Brad Penn or Mobile One, that is the question
05-17-2008, 11:24 AM
#46
Addict
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
I have absolutely nothing against anyone and I never claimed to be an expert in anything Porsche related. I'm just a simple enthusiast who loves Rennlist and believes in the "brotherhood" principle. I have also ZERO gain or profit in the sale of any motor oil.
The "professionals" wont be scared away by people like me if they have a product they truly believe its great. The fact here is that without a healthy dose of sceptisism on our end, then we will get overun by "professionals" who will be selling crap and then truly we will all be poorer.
The facts here are simple. At first there was a valid argument on the amount of additives that Mobil 1 contains. I'm no oil expert, but it kind of made sense to me. Then when reports from other sources and tests came out, than argument is nullified because Mobil 1 contains more than adequate additives. Now its not the additives, its the formulation. I'm sorry but this raised a big red flag to me as to what the whole issue is all about. Read it as you like, I do the same. I'm never going to trash Brad Penn or any other oil or the people that sell it. I dont know enough to do so. At the same time, speaking only for myself, I will be sticking to what my mechanic told me, other race shops like this one: http://www.theracersgroup.com/shop/mobil1.php, Porsche and that gentleman from Australia who happens to be an actual oil engineer.
Please put in your 993 whatever part or oil you want if it makes you happy. But dont expect me to shut up and stop caring for Rennlist and what it stands for.
05-19-2008, 08:41 AM
#49
Racer
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Hong Kong
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The vested interest comes from the fact that they sell the product they preach. If they did not sell this product ( meaning there is no profit to be gained) then personally I would have been less sceptical. My comments are valid and I have an obligation to post them on Rennlist. This IS the beauty of Rennlist. We need to look out for each other as usually what is posted here is considered gospel and people go out and spend their dollars on account of the advise. Many years ago and before you joined Rennlist there have been an instance were someone came out and preached their inferior product at the same time trashing the opposition for no other reason than personal gain. Rennlisters questioned this and at the end of the day the truth came out. Over the years quite a few people came out and tried to sell their wares on RL. We all benefited from the spirit and knowledge of the members who question things and over the years Rennlisters have saved money and time because of that.
I have absolutely nothing against anyone and I never claimed to be an expert in anything Porsche related. I'm just a simple enthusiast who loves Rennlist and believes in the "brotherhood" principle. I have also ZERO gain or profit in the sale of any motor oil.
The "professionals" wont be scared away by people like me if they have a product they truly believe its great. The fact here is that without a healthy dose of sceptisism on our end, then we will get overun by "professionals" who will be selling crap and then truly we will all be poorer.
The facts here are simple. At first there was a valid argument on the amount of additives that Mobil 1 contains. I'm no oil expert, but it kind of made sense to me. Then when reports from other sources and tests came out, than argument is nullified because Mobil 1 contains more than adequate additives. Now its not the additives, its the formulation. I'm sorry but this raised a big red flag to me as to what the whole issue is all about. Read it as you like, I do the same. I'm never going to trash Brad Penn or any other oil or the people that sell it. I dont know enough to do so. At the same time, speaking only for myself, I will be sticking to what my mechanic told me, other race shops like this one: http://www.theracersgroup.com/shop/mobil1.php, Porsche and that gentleman from Australia who happens to be an actual oil engineer.
Please put in your 993 whatever part or oil you want if it makes you happy. But dont expect me to shut up and stop caring for Rennlist and what it stands for.
I have absolutely nothing against anyone and I never claimed to be an expert in anything Porsche related. I'm just a simple enthusiast who loves Rennlist and believes in the "brotherhood" principle. I have also ZERO gain or profit in the sale of any motor oil.
The "professionals" wont be scared away by people like me if they have a product they truly believe its great. The fact here is that without a healthy dose of sceptisism on our end, then we will get overun by "professionals" who will be selling crap and then truly we will all be poorer.
