Cap'n Krusty

New member. Well, not exactly "new", I was active on the 914 forum way back before it became rennlist. 1996 993, died at a stop sign. Checked the relay by jumping the pins in the fuse/relay box. Car started and ran. Replaced the relay with one of the correct part number (KAE brand, made in Germany). Started and ran. Shut it down, let it sit for a couple of days .................. No start. Runs with jumper in place, but not with the relay. Anyone here that can supply the pinouts for 1996 DME relay, part number 993 615 227 00? Gonna do the Durametric thing first of the week, but I'd like to be equipped to do a little testing beyond that if necessary. Might be good to have a DME unit pinout, as well, if someone here has that. It should be noted that this is a different relay from those installed in previous model years, and the pinouts are NOT the same as '95 and earlier 993s.

While I'm asking, are there any common input failures that could be the cause of this issue?

Thanks for reading this, and thanks in advance for any help you can give me. I have a ton of experience on older 911s, but 964s and 993s are way out of my area of expertise!

The Cap'n

71-3.0-911

Relay most likely bad. Replace and enjoy. Why bother with jumper?

IainM

It's printed on the relay itself:
http://p-car.com/diy/relay/

IainM

A lot of folk have opened them up and resoldered the spades - apparently that's the weak spot.

Cap'n Krusty

Thanks for the replies so far! I realize the diagram is printed on the relay. Unfortunately, the wiring diagram from Mitchell doesn't identify the pins using either the simple numbers (i.e.1-9) used on the relay itself, nor the conventional numbers used on German relays. I've matched those numbers (i.e., 1=85, 2=30, etc.), but the wiring diagram doesn't identify them by either number and I am having trouble determining the signals I am supposed to see at (9) 85b, (1) 85, and (3) 86, and when I'm supposed to see them. All the pinout lists I've seen so far are for earlier relays and list pin numbers I don't even have (i.e., 5, 6, and 7).

The Cap'n

Cap'n Krusty

Missed the first reply in my response. I HAVE replaced the relay, as I said in my original post.

The Cap'n

Lorenfb

"Checked the relay by jumping the pins in the fuse/relay box. Car started and ran. Replaced the relay with one of the correct part number (KAE brand, made in Germany). Started and ran. Shut it down, let it sit for a couple of days .................. No start. Runs with jumper in place, but not with the relay."

Since it's a '96 993 it should have the 88 pin DME ECM. Since it starts and
runs with the DME relay jumped, then immobilizer is sending the start
command after it received the remote transmitter signal.

The DME relay pin 85 gets its trigger ground from pin 27 of the DME ECM.
Pin 87 of the relay provides #15 power to pin 54 of the DME ECM. The DME
ECM must receive #15 power on pin 56 from the alarm ECU to activate the
relay by grounding pin 27 of the DME ECM. Pin 86 of the relay is #15 power.

Cap'n Krusty

Thanks, Loren! One more pin: 85b?

The Cap'n

Lorenfb

Pin 85b goes to pin 63 of the DME ECM.

Cap'n Krusty

Thanks! Can you tell me what signal I should see there, and under what condition(s)?

The Cap'n

Vorsicht

Look up the "DME Relay DIY" to see how to fix the relay.

Lorenfb

When cranking or running, both pin 85 & 85b should be at ground.
Pin 86 should 12 volts with the key on.

NC TRACKRAT

What we're all saying here is that even new parts can fail or be bad from the get-go, even OEM parts.

TMc993

I sent Cap'n Krusty over here from the Pelican board. I think he is looking for a deeper level of understanding than just "plug 'n play."

Cap'n Krusty

Thanks, Terry, and thanks to Loren and the others who have offered help. I'm taking the old relay to a neighbor who has the knowledge and skills, as well as the equipment, to inspect and properly resolder the board in the relay and we'll go from there ...............

The Cap'n