' I guess we do when we want to make it our own - and stock seem less used.
I think the point a lot of people here miss is that the value of these cars is not driven by the enthusiast community - it's driven by the investors, the collectors, and the non-Porschephile. They are the ones who drove the prices to sky high levels over the past few years. These groups want stock, unmolested cars. If the market was driven by enthusiasts, I argue these cars would not be valued north of $100k. In my opinion good ones would hover around the $70-$80k mark, like NSX's and 355's.
In terms of why a RUF is worth more than a car that may be simply modified by a Porsche speed shop or a guy wrenching in his yard, among lots of other things, RUF cars carry a very unique provenance- in fact, real RUF cars are VIN'd directly through RUF . Google Porsche RUF and see what went into these cars (and still does).
I like to think of mine as one that performs just as good or better than a RUF and I didn't have to pay the $$$ to enjoy that feeling. Hope the next owner of it feels the same way. I really like RUF's btw the same way I love Ferrari's and all types of cars I can't afford. What I love even more is making the cars I do own perform like the higher dollar ones. I agree that it wasn't the enthusiasts the drove up the price of the Oil-Cooled 911's.
Originally Posted by Basal SkullBradford I agree with your points, it's kinda artificial. Certain name brand 'upgrades' - ruf/andial seem to command a premium. I guess there's some history behind those names. It's the same though with 'options' in a used car market, rarely do expensive 'options' add significant value to used cars. Never made sense to me. Having said that, I did buy a stock/original Ferrari 328, stock 928 and stock nsx too... You know that preowned Aston Martin poster with the hot women and caption about being 'used but do you really care?' I guess we do when we want to make it our own - and stock seem less used.
Yes it seems that the only factory option on our cars that adds value are sport seats
Quote:
Originally Posted by njcycleguyI think the point a lot of people here miss is that the value of these cars is not driven by the enthusiast community - it's driven by the investors, the collectors, and the non-Porschephile. They are the ones who drove the prices to sky high levels over the past few years. These groups want stock, unmolested cars. If the market was driven by enthusiasts, I argue these cars would not be valued north of $100k. In my opinion good ones would hover around the $70-$80k mark, like NSX's and 355's.
In terms of why a RUF is worth more than a car that may be simply modified by a Porsche speed shop or a guy wrenching in his yard, among lots of other things, RUF cars carry a very unique provenance- in fact, real RUF cars are VIN'd directly through RUF . Google Porsche RUF and see what went into these cars (and still does).
Let me first say that I am a big fan of the Ruf product . I am not talking about the Ruf VIN cars.I am talking about the Turbo R, where anyone can take their 993TT to the RUF auto center and have them modify the engine to the 500HP range with cams, turbos, re-programmed ECU etc. These engines are built by a representative of Ruf. Other than the ECU programming and possibly the turbos, are there any other parts they use that are proprietary to Ruf? What do you do if you have a problem with your Ruf engine and you need to have it serviced by one of their representatives? Are there any Ruf shops in the US?
Whereas, Slate993TT gets his engine done by a local Porsche trained master mechanic that he can take to for service at any time.
I think there is this perception that if Ruf (I think this only holds true for the 993TT) doesn't build your engine, then it must be substandard. Otherwise, the value of a quality built engine by a local Porsche trained master mechanic should be worth that of a Ruf built engine??? We are not talking about the Yellowbird where Ruf blew people away with their performance or their 911 years ago. We are talking about a very well thought out mid range powered engine package that Ruf builds but is easily duplicated by others for the 993TT.
This is not in any way a slam on Ruf. I just want to open a dialogue to see what others think.
Good luck with the sale - I think you priced it realistically but I guess we shall see. I was considering this car when Bert had it for sale but really wanted arena red.
You may want to mention the interior color change in your ad though - which was a good move IMO.
Good luck with the sale - I think you priced it realistically but I guess we shall see. I was considering this car when Bert had it for sale but really wanted arena red.
You may want to mention the interior color change in your ad though - which was a good move IMO.
Done and thank for you agreeing it was a good move. Every person I have spoken to interested in the car I walk them through the Interior change and what I had done. The Classic Grey just wasn't for me. I had the work professionally done about 5 years ago and have loved it ever since. It wasn't cheap but in the end worth every penny!
Last edited by Slate993tt; 01-11-2018 at 09:44 PM.
Reason: typo
Link? I found your 997 Cab S ad but not the 993TT.
it's not listed in the vehicle marketplace and that's why you aren't seeing it. I have it listed in the Member to Member ads section but only paying Rennlist members can see that as I didn't want to be inundated with solicitations of specialty dealers etc. My first choice is to have it go to a Rennlister. So far it seemed like a good move as the car is in a Sales Pending status after 1 day of that ad being posted. It also has 2 back-up offers as of today.
If you can't go into that section just PM me with your questions and I'll be happy to help you. I listed it for $120k.
Good luck with the sale - I think you priced it realistically but I guess we shall see. I was considering this car when Bert had it for sale but really wanted arena red.
You may want to mention the interior color change in your ad though - which was a good move IMO.
Originally Posted by chsu74
Remember this car in DC FS originally. Good move on the black interior change. It was what held me back at that time. GLWTS.
Oh and thank you both for passing on it so I could enjoy it!!! This has been such a joy to own and I have a feeling the next owner is going to love it as much as I did. I know there will be many days that I regret no longer it owning it but the memories will always be with me. Also if all goes right I may be able to continue to virtually see updates on the car via Rennlist. :-)
12-12-2017, 10:53 PM
Bradford I agree with your points, it's kinda artificial. Certain name brand 'upgrades' - ruf/andial seem to command a premium. I guess there's some history behind those names. It's the same though with 'options' in a used car market, rarely do expensive 'options' add significant value to used cars. Never made sense to me. Having said that, I did buy a stock/original Ferrari 328, stock 928 and stock nsx too... You know that preowned Aston Martin poster with the hot women and caption about being 'used but do you really care?' I guess we do when we want to make it our own - and stock seem less used. 
. I am not talking about the Ruf VIN cars.I am talking about the Turbo R, where anyone can take their 993TT to the RUF auto center and have them modify the engine to the 500HP range with cams, turbos, re-programmed ECU etc. These engines are built by a representative of Ruf. Other than the ECU programming and possibly the turbos, are there any other parts they use that are proprietary to Ruf? What do you do if you have a problem with your Ruf engine and you need to have it serviced by one of their representatives? Are there any Ruf shops in the US?