The facts here are simple. At first there was a valid argument on the amount of additives that Mobil 1 contains. I'm no oil expert, but it kind of made sense to me. Then when reports from other sources and tests came out, than argument is nullified because Mobil 1 contains more than adequate additives. Now its not the additives, its the formulation. I'm sorry but this raised a big red flag to me as to what the whole issue is all about. Read it as you like, I do the same. I'm never going to trash Brad Penn or any other oil or the people that sell it. I dont know enough to do so. At the same time, speaking only for myself, I will be sticking to what my mechanic told me, other race shops like this one: http://www.theracersgroup.com/shop/mobil1.php, Porsche and that gentleman from Australia who happens to be an actual oil engineer.
Please put in your 993 whatever part or oil you want if it makes you happy. But dont expect me to shut up and stop caring for Rennlist and what it stands for.
Let us put the oil issue aside. That is not the point of my post. My point was simply and still is that you should not query someone's integrity without having something to back it up other than mere speculation which does not stand up to scrutiny. You do not think posts like yours will scare professionals away? Well, they will not scare the type of people you are accusing them of being ie ones with vested interests who lie to gain profit. They will discourage those who who have no other interest than trying to help enthusiasts and do not appreciate having their integrity impugned to do that. To put it another way, you can express your opinion without attacking someone's integrity on a speculative basis.
05-19-2008, 10:02 AM
#50
Rennlist Member
No shortage of cynicism on RL- which is good thing, but I put my semi-blind faith in someone like Charles who is not only knowledgeable but also sells Mobil products lending greater impartiality to the argument. Maybe his margin is greater on BP products, but I doubt he honestly cares even if there is.
And while in business to make a profit, he pretty much talked me out of the Motul 300v @ $15 per litre ( though it didn't take much convincing).
That all said, its (still) a free country (for the time being); the choice is ours.
And while in business to make a profit, he pretty much talked me out of the Motul 300v @ $15 per litre ( though it didn't take much convincing).
That all said, its (still) a free country (for the time being); the choice is ours.
05-19-2008, 11:15 AM
#51
Race Director
Not sure I follow. The two garages I use do not make their money from oil changes and would not give a toss what brand of oil I use. They have no issue servicing my P with the oils they normally carry (which includes M1 for one of them) or any others I specifiy. I cannot see Steve, Charles or BB (JET951) inventing wear issues to make a few cents a litre from a different brand of oil assuming that the oils they recommend have better margins. Taking BB as an example, the guy is located in Aus, a place where a very small fraction of Rennlisters reside. How could he see a post on different oils helping him get much more business?
Let us put the oil issue aside. That is not the point of my post. My point was simply and still is that you should not query someone's integrity without having something to back it up other than mere speculation which does not stand up to scrutiny. You do not think posts like yours will scare professionals away? Well, they will not scare the type of people you are accusing them of being ie ones with vested interests who lie to gain profit. They will discourage those who who have no other interest than trying to help enthusiasts and do not appreciate having their integrity impugned to do that. To put it another way, you can express your opinion without attacking someone's integrity on a speculative basis.
Let us put the oil issue aside. That is not the point of my post. My point was simply and still is that you should not query someone's integrity without having something to back it up other than mere speculation which does not stand up to scrutiny. You do not think posts like yours will scare professionals away? Well, they will not scare the type of people you are accusing them of being ie ones with vested interests who lie to gain profit. They will discourage those who who have no other interest than trying to help enthusiasts and do not appreciate having their integrity impugned to do that. To put it another way, you can express your opinion without attacking someone's integrity on a speculative basis.
06-03-2008, 05:58 AM
#52
Rennlist Member
The vested interest comes from the fact that they sell the product they preach. If they did not sell this product ( meaning there is no profit to be gained) then personally I would have been less sceptical. My comments are valid and I have an obligation to post them on Rennlist. This IS the beauty of Rennlist. We need to look out for each other as usually what is posted here is considered gospel and people go out and spend their dollars on account of the advise. Many years ago and before you joined Rennlist there have been an instance were someone came out and preached their inferior product at the same time trashing the opposition for no other reason than personal gain. Rennlisters questioned this and at the end of the day the truth came out. Over the years quite a few people came out and tried to sell their wares on RL. We all benefited from the spirit and knowledge of the members who question things and over the years Rennlisters have saved money and time because of that.
