Mike J

I am trying to diagnose a weird problem on my 96 Targa.

1 - Occasionally, the right hand signal lights (front and back) stay on, no blinking, and stay on regardless of the ignition or turn signal position

2 - The dashboard turn signal indicator pointing right also stays locked on.

3 - If the turn signal stalk it put to left turn, the left turn signal lights blink. If the emergency flashers are put on, no blinking occurs.

4 - Its intermittent, yesterday this happened before going into a restaurant. I pulled the fuses for the right front and rear signal lights, and went to dinner leaving the dashboard right signal light on. Came back about an hour later, still on, started the car and drove off. The signal light went off within 10 minutes.

I have replaced the blinker relay (although i did not think it was a problem since I could still signal left), and checked the plug on the emergency flasher switch...both good.

Obviously, I will dig further, but this could be a royal pain. Any else seen this? I did a search, it most people with a similar problem solved it with a new signal relay and/or reseating the emergency flasher switch. I have done both to no avail. Of course, its harder when its intermittent, and I do not want to be stranded somewhere because my battery was drained by stuck lights.

Cheers,

Mike

ilko

My hunch is that there is a short in the turn signal stalk somewhere. What I think you're experiencing is the parking lights engaging on their own.

Mike J

This raises a good idea, I seem to remember there is a parking light system to help parking. Not sure how that works, need to break out the manual and check the wiring diagram.

Cheers,

Mike

993/907

May be related to your immobilizer, of all things. My 95 started doing exactly that after I had the immobilzer brain replaced (to cure other problems with the immobilzer). I had to disconnect the battery and let the car sit for awhile to clear it; other times it would clear itself. Very random; sometimes it would 'stick' on it's own just driving along, and other times it would stick as I tried to lock the car with the immobilizer remote.

The immobilizer will blink all four turn signals twice when the car locks, so the circuitry is related. I gave up trying to lock the car, and it hasn't done it since.
Gordo

ilko

The parking lights are engaged when you turn the stalk for left or right signal while the car is off, depending which side of the street you've parked. Those corner lights stay on to warn other cars, cyclists, etc. that your car is there.

Slow Guy

I think you have to have the turn signal stalk in one position or another (right or left turn) BEFORE shutting off the car for this feature to work. I don't think you can just move the TS to a position after you shut the car off. But I may be mistaken, wouldn't be the first time.

Used much more frequently in Europe than over here.

Mike J

Nope, with the car RUNNING the lights stay on the right regardless of the stalk position. That does not sound right to me.. :-)

Amfab

I have a Targa and my blinkers are intermittent








(Sorry, Mike I couldnt resist)
My vote is for a stalk problem

its it OEM? you should always use a stalk that is stock.
Im sure Sunset has stock stalks in stock

(sorry I just don't seem able to stop)

M Fig

Mike,

did you ever resolve this issue? My 96 C4S does this EXACT same thing but with the left turn signal (driver's side). It does not happen all the time, so it has been in to the dealer several times and they can't get it to malfunction. I just bought the car, and part of the deal was that the seller would get this problem resolved. The dealer's suggestion is to start replacing stuff...the seller's not crazy about this plan. Any info would be appreciated.

Mark

Mike J

Yup, made some progress although its intermittent. After looking over the wiring diagrams, and some reasoning, and research, I am pretty sure (95%) that the signal light relay in the immobilizer box is sticking. I looked around the net, and the specific relays (I took the unit apart) are typical in this failure mode. There is a single relay that has separate contacts for the left and right signals.

In the failure mode, after a while, the contacts will stop sticking and release, and the lights will go out. This is what I saw. It also seems to be heat dependent.

The way to test this is to rap on the immobilizer box if it happens. If the relay releases, you have isolated the problem. The box is under the passenger seat tucked close to the center tunnel. If your seat is installed, then you might need a rod or stick to rap on it.

Of course, I took my seat out, took the box apart to figure it out, traced circuits, and put it back waiting for it to fail so I could do the rap test. Has not failed since. I have put the passenger seat back in, still no problems so I am still waiting to see if happen again.

If this is a problem, there are two solutions. One is to replace the entire immobilizer, likely about $350 or more, or just replace the relay, about $20 or so. To replace the relay requires some soldering skills, or you can get the relay and take it to a good electronics repair shop, they can replace it. The board has good sized traces where the relays are.

The relay is a Siemens V23072-C1061-A208, which is not produced anymore. I found out the replacement is V23072-C1059-A208, which is available.

If I need to replace the relay, I think I have to order it in lots of three. We can split the costs 3 ways and I can mail you a relay, or visa versa.

If the seller is paying, then replace the immobilizer module. Simple fix!

Cheers,

Mike

993/907

See my post No. 4 above.
Since then I have replaced the ECU, the starter switch and finally the steering lock (which includes the ignition keyway).
Immobilzer works fine now, but occasionally the left turn signals will stick "on" as you describe.
I have been able to clear it by locking/unlocking with the immobilizer a few times.

Gordo

Mike J

I think its all centered around worn relays in the immobilizer unit...so your were right. I am not sure why you replaced the ECU, starter switch and the steering lock - was that for something different?

If you unlock/lock the car, the relays are activated/released, and that might jog the sticky contact loose. (that is my theory anyways...!)

M Fig

Thanks guys...and I had the same experience. I turned the car off, hit the alarm and the lights stuck on...hit the remote a few more times and it was no longer lit up...this sounds reasonable. I'm calling the mechanic working on my car to give him this info...I'll let you know what he finds out.

thanks,

Mark

993/907

Mike, it was all immobilizer related.

Replaced ECU first.
That enabled the car to run; next suspect was starter switch (located on back side of steering lock).
The starter switch didn't fix it, so last resort was to replace steering lock, ordered from the factory to match my key.
Steering lock was the culprit.

The ignition keyway in the steering lock was so worn that the car could not sense when the key was removed, so the car would not lock.
We suspect the ignition switch sent spurious current to the ECU causing the car to shut down.

All works well now except for the occassional stuck blinker.

Gordo