OT: F1 spoiler!!! - What is going on?
09-08-2008, 11:55 AM
#16
Then you and and agree about one thing then. I guess the judgement part is a function of his age, Senna made some huge clangers, Schumi did too, I suspect Lewis may be another great if he can keep it in his pants of the track!
09-08-2008, 12:09 PM
#17
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Yes. His judgment cost him a championship last year.
09-08-2008, 12:26 PM
#18
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Thread Starter
Here's a quote from Niki Lauda today:
Austrian Lauda said: "This is the worst judgment in the history of F1. The most perverted judgment I have ever seen. It's absolutely unacceptable when three functionaries (the stewards) influence the championship like this."
Austrian Lauda said: "This is the worst judgment in the history of F1. The most perverted judgment I have ever seen. It's absolutely unacceptable when three functionaries (the stewards) influence the championship like this."
09-08-2008, 01:12 PM
#20
Rennlist Member
The problem I have the the result is that, as far as I could tell, Hamilton did everything right. Yes, he tried to divebomb Kimi, but because he shot the chicane, he fell in behind Kimi again as the rules require. He then passed Kimi at the next corner. My understanding of the rules is that a driver must give back any advantage gained by skipping a corner. It looked to me like Hamilton did that. I'm not the FIA, though.
09-08-2008, 05:18 PM
#22
On the Radar
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I think both drivers are at fault (remember, Kimi ran into Hamilton on a subsequent corner), but IMO the run off area isn't intended to be an escape route for aborting an aggressive overtaking attempt. Hamilton was stupid. He could have waited. His impatience made the outcome of the race debatable. Therefore, he deserves to get punished.
Had Hamilton waited, he probably would have won, fairly.
Had Hamilton waited, he probably would have won, fairly.
09-08-2008, 08:13 PM
#23
I think both drivers are at fault (remember, Kimi ran into Hamilton on a subsequent corner), but IMO the run off area isn't intended to be an escape route for aborting an aggressive overtaking attempt. Hamilton was stupid. He could have waited. His impatience made the outcome of the race debatable. Therefore, he deserves to get punished.
Had Hamilton waited, he probably would have won, fairly.
Had Hamilton waited, he probably would have won, fairly.
09-09-2008, 02:08 AM
#25
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"Probably have won".... Two laps to go, young blokes at the wheel of 700+ horsepower racing cars, rain pouring down, split second decisions being made (all of which makes the sport worth watching) and we get to second guess them from an armchair? I guess now there's no such thing as a racing incident and every small error should be punished until only the guy with Miss Daisy in the back wins.
Maybe it is payback time for whoever stiched poor old Maxy up? Sorry, but either we have:
a) entered some new politically corret age for racing (and political correctness so often leads to incorrect hypocritical decisons); or
b) the stewards really stuffed up; or
c) the stewards were biased.
Just my ever humble 2 cents worth.
09-09-2008, 03:15 AM
#26
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I see a lot of people being critical of LH with regards to lack of experience, but the fact of the matter is he drove to letter of rules and has been punished for what is seemingly a new interpretation of the rules. In F1, when a driver lifts off the throttle whilst the other is accelerating, the advantage is surrendered. In other words, LH went back to the position he would have been in had he followed him round the corner. Only he would never have been able to follow him round that corner because he was on the grass thanks to being pushed wide at the previous turn (which was just good hard racing by KR).
So with the grass taken into account, I believe the stewards actually made the right conclusion that LH gained an unfair advantage against KR. But as somebody already pointed out, it was aways only an advantage against KR. So why did they penalise him so heavily and potentially lose his championship? Why not make the penalty a fine with minus 5 seconds? Had KR been skillful enough (like his team mate) to keep his car on the track, he might have won with such a penalty. But to give LH a 25s penalty is the true crime in this sorry episode of F1. Had they given the driver a fine and a 5s penalty, all the teams would have recognised that it was a mistake in that situation, because every other driver would have made the same mistake as LH. Only, had the driver worn a Ferrari badge, I am sad to say I doubt he would have received anything more than a fine as Massa did earlier on in the year.