I have absolutely nothing against anyone and I never claimed to be an expert in anything Porsche related. I'm just a simple enthusiast who loves Rennlist and believes in the "brotherhood" principle. I have also ZERO gain or profit in the sale of any motor oil.
The "professionals" wont be scared away by people like me if they have a product they truly believe its great. The fact here is that without a healthy dose of sceptisism on our end, then we will get overun by "professionals" who will be selling crap and then truly we will all be poorer.
The facts here are simple. At first there was a valid argument on the amount of additives that Mobil 1 contains. I'm no oil expert, but it kind of made sense to me. Then when reports from other sources and tests came out, than argument is nullified because Mobil 1 contains more than adequate additives. Now its not the additives, its the formulation. I'm sorry but this raised a big red flag to me as to what the whole issue is all about. Read it as you like, I do the same. I'm never going to trash Brad Penn or any other oil or the people that sell it. I dont know enough to do so. At the same time, speaking only for myself, I will be sticking to what my mechanic told me, other race shops like this one: http://www.theracersgroup.com/shop/mobil1.php, Porsche and that gentleman from Australia who happens to be an actual oil engineer.
Please put in your 993 whatever part or oil you want if it makes you happy. But dont expect me to shut up and stop caring for Rennlist and what it stands for.
I have absolutely nothing against anyone and I never claimed to be an expert in anything Porsche related. I'm just a simple enthusiast who loves Rennlist and believes in the "brotherhood" principle. I have also ZERO gain or profit in the sale of any motor oil.
The "professionals" wont be scared away by people like me if they have a product they truly believe its great. The fact here is that without a healthy dose of sceptisism on our end, then we will get overun by "professionals" who will be selling crap and then truly we will all be poorer.
The facts here are simple. At first there was a valid argument on the amount of additives that Mobil 1 contains. I'm no oil expert, but it kind of made sense to me. Then when reports from other sources and tests came out, than argument is nullified because Mobil 1 contains more than adequate additives. Now its not the additives, its the formulation. I'm sorry but this raised a big red flag to me as to what the whole issue is all about. Read it as you like, I do the same. I'm never going to trash Brad Penn or any other oil or the people that sell it. I dont know enough to do so. At the same time, speaking only for myself, I will be sticking to what my mechanic told me, other race shops like this one: http://www.theracersgroup.com/shop/mobil1.php, Porsche and that gentleman from Australia who happens to be an actual oil engineer.
Please put in your 993 whatever part or oil you want if it makes you happy. But dont expect me to shut up and stop caring for Rennlist and what it stands for.
06-03-2008, 05:59 AM
#53
Rennlist Member
Not sure I follow. The two garages I use do not make their money from oil changes and would not give a toss what brand of oil I use. They have no issue servicing my P with the oils they normally carry (which includes M1 for one of them) or any others I specifiy. I cannot see Steve, Charles or BB (JET951) inventing wear issues to make a few cents a litre from a different brand of oil assuming that the oils they recommend have better margins. Taking BB as an example, the guy is located in Aus, a place where a very small fraction of Rennlisters reside. How could he see a post on different oils helping him get much more business?
Let us put the oil issue aside. That is not the point of my post. My point was simply and still is that you should not query someone's integrity without having something to back it up other than mere speculation which does not stand up to scrutiny. You do not think posts like yours will scare professionals away? Well, they will not scare the type of people you are accusing them of being ie ones with vested interests who lie to gain profit. They will discourage those who who have no other interest than trying to help enthusiasts and do not appreciate having their integrity impugned to do that. To put it another way, you can express your opinion without attacking someone's integrity on a speculative basis.
Let us put the oil issue aside. That is not the point of my post. My point was simply and still is that you should not query someone's integrity without having something to back it up other than mere speculation which does not stand up to scrutiny. You do not think posts like yours will scare professionals away? Well, they will not scare the type of people you are accusing them of being ie ones with vested interests who lie to gain profit. They will discourage those who who have no other interest than trying to help enthusiasts and do not appreciate having their integrity impugned to do that. To put it another way, you can express your opinion without attacking someone's integrity on a speculative basis.
