Suspension Question -- Am I Being Obsessive? (Long)
12-06-2007, 11:00 AM
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Suspension Question -- Am I Being Obsessive? (Long)
I'll try to make a long story shorter...
I decided to put the euro spec suspension on my car (MO30 springs and sways, Bilstein HDs) and ordered the parts from a well-regarded vendor I found from reading this board. I also found the installer from this board who has glowing reviews from everyone (Darin in LA @West End Alignment who deserves the reviews BTW).
I got the parts via UPS and drove the 125 miles to Darin a couple days ago. I had to book three weeks out because he is so busy. Cost me time/travel/a vacation day but I figured his quality was worth it and I was right.
When I got there and he unpacked all the stuff we found that the shocks were all the newest iteration, except for the left front which is the older model and a different color. I called the vendor and he told me it was a mistake, he would never send out mismatched shocks intentionally, and that this had happened previously with his shipping clerk. He said he would call around LA to try to have the matching shock delivered to the shop. Meantime Darin started the installation (I had to pay for his time regardless because I was the only one scheduled in his shop).
A new shock could not be located and the older model is now on the left front with the new model on the other corners. The vendor has offered to ship me a matching shock and split the cost of having it installed, however this would still mean another trip to LA (6 hours of driving, another vacation day lost, and another couple hundred bucks out of my pocket).
Part of me says Dammit, you paid and went to all that trouble for a 4.0 installation with everything matching, you need to get it right or its going to keep bothering you, and part of me says -- just live with it, you're never going to sell the car anyway...
If I ever do sell the car, someone is going to look under the car, see a different colored shock on the left front, and wonder if the car has been wrecked.... I don't want to deal with that!!! I don't want to have to tell a "story" to account for it!
Am I being stupid? What would you do? FWIW the car looks brand new and I'm the original owner.
Mark
'98 C4 Cab
I decided to put the euro spec suspension on my car (MO30 springs and sways, Bilstein HDs) and ordered the parts from a well-regarded vendor I found from reading this board. I also found the installer from this board who has glowing reviews from everyone (Darin in LA @West End Alignment who deserves the reviews BTW).
I got the parts via UPS and drove the 125 miles to Darin a couple days ago. I had to book three weeks out because he is so busy. Cost me time/travel/a vacation day but I figured his quality was worth it and I was right.
When I got there and he unpacked all the stuff we found that the shocks were all the newest iteration, except for the left front which is the older model and a different color. I called the vendor and he told me it was a mistake, he would never send out mismatched shocks intentionally, and that this had happened previously with his shipping clerk. He said he would call around LA to try to have the matching shock delivered to the shop. Meantime Darin started the installation (I had to pay for his time regardless because I was the only one scheduled in his shop).
A new shock could not be located and the older model is now on the left front with the new model on the other corners. The vendor has offered to ship me a matching shock and split the cost of having it installed, however this would still mean another trip to LA (6 hours of driving, another vacation day lost, and another couple hundred bucks out of my pocket).
Part of me says Dammit, you paid and went to all that trouble for a 4.0 installation with everything matching, you need to get it right or its going to keep bothering you, and part of me says -- just live with it, you're never going to sell the car anyway...
If I ever do sell the car, someone is going to look under the car, see a different colored shock on the left front, and wonder if the car has been wrecked.... I don't want to deal with that!!! I don't want to have to tell a "story" to account for it!
Am I being stupid? What would you do? FWIW the car looks brand new and I'm the original owner.
Mark
'98 C4 Cab
12-06-2007, 11:06 AM
#2
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Get r done! See if you can get your mechanic to work OT on a Saturday to eliminate a vacation day. Also I would press the vendor to pay the entire install costs as well. It would bother me too if they weren't the same. Kinda like going to the office or out on a date with socks that don't match. Good luck.
12-06-2007, 11:09 AM
#3
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This needs to be right. For you. Do what it takes.
Next time make sure all the stuff is unpacked and secure before starting the install process. I guess its really the only recourse.
Next time make sure all the stuff is unpacked and secure before starting the install process. I guess its really the only recourse.
12-06-2007, 11:11 AM
#4
Instructor
Get it done but locally. Installing one shock is not worth six hours of driving. Definitely not worth burning a vacation day. Regardless of where you do it, though, get it done.
12-06-2007, 11:25 AM
#5
Call me crazy, but I always open a shipment immediately to check for accuracy and damage. You're very lucky that the vendor offered to pay half of the service.