So with the grass taken into account, I believe the stewards actually made the right conclusion that LH gained an unfair advantage against KR. But as somebody already pointed out, it was aways only an advantage against KR. So why did they penalise him so heavily and potentially lose his championship? Why not make the penalty a fine with minus 5 seconds? Had KR been skillful enough (like his team mate) to keep his car on the track, he might have won with such a penalty. But to give LH a 25s penalty is the true crime in this sorry episode of F1. Had they given the driver a fine and a 5s penalty, all the teams would have recognised that it was a mistake in that situation, because every other driver would have made the same mistake as LH. Only, had the driver worn a Ferrari badge, I am sad to say I doubt he would have received anything more than a fine as Massa did earlier on in the year.
09-09-2008, 10:43 AM
#27
Call it retribution, for when Hamilton blew the stop sign
at the pit exit and rear ended Kimi. He took out both cars. Hamilton
drives like his father showing off in the Porsche GT he wrecked.
HAMILTON'S FATHER CRASHES $600,000 PORSCHE: It appears as if Dad was cutting across the infield too!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aOC1lrI1Ccs
at the pit exit and rear ended Kimi. He took out both cars. Hamilton
drives like his father showing off in the Porsche GT he wrecked.
HAMILTON'S FATHER CRASHES $600,000 PORSCHE: It appears as if Dad was cutting across the infield too!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aOC1lrI1Ccs
09-09-2008, 11:26 AM
#28
Call it retribution, for when Hamilton blew the stop sign
at the pit exit and rear ended Kimi. He took out both cars. Hamilton
drives like his father showing off in the Porsche GT he wrecked.
HAMILTON'S FATHER CRASHES $600,000 PORSCHE: It appears as if Dad was cutting across the infield too!
at the pit exit and rear ended Kimi. He took out both cars. Hamilton
drives like his father showing off in the Porsche GT he wrecked.
HAMILTON'S FATHER CRASHES $600,000 PORSCHE: It appears as if Dad was cutting across the infield too!
09-09-2008, 07:08 PM
#30
Rennlist Member
McLaren has appealed the penalty, of course. To me, the most bothersome part of the whole episode is this:
"From the pit wall, we then asked Race Control to confirm that they were comfortable that Lewis had allowed Kimi to repass, and they confirmed twice that they believed that the position had been given back in a manner that was 'okay'."
"If Race Control had instead expressed any concern regarding Lewis's actions at that time, we would have instructed Lewis to allow Kimi to repass for a second time."
If McLaren's account is to be believed, this decision is not only incredibly unfair, it is unjustifiable.
I have no particular preference for any of the principals in this dispute, although I have to say that I don't quite understand the hate aimed at Hamilton these days. Sure, not everybody is so lucky as to be personally brought along by Ron Dennis using the very best equipment, but the guy can flat out drive. He came within a few tenths of The Stig's lap record at the Top Gear track ... while driving in the wet. That's all the evidence I need.
"From the pit wall, we then asked Race Control to confirm that they were comfortable that Lewis had allowed Kimi to repass, and they confirmed twice that they believed that the position had been given back in a manner that was 'okay'."
"If Race Control had instead expressed any concern regarding Lewis's actions at that time, we would have instructed Lewis to allow Kimi to repass for a second time."
If McLaren's account is to be believed, this decision is not only incredibly unfair, it is unjustifiable.
I have no particular preference for any of the principals in this dispute, although I have to say that I don't quite understand the hate aimed at Hamilton these days. Sure, not everybody is so lucky as to be personally brought along by Ron Dennis using the very best equipment, but the guy can flat out drive. He came within a few tenths of The Stig's lap record at the Top Gear track ... while driving in the wet. That's all the evidence I need.