Bad Dealer Alert! Jack Daniels Porsche pooches a PPI
03-26-2014, 08:08 PM
#61
Drifting
Let this be a lesson for OP, his uncle and future buyers...ask rennlist where to do PPI, that's where Porsche ownership starts...oh...and never buy cars in New York City.
Good news is that oil leak and SAI light doesn't automatically mean top end...and if top end hasn't been done you should expect it sooner or later (hopefully much later) in any case.
Just let this be a lesson and move on...get the SAI flush, change the gaskets and go from there.
I'm afraid to ask, but has the clutch been replaced? Considering the car was in the city it might be due for a new clutch and it ain't cheap.
Good news is that oil leak and SAI light doesn't automatically mean top end...and if top end hasn't been done you should expect it sooner or later (hopefully much later) in any case.
Just let this be a lesson and move on...get the SAI flush, change the gaskets and go from there.
I'm afraid to ask, but has the clutch been replaced? Considering the car was in the city it might be due for a new clutch and it ain't cheap.
03-26-2014, 09:27 PM
#62
I took Karl to NJ with me for the PPI. He put his tools in a suitcase and we jumped a flight. Seller who was not an enthusiast agreed in advance to let us take the car to a Rennlisters house that had a lift.
It was a fun and pleasurable experience. I stood right there under the car and watch the leakdown and compression numbers.
It was a fun and pleasurable experience. I stood right there under the car and watch the leakdown and compression numbers.
03-26-2014, 10:00 PM
#63
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
The shop provided the estimate today - $8k in total for rebuilding the heads including 5 angle grind of the valves, and fixing the oil leaks. They'll be checking the clutch and FW while the engine's out, which it already is.
He emailed and sent a letter to the GM and QA Manager at JD Porsche, and sent me the following comments: "If JD were to give me $4,000 I’d be fine. If not I’ll suggest that within a month every single Porsche Dealer in North America will receive 4 copies of the work orders and a letter; one copy to the owner, one to the Sales Manager, one to the General Manager and one to the Service Department. In addition, every Porsche Club in North America will receive the same information for posting on a bulletin board or in a newsletter. Some will, some won’t. Might do some good in that these two Managers might be concerned that word will eventually get back to the 2 brothers. Look how quickly the news travelled to you and your “993” gang [referring to you guys, the Rennlist 993 board]. Porsche owners are different than Chevy owners, I think."
Yeah, I think we are
He emailed and sent a letter to the GM and QA Manager at JD Porsche, and sent me the following comments: "If JD were to give me $4,000 I’d be fine. If not I’ll suggest that within a month every single Porsche Dealer in North America will receive 4 copies of the work orders and a letter; one copy to the owner, one to the Sales Manager, one to the General Manager and one to the Service Department. In addition, every Porsche Club in North America will receive the same information for posting on a bulletin board or in a newsletter. Some will, some won’t. Might do some good in that these two Managers might be concerned that word will eventually get back to the 2 brothers. Look how quickly the news travelled to you and your “993” gang [referring to you guys, the Rennlist 993 board]. Porsche owners are different than Chevy owners, I think."
Yeah, I think we are
03-26-2014, 10:09 PM
#64
Rennlist Member
The shop provided the estimate today - $8k in total for rebuilding the heads including 5 angle grind of the valves, and fixing the oil leaks. They'll be checking the clutch and FW while the engine's out, which it already is.
He emailed and sent a letter to the GM and QA Manager at JD Porsche, and sent me the following comments: "If JD were to give me $4,000 I’d be fine. If not I’ll suggest that within a month every single Porsche Dealer in North America will receive 4 copies of the work orders and a letter; one copy to the owner, one to the Sales Manager, one to the General Manager and one to the Service Department. In addition, every Porsche Club in North America will receive the same information for posting on a bulletin board or in a newsletter. Some will, some won’t. Might do some good in that these two Managers might be concerned that word will eventually get back to the 2 brothers. Look how quickly the news travelled to you and your “993” gang [referring to you guys, the Rennlist 993 board]. Porsche owners are different than Chevy owners, I think."
Yeah, I think we are
He emailed and sent a letter to the GM and QA Manager at JD Porsche, and sent me the following comments: "If JD were to give me $4,000 I’d be fine. If not I’ll suggest that within a month every single Porsche Dealer in North America will receive 4 copies of the work orders and a letter; one copy to the owner, one to the Sales Manager, one to the General Manager and one to the Service Department. In addition, every Porsche Club in North America will receive the same information for posting on a bulletin board or in a newsletter. Some will, some won’t. Might do some good in that these two Managers might be concerned that word will eventually get back to the 2 brothers. Look how quickly the news travelled to you and your “993” gang [referring to you guys, the Rennlist 993 board]. Porsche owners are different than Chevy owners, I think."
Yeah, I think we are
03-26-2014, 10:19 PM
#65
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
yep, he showed me the letter and it's fantastic. Polite and professional, but firm in his stance. He included both service records, with Gunbarrel's notes. He knows his chances of getting any remuneration are slim, but the dealership does need to hear about this.
He's looking forward to enjoying his beautiful car in a few weeks when he gets it back. And despite being a little sore about getting shafted, he sees the bright side - he'll have a gorgeous car with fresh heads and lots of smiles per mile ahead of him.
He's looking forward to enjoying his beautiful car in a few weeks when he gets it back. And despite being a little sore about getting shafted, he sees the bright side - he'll have a gorgeous car with fresh heads and lots of smiles per mile ahead of him.
03-26-2014, 10:22 PM
#66
The shop provided the estimate today - $8k in total for rebuilding the heads including 5 angle grind of the valves, and fixing the oil leaks. They'll be checking the clutch and FW while the engine's out, which it already is.
He emailed and sent a letter to the GM and QA Manager at JD Porsche, and sent me the following comments: "If JD were to give me $4,000 I’d be fine. If not I’ll suggest that within a month every single Porsche Dealer in North America will receive 4 copies of the work orders and a letter; one copy to the owner, one to the Sales Manager, one to the General Manager and one to the Service Department. In addition, every Porsche Club in North America will receive the same information for posting on a bulletin board or in a newsletter. Some will, some won’t.
He emailed and sent a letter to the GM and QA Manager at JD Porsche, and sent me the following comments: "If JD were to give me $4,000 I’d be fine. If not I’ll suggest that within a month every single Porsche Dealer in North America will receive 4 copies of the work orders and a letter; one copy to the owner, one to the Sales Manager, one to the General Manager and one to the Service Department. In addition, every Porsche Club in North America will receive the same information for posting on a bulletin board or in a newsletter. Some will, some won’t.
03-26-2014, 10:29 PM
#68
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
No, he didn't mention the smear campaign in his letter to the dealer, that was just his personal correspondence to me alone. He's going to give JD Porsche every chance to do the right thing (whatever that is) before he even thinks about threatening to do anything.
03-26-2014, 10:29 PM
#69
Drifting
$8k is lot of work...I hope that includes new valve guides (I believe non-OEM are recommended)...dealers or indy will push for as much work as possible for simple things.
For example, I needed new steering boots...a very good shop quoted me 400 (because of alignment), it was a simple diy with 10$ in parts...no alignment needed if you do it differently.
Another shop charged somebody $350 for front/rear deck gas struts...it's 100 in parts (Porsche genuine parts) and 1 hour (being first time) of fiddling around with a few pins and clips.
Brake fluid flush from a local dealer ... ready?... $380 dollars! Another shop quoted $160, and another one did it for $80. All top very well regarded Porsche shops.
For example, I needed new steering boots...a very good shop quoted me 400 (because of alignment), it was a simple diy with 10$ in parts...no alignment needed if you do it differently.
Another shop charged somebody $350 for front/rear deck gas struts...it's 100 in parts (Porsche genuine parts) and 1 hour (being first time) of fiddling around with a few pins and clips.
Brake fluid flush from a local dealer ... ready?... $380 dollars! Another shop quoted $160, and another one did it for $80. All top very well regarded Porsche shops.
03-26-2014, 10:36 PM
#70
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
The car could be driven like this, but sooner or later the valve job is going to have to be done, and my uncle would rather take care of the job now and not have to worry about dealing with this problem again. I agree with his reasoning.
03-26-2014, 10:41 PM
#71
Also sounds like the new shop is painting highly unlikely occurrences, such as worn valve guides resulting in some imminent catastrophic engine failure to milk as much money as they can from this situation. An imminent catastrophic engine failure due to worn valve guides is so highly unlikely to occur, and I doubt a regular PPI would be expected to examine things such as worn valve guides, though I could be mistaken about this.
As others have said, all that may really need to be done is a few gaskets changed and an SAI clear out to get this car up to speed, who knows at this point. That would cost hundreds, not an $8K top-end. Curious as to whether your Uncle paid for a leakdown and compression test with his PPI from JDP. If not, they wouldn't know or be expected to know some of this info, I'd think.
Be careful that your Uncle and new shop don't take a legitimate beef and screw it up by getting overzealous.
03-26-2014, 10:50 PM
#72
Drifting
Sounds like your uncle got screwed by the PPI.
Also sounds like the new shop is painting highly unlikely occurrences, such as worn valve guides resulting in some imminent catastrophic engine failure to milk as much money as they can from this situation. A catastrophic engine failure due to worn valve guides is so highly unlikely to occur, and I doubt a regular PPI would be expected to examine things such as this, though I could me mistaken.
As others have said, all that may really need to be done is a few gaskets changed and an SAI clear out to get this car up to speed. That would cost hundreds, not an $8K top-end. Curious as to whether your Uncle paid for a leakdown and compression test with his PPI♦ from JDP. If not, they wouldn't know or be expected to know some of this info, I'd think.
Be careful that your Uncle and new shop don't take a legitimate beef and screw it up by getting overzealous.
Also sounds like the new shop is painting highly unlikely occurrences, such as worn valve guides resulting in some imminent catastrophic engine failure to milk as much money as they can from this situation. A catastrophic engine failure due to worn valve guides is so highly unlikely to occur, and I doubt a regular PPI would be expected to examine things such as this, though I could me mistaken.
As others have said, all that may really need to be done is a few gaskets changed and an SAI clear out to get this car up to speed. That would cost hundreds, not an $8K top-end. Curious as to whether your Uncle paid for a leakdown and compression test with his PPI♦ from JDP. If not, they wouldn't know or be expected to know some of this info, I'd think.
Be careful that your Uncle and new shop don't take a legitimate beef and screw it up by getting overzealous.
03-26-2014, 11:14 PM
#73
Rennlist Member
If not I’ll suggest that within a month every single Porsche Dealer in North America will receive 4 copies of the work orders and a letter; one copy to the owner, one to the Sales Manager, one to the General Manager and one to the Service Department. In addition, every Porsche Club in North America will receive the same information for posting on a bulletin board or in a newsletter.