Did Darin do a corner balance? If so, a little more care needs to be taken in replacing the shock. If not, any local shop can slap that in for you and do a quickie height adjustment on that corner as well as a front end alignment.
If a corner balance was done, carefully measure the front left ride height, then replace the shock and return to the same height to keep your corner balance and align just the front end. Measure again after a couple hundred miles as settling may have occured. If you don't care to do the swap portion yourself, have a local shop do it. Remember to take measurements with the same tire pressures and the car in the same spot in your garage.
The front shocks are easy to change and to adjust height. It's not like you're starting from scratch, so you only need to align the front and you won't have to re-do the corner balance as long as you return it to the same height. If you were racing the car, you'd re-do a complete corner balance and alignment but, for the street, you should be OK.
Did Darin do a corner balance? If so, a little more care needs to be taken in replacing the shock. If not, any local shop can slap that in for you and do a quickie height adjustment on that corner as well as a front end alignment.
If a corner balance was done, carefully measure the front left ride height, then replace the shock and return to the same height to keep your corner balance and align just the front end. Measure again after a couple hundred miles as settling may have occured. If you don't care to do the swap portion yourself, have a local shop do it. Remember to take measurements with the same tire pressures and the car in the same spot in your garage.
The front shocks are easy to change and to adjust height. It's not like you're starting from scratch, so you only need to align the front and you won't have to re-do the corner balance as long as you return it to the same height. If you were racing the car, you'd re-do a complete corner balance and alignment but, for the street, you should be OK.
12-06-2007, 11:57 AM
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Thanks for the replies --
The car was corner balanced. Darin said if I came back and he did it, it would just be the install and a new full alignment, no re-corner balance.
Also, all the shops here in San Diego are insanely priced. Darin's cost was less than 1/2 the cost of a shop here ($1400 vs $650). Plus, I trust him now and unless he wasn't available I just don't want anyone else working on the suspension. Too much bad joo-joo has gone down with this situation to add another actor.... my superstitious side coming out here. Plus his reduced rates x my 1/2 of the additional work probably will save me 250 dollars over the cost of the work here.
No one in SoCal works on Saturdays -- I guess they don't need to, there is so much demand and they're doing well $$wise.
I don't think the vendor will cover the entire install cost, sounded like halfway was the best he would do.... I had to ask, he didn't offer and I'm pretty much at his mercy.
Mark
The car was corner balanced. Darin said if I came back and he did it, it would just be the install and a new full alignment, no re-corner balance.
Also, all the shops here in San Diego are insanely priced. Darin's cost was less than 1/2 the cost of a shop here ($1400 vs $650). Plus, I trust him now and unless he wasn't available I just don't want anyone else working on the suspension. Too much bad joo-joo has gone down with this situation to add another actor.... my superstitious side coming out here. Plus his reduced rates x my 1/2 of the additional work probably will save me 250 dollars over the cost of the work here.
No one in SoCal works on Saturdays -- I guess they don't need to, there is so much demand and they're doing well $$wise.
I don't think the vendor will cover the entire install cost, sounded like halfway was the best he would do.... I had to ask, he didn't offer and I'm pretty much at his mercy.
Mark
12-06-2007, 12:39 PM
#7
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Just let the vendor know you will not being doing business with them again. That is AFTER they pay for 1/2 the install.
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12-06-2007, 01:01 PM
#8
Probably a wrong approach with a vendor who was willing to step up and pay for half of the re-do when, in fact, no one held a gun to the buyer's head to install the wrong shock knowing it was the wrong part. That decision was entirely the buyer's because he was in a jam that he created himself by not checking the shipment. The vendor was VERY generous in agreeing to pay for half of the labor to re-do. Unless that vendor is prone to making the same mistake, I'd buy from him in a heartbeat.
12-06-2007, 01:43 PM
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Robin,
The vendor told me that the "upgrade" that Bilstein made to the new shock included the case only, which is now a different color (silver instead of gold), and the shock should behave the same.
Jimbo -- Concur that I could have avoided the situation by inspecting the parts after receiving them. I never thought I would receive mismatched parts and I didn't know what the correct part numbers were in the first place. Live and learn.
However I would have to disagree that I "was in a jam that (I) created (myself) by not checking the shipment."
I might have avoided the jam by opening up the boxes and noting a mismatched part but I didn't "create" anything, just failed to consider the worst case scenario and allowed myself to fall into a no-win situation. If a mistake can be made, it probably will, which is why I want the same guy doing the re-installation. With my luck, another installer will mess up the height adjustment and/or alignment.
