squidge

I've been researching coilovers for weeks now, and found that AST (Moton owner) has a nice entry-level product that competes with the PSS10:

http://www.ast-suspension.com/shop/s...era-2-4-detail (The photo is generic, it does not include a wheel carrier)

There's a digressive valve option, and if I order from their European site and take advantage of exchange rate, the pricing is pretty appealing -- $2200 USD (vs. $3000 through US site), plus shipping on my account, which I get an excellent deal on through my employer. Note that I actually didn't want the expense or complication of something adjustable and am not looking to go with the PSS10, but a digressive valved, adjustable option for $2200 is really appealing.

Is anyone running these? They're still another $600 over my primary choice so I can't just order on a whim. I found some positive reviews for their 996 and BMW products.

nine9six

Are not PSS10's in that price range, +/- $100?

squidge

From a US seller, PSS10s are $2700-$3000. Through Gert, around $2400. But then they lose the lifetime warranty, although I'd probably be in a comparable situation if I ordered ASTs from Europe.

The ASTs' more modern design piques my interest. The PSS10s just don't seem compelling enough to me to spend the extra money, given the other things the car needs, like an eventual top end and clutch.

I'll likely end up going with my original plan: the inexpensive H&R Street Performance coilovers with RS ARBs, which I will some day have rebuilt to digressive when the first damper fails. These are essentially Bilstein HDs with matched springs. I've had adjustable dampers before and I'm just not that into fiddling with them. I'd rather have what I have and fine tune with RS ARBs if I feel the need.

Vandit

Back when I was autocrossing a bunch a few years ago, all the fast guys were running ASTs, usually on bimmers.

squidge

I emailed their HQ to ask about spring rates, if they'll ship to me in the US (circumventing their US outlet in CA which would charge me tax + $185 for shipping on an already higher price), and for photos of the actual product. We'll see.

squidge

Following up with their response.

Their HQ in the Netherlands will ship to the US, quoted around €120.

Spring rates are 40N front, 90N rear, which equates to 228/512-lbs/inch. They commonly outfit them with an upgraded 60/110, or 342/628, which is probably what I would go for.

Photo of their 964 product attached. I'm not wild about the rebound adjustment being on the top of the rear shock, but it otherwise looks like a nice piece. Also not sure what their rear droplink mount looks like, but in other generic photos it looked like a nice quality, clamp on piece similar to what Tarrett offers.

So all in, about $2400 USD shipped with double digressive valve option. Still thinking about going this route. Rennlisters seem to love the Bilstein path, but I'd like to have the most modern option possible.

Ivan J

What makes you think that the AST are more modern or otherwise better than PSS10? The PSS10 is a proven system for the 993, many consider it the gold standard for street use. How many positive reviews have you found for the AST, specific to the 993?

If you shop around, you should be able to buy the PSS10s for about the same price. The shop that installed mine were able to beat Gert's price.

squidge

Digressive valving is a more modern technology, period. The 5100s are a comparable monotube design to the PSS10s, but also are modular and can be upgraded to the 5200 or 5300 spec (double or triple adjustable). I never said they were "better," just seem to offer more on paper for the money. Tons of people using a product doesn't mean it's the best choice or value, just means it's the most commonly recommended.

I've found barely any feedback on these in actual use on a 993, hence this whole thread. The shop that installed yours probably ate part of the cost of the suspension to gain your business and labor income, so that's not exactly comparable to a straight parts purchase.

Ivan J

As I understand it, the PSS10s come with digressive valves. Obviously, its your money so do as you wish. It just seems like a lot to shell out for something doesn't seem to have a proven track record for the 993 application, unless you think that an upgrade path to double or triple damping adjustments provides some value to you.

I'm sure that nobody lost any money by selling PSS10s to me for a discount. At the time (about 1 year ago), they were available from multiple sources for about the same price. Best of luck, whatever upgrade path you choose....

nine9six

...And this statement above would be nothing more than an assumption on your part, right?

I have no dog in this hunt, but if you are trying to convince yourself this is the best way to go; then all this is senseless and maybe you should just buy them.

I think you make some very valid points in support of what seems to be your decision; especially if the suspension pkg. is that adaptable and upgrade friendly, (but at what overall price), and after upgrading, what could you have had, with the money spent?

It seems all you need to do now, is make it so.

You never mentioned what is the primary purpose for your suspension upgrade, and after all this, I still cant ignore this statement either, as it seems to contradict itself.

squidge

Thanks guys. You raise valid points. Not sure there's anything else to be said here unless someone with the product decides to chime in. In the meantime, I'll decide if the extra money for something adjustable is worth it to me period, and then decide between AST or Bilstein.

MarinS4

I have direct experience running AST 5220's (dual adjustable w/remotes) in my Miata track car. I consider the quality to be right up there with Moton's. Total game changer for that car over the Koni's I use to run.

From what I remember the 5100 is a basic steel body shock. The 5200 series jumps up to aluminum. Not a deal breaker but just FYI. The front strut piston diameter looks to be similar to bilstein and bigger than stock.

IMHO what's gonna make or break them is the valving. Did AST get it right the first time? Don't know but be prepared for revalving cost if they didn't. The safe bet is the PSS10's but AST when setup properly will be better IMHO.

Good luck with your decision whichever way you go.