Martin S.

I have heard from a number of sources that the rubber compound on the Kumho Ecsta V700 has been changed resulting in an improved tire. I was about to buy a set of Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tires, $300 more a set, when I thought I'd give the Kumhos with the new compound a try. I am having some additional camber dialed into my car to see if I can make them work better.

The best set up, I have been told by Rick from Kumho, is to heat cycle the tires, and shave them. I am still too cheap to see 2/32 of rubber ground off the tire. This leaves me with only 4/32 to play with.
I'll report back after the 1st of December, the POC event at Willow Springs. Pray for good weather!

Hank Cohn

Martin:

The Kumho's are an O.K. tire, but if it is not too late, change your order to the Michelin Pilot Sport Cups. I assure you that you will at least triple the life of the Kumhos at a minimum. The grip is amazing and it is consistent throughout a session, weekend, and multiple heat cycles beyond. Just try them. You will be thanking me lap after lap after lap after………………………….

Hank

FlyYellow

i'm also going to be replacing my tires in the near future. Currently I'm running the Pzero C Dry.

I'm curious if anyone can compare the longitivity performance of the Khumo V700, Michellin Pilot Sport Cup's and the PZero C.

My impression is that the Pzero's and the Pilot last a similar amount of time and the Khumo's last substantially less time. Would anyone share their experiences.

Also does anyone have a good price source for either the Pzero's or the Pilot Sport Cups?

Cheers,
boris

Bill Gregory

I've got 225x17 and 245x17 Kumho V700's with around 13 DE days on them, and comfortably another 3-4 days to go.

Vinny '98 3.8 C2S

Per Bill: I've got 225x17 and 245x17 Kumho V700's with around 13 DE days on them, and comfortably another 3-4 days to go

This must be due to particular tracks driven and driving style. I've been using V700's for a few years (full tread) and I'm very happy if I get 7-8 days from them. I also drive to and from the track, but the streeet wear is inconsequential.

Per Hank: I assure you that you will at least triple the life of the Kumhos at a minimum

Can I really expect 21-24 days from a set of Sport Cups? That sounds near impossible. The price is about double vs. Kumho's so I'd settle for 15 days, or even 10-12 if they're really that much faster.

Robert Henriksen

If only Michelin made a 275-40/17!

Martin S.

"You don't tug on Superman's cape, you don't spit into the wind" and you don't disregard Hank Cohn's advice.

I cancelled the Kumho EcstaV700 order and have a set of Pilot Sport Cups coming from Tire Rack. It would be nice if they had a 275 rear...but they dont. Thanks for the advice Hank!!!

Front: 225 X 45 X 17
Rear: 255 X 40 X 17

Read the recent Panorama article on the Pilot Sport Cups...you'll have to have a set!
<img src="graemlins/jumper.gif" border="0" alt="[jumper]" />

PS: I never see/saw any more than about 5 track days on the Kumho VictoRacer V700 tires. It may be because of the track, Willow Springs International Raceway. Also, at the Streets of Willow, I got 4 days, period, finito, no mas! The good news on the Kumhos, you could flip them on the wheel for extra wear.

I am having some extra camber dialed into the car. I was running on 993RS specs, now to something a little more aggressive.

H20NOO

I've been running Kumho Ecsta's for my last 3 track days and am NOT buying another set. I run 225 and 275x17's. They grip well when cold and get better when they warm up but then they just get hotter and hotter until you find yourself slipping and sliding all over the place after just 10 minutes or so. In addition, when the temps soar, so do the pressures. I've run as little as 26lbs (cold) and they still get up to 36-37lbs after 20 minutes of track time. I've found the "sweet spot" to be around the 33-34lbs range. I ran a set at 38lbs (hot) once and wore out the centers in a single track day.

The Kumho's are fine for autocross or easy driving on the track (what's the point?) but if you push your car hard, Michelins are the superior tire and worth the extra $$.

MC

Jean-Marc

[quote]Originally posted by Hank Cohn:
<strong>Martin:

The Kumho's are an O.K. tire, but if it is not too late, change your order to the Michelin Pilot Sport Cups. I assure you that you will at least triple the life of the Kumhos at a minimum. The grip is amazing and it is consistent throughout a session, weekend, and multiple heat cycles beyond. Just try them. You will be thanking me lap after lap after lap after………………………….

Hank</strong><hr></blockquote>


Yeah he'll be thanking you !!! Unlike me (remember when you told me tires were disposables and I should go cheap ) who on Kuhmos that are at least 2 seconds slower see nothing but back bumpers of Michelin shod cars! no sunshine for me on Kumho! Listen to Hank

Robert Henriksen

[quote]Originally posted by Martin:
<strong>"You don't tug on Superman's cape, you don't spit into the wind" and you don't disregard Hank Cohn's advice. </strong><hr></blockquote>

<img src="graemlins/roflmao.gif" border="0" alt="[hiha]" />

I cancelled the Kumho EcstaV700 order and have a set of Pilot Sport Cups coming from Tire Rack. It would be nice if they had a 275 rear...but they dont. Thanks for the advice Hank!!!

Front: 225 X 45 X 17
Rear: 255 X 40 X 17

Hm... I initially started w. those tire sizes, but the car would oversteer badly w. RoW M030 and RS alignment. When I went to 225/275, life was great! I'll be interested to hear how this setup feels for you.

Ray Calvo

[quote]I cancelled the Kumho EcstaV700 order and have a set of Pilot Sport Cups coming from Tire Rack. It would be nice if they had a 275 rear...but they dont. Thanks for the advice Hank!!!

Front: 225 X 45 X 17
Rear: 255 X 40 X 17

Hm... I initially started w. those tire sizes, but the car would oversteer badly w. RoW M030 and RS alignment. When I went to 225/275, life was great! <hr></blockquote>

Strange; I have ROW M030 springs and US M030 bars/struts on my '95. Aligned to Euro specs (which might be the difference). Have consistently run 205/50 or (later) 225/45 in front and 255/40X17 in rear; for track either BFG R1, Bridgestone RE-71, or Kuhmo Victoracers. NEVER had an oversteer problem; car is the most controllable, stable 911 I've ever owned. Yes, it will oversteer if you REALLY lift in a corner, but not if you keep your foot planted on the gas (steady gas or accelerate). I can also quite comfortably throttle-steer with it.

The Kuhmo's lasted about 5 track days. I'll spend the money for the Michelins next time.

PeanutinCA

Hmmmm, some interesting points here. And, somewhat consistent the Victoracer's. I know the thread is about the V700 but they sound the same in characteristics as the Victo's.

Now, I tried them shaved, after the first weekend (2 days, Streets of Willow), they looked almost like slicks. I unfortunately drove them on the street to and from work (11 miles) for about 2 months and this I think destroyed them? Although I can't be sure of that because the next event was brutally hot and everyone was slip sliding all over the place. Now, first weekend on them, I was thrashing my class competitor by 5 seconds, but he was on streets. But that also meant (with tires, front brakes and service on my car) I had picked up 7 seconds or so from my previous event, made it a worth wile purchase. After the 2 month break, my competitor came back with some track rubber and beat me by 3 tenths of as second, DOH!!

Now, set number 2, DIDN'T shave them. Still reasonably high track temps at Streets of Willow. Promptly went out that weekend and got Class track record in the Counter Clockwise direction, left after 2 days of driving/racing and found them to have as much tread depth as the first set when they came shaved. So there is 2 extra days. Remember, when I came back for the second weekend or 3rd and 4th track day on the first set, they were basically slicks but still usuable. Just not very fast or grippy. So I have just done another single day on the second set at the streets again and they are still good, good enough for class track record but this time in the clockwise direction. I did the flip of the tires this for this weekend and felt no loss in adhesion.

To summarize;
1) Tried the Kuhmos shaved and not shaved, would not shave again. Best times on non shaved BUT heat cycled (as I didn't have the time to heat cycle myself).
1.a) I think I will get slightly longer life NOT shaving the tires?
2) Flipped the tires between weekends, felt no loss in traction.
3) I run the pressures higher on my 3,000lb car and find better grip than when I was convinved to run them at low 30's. Anywhere from 36 to 40 works fine for me.
4) After 10 minutes, the tire does go away but a clean session and I can post times within half a second, consistently? The car slides more but the times remain the same, it's probably just more effort to do so.
5) If I could get another 1-2 seconds with the Michelin's (I will be trying them), giddy up!! That will put me into a V3 track record (Counter clockwise at Streets) in my daily driver.

Can't wait to hit the big track with the big boys next year. I'm sure that's where the real competition is.

Sorry for the long post.

Cheers,
Dylan.

Robert Henriksen

[quote]Originally posted by Ray Calvo:
[QB]

Strange; I have ROW M030 springs and US M030 bars/struts on my '95. Aligned to Euro specs (which might be the difference). Have consistently run 205/50 or (later) 225/45 in front and 255/40X17 in rear; for track either BFG R1, Bridgestone RE-71, or Kuhmo Victoracers. NEVER had an oversteer problem; car is the most controllable, stable 911 I've ever owned. Yes, it will oversteer if you REALLY lift in a corner, but not if you keep your foot planted on the gas (steady gas or accelerate). I can also quite comfortably throttle-steer with it.[QB]<hr></blockquote>

I believe I wound up w. ~1.2 negative camber front, ~1.4 negative rear -- you?

As to the oversteer, turns 2 and 5 @ TWS were the most memorable (w. 225/255) w. the back stepping right out under steady throttle, not pinching the car w. excessive steering. This was when I'd ramped up my speeds and was really steaming through the turns.

DJ

Peanut,

What class does your car run in, and what times did you turn?

PeanutinCA

[quote]Originally posted by DJ:
<strong>Peanut,

What class does your car run in, and what times did you turn?</strong><hr></blockquote>

I put a Supercup wing on so they stuck me in MP (Production).

Lets see, Counter clockwise at the Streets of course was a 1:16.91, updated on the POC website. Oh yeah, they have those details a little more up to date these days.
Clockwise, was a 1:17.3?, yet to be updated.

I'm contemplating fitting my car with a limited slip? Perhaps some different gearing but I want to see how the gearing is on the big track first anyway?

I explain it as recklessness from driving on the wrong side of the car (I'm Australian).

Edit: hmmm, I had discussions with someone about their track record, being half a second off, I thought it was for V3 as mentioned earlier but it doesn't look like it now that I look at the website updates?

Cheers,
Dylan.