The vendor admitted to me that he had a recurrent problem in sending the wrong parts out and it was the fault of his shipping clerk who wasn't QAing the shipments; we both agreed he probably should make change to his process to avoid future problems.
Mark
The vendor told me that the "upgrade" that Bilstein made to the new shock included the case only, which is now a different color (silver instead of gold), and the shock should behave the same.
Jimbo -- Concur that I could have avoided the situation by inspecting the parts after receiving them. I never thought I would receive mismatched parts and I didn't know what the correct part numbers were in the first place. Live and learn.
However I would have to disagree that I "was in a jam that (I) created (myself) by not checking the shipment."
I might have avoided the jam by opening up the boxes and noting a mismatched part but I didn't "create" anything, just failed to consider the worst case scenario and allowed myself to fall into a no-win situation. If a mistake can be made, it probably will, which is why I want the same guy doing the re-installation. With my luck, another installer will mess up the height adjustment and/or alignment.
The vendor admitted to me that he had a recurrent problem in sending the wrong parts out and it was the fault of his shipping clerk who wasn't QAing the shipments; we both agreed he probably should make change to his process to avoid future problems.
Mark
Last edited by User 121721; 12-06-2007 at 02:14 PM.
12-06-2007, 04:42 PM
#11
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I think once the incorrect shock was installed, the horse has left the barn, so to speak.
The vendor made a mistake he wasn't able to correct in a matter of hours, but it sounds like he tried. Offering to pay for half the cost of installing the new shock (not to mention winding up with a returned used shock that he can't -- hopefully -- sell as new) seems like a reasonable compromise.
I would check with Bilstein to see if the shock is actually the same other than the case; if it is, I'd leave it alone. Perhaps in lieu of the new shock, the vendor would be willing to order you the new case instead, and next time you have to address something with the brakes or suspension, you can have that installed on the existing shock instead.
The vendor made a mistake he wasn't able to correct in a matter of hours, but it sounds like he tried. Offering to pay for half the cost of installing the new shock (not to mention winding up with a returned used shock that he can't -- hopefully -- sell as new) seems like a reasonable compromise.
I would check with Bilstein to see if the shock is actually the same other than the case; if it is, I'd leave it alone. Perhaps in lieu of the new shock, the vendor would be willing to order you the new case instead, and next time you have to address something with the brakes or suspension, you can have that installed on the existing shock instead.
12-06-2007, 04:48 PM
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tbh i'd be bugged about it too... but i'd probably keep all "as is" until my next suspension adjustment & install the new one @ that time. does the vendor want the old shock back? (later date even) could they cut you a ck. for the 1/2 install? you're right time IS money too.
bol sorry to hear this; i'm in the habit of checkin' boxes upon arrival too. might be a good habit...
life is still good... any pics of your 993 & it's sexy new stance???
bol sorry to hear this; i'm in the habit of checkin' boxes upon arrival too. might be a good habit...
life is still good... any pics of your 993 & it's sexy new stance???
12-06-2007, 05:04 PM
#13
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So it was only $650 for complete install and corner balance?
12-06-2007, 05:15 PM
#14
Have to say this would bug me too. Think I would just swap out the shock at the next alignment as suggested earlier.
I've found Black Forest to be pretty reasonable on pricing, absolutely first rate on quality of work and their local. No affiliation......
I've found Black Forest to be pretty reasonable on pricing, absolutely first rate on quality of work and their local. No affiliation......
12-06-2007, 08:44 PM
#15
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If Bilstein assured me that the operating characteristics of the two struts were identical .... and the colour change was purely cosmetic, I would live with an otherwise perfect installation made by an expert. However ....
If for whatever reason the strut is to be swapped out, it is a relatively simple DIY: remember that the height (at that corner) is determined solely by that particular spring - and where the lower spring perch is adjusted relative to some chosen reference on the strut body, preferably the lower mounting hole center. If the new strut is likewise assembled, it is easily reinstalled and will preserve the corner balance. Drive to a local alignment rack with the current print out from the recent set up, asking to reset those values, or to make it symmetric with the other (untouched) front corner.
If for whatever reason the strut is to be swapped out, it is a relatively simple DIY: remember that the height (at that corner) is determined solely by that particular spring - and where the lower spring perch is adjusted relative to some chosen reference on the strut body, preferably the lower mounting hole center. If the new strut is likewise assembled, it is easily reinstalled and will preserve the corner balance. Drive to a local alignment rack with the current print out from the recent set up, asking to reset those values, or to make it symmetric with the other (untouched) front corner.