Autopower cages
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From: Baltimore, MD
Hey, Louis,
I did receive your PM. IMHO, you can do better than the Autopower cages.
For some reason, I rarely see the Autopower cages in race cars. For pre-fabbed cages, I mostly see Safety Devices and OG Racing. Try PMing my friend "forklift". He has an Autopower roll bar and has to ditch it because, IIRC, it's not PCA legal. Note: the bar and cage may be built to different specs. The pictured cage, which Autopower claims is NASA-legal, is actually not legal since it lacks the double door bars. It also lacks a roof bar (I have two bars) and a knee bar. The "U Weld" kit has the knee bar but still lacks the roof bar.
Also, I am not a NASA rules expert, but I thought the cages for NASA required a diagonal from the top of the main hoop all the way to the opposite rear attachment point?
I did receive your PM. IMHO, you can do better than the Autopower cages.
For some reason, I rarely see the Autopower cages in race cars. For pre-fabbed cages, I mostly see Safety Devices and OG Racing. Try PMing my friend "forklift". He has an Autopower roll bar and has to ditch it because, IIRC, it's not PCA legal. Note: the bar and cage may be built to different specs. The pictured cage, which Autopower claims is NASA-legal, is actually not legal since it lacks the double door bars. It also lacks a roof bar (I have two bars) and a knee bar. The "U Weld" kit has the knee bar but still lacks the roof bar.
Also, I am not a NASA rules expert, but I thought the cages for NASA required a diagonal from the top of the main hoop all the way to the opposite rear attachment point?
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Joined: Feb 2004
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From: Roseville, CA
In the '70's, and maybe stretching it into the '80's, what else could you do? Now? Why? With all the talented fabricators out there the only reason you'd consider a bolt-in is to pass tech in the most minimal terms.
(And yes speaking from experience, I've installed probably 30 of the rollbars, and 10-15 of their cages over the years in a variety of cars, Porsche and other.)
(And yes speaking from experience, I've installed probably 30 of the rollbars, and 10-15 of their cages over the years in a variety of cars, Porsche and other.)
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Thanks for the info Mark. I don't know anything about Autopower and had never heard of them before. I think they come fairly basic but you can add various bars including door and roof bars that make them compliant.
Ken, just doing my research now. I'm liking HEIGO due to the fact that they fab the factory cup car cages. As much as there are benefits to custom cages, and I am considering going this route, there may also be some downsides that I've learned about. Firstly, most custom shops may not have the R&D to properly test their equipment, whereas a company like HEIGO does. I presume that they've also been put under scrutiny by Porsche since they buy them for cup cars. Also, while they may be more rigid (and faster) that extra rigidity might transfer more energy to the driver in the event of an accident than a more malleable bolt-on that I would think would better crumple on impact.
I'm no expert on this, just exposing myself to as much info as I can before I pull the trigger on what is a very important safety device.
Ken, just doing my research now. I'm liking HEIGO due to the fact that they fab the factory cup car cages. As much as there are benefits to custom cages, and I am considering going this route, there may also be some downsides that I've learned about. Firstly, most custom shops may not have the R&D to properly test their equipment, whereas a company like HEIGO does. I presume that they've also been put under scrutiny by Porsche since they buy them for cup cars. Also, while they may be more rigid (and faster) that extra rigidity might transfer more energy to the driver in the event of an accident than a more malleable bolt-on that I would think would better crumple on impact.
I'm no expert on this, just exposing myself to as much info as I can before I pull the trigger on what is a very important safety device.
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From: Baltimore, MD
Louis,
FWIW, I had an Autopower roll bar that I installed in my old '84 VW GTI. Back in the mid-80's, as Ken states, there was not much to choose from. Nowadays, there is a plethora.
Sorry, but, IMHO, if you can afford it, a custom cage is the way to go. My shop may not have done any classic R&D, but they have real-world experience with many of their cars having been involved in heavy wrecks. This experience and recommendation is the reason that I went with NASCAR-style door bars.
Also, note that there are no "factory" roll cages for American stock car racing (NASCAR, Craftsman series, etc) and, seemingly a surprise since most of these fabricators have no R&D budgets, these extremely well-built cages have been put through some serious crashes with most drivers having survived quite well. How may times have you seen these stout NASCAR cars go tumbling end-over-end or barrel-rolling, only to have the driver walk away with minor injuries? Additionally, I would think that you would want the cockpit area, which is the are in question for PCA/NASA stock car, to remain a solid and intact cocoon, ala NASCAR style. So many of those pro racers have emerged unscathed due to the strength of tubes surrounding them, these cages having been built by guys who are similar to many of the custom cage builders out there available to the sports car crowd.
Does the Heigo cage that is available for the 993 utilize similar design elements (cage-to-body attachment, point-topoint attachments, etc.) that Porsche has spec'd out for the 964/993/996 cup cars? IIRC, the Heigo 993 cage uses pivot points; all of the other cup car cages use bent and welded tubing (Matter?).
FWIW, I had an Autopower roll bar that I installed in my old '84 VW GTI. Back in the mid-80's, as Ken states, there was not much to choose from. Nowadays, there is a plethora.
Sorry, but, IMHO, if you can afford it, a custom cage is the way to go. My shop may not have done any classic R&D, but they have real-world experience with many of their cars having been involved in heavy wrecks. This experience and recommendation is the reason that I went with NASCAR-style door bars.
Also, note that there are no "factory" roll cages for American stock car racing (NASCAR, Craftsman series, etc) and, seemingly a surprise since most of these fabricators have no R&D budgets, these extremely well-built cages have been put through some serious crashes with most drivers having survived quite well. How may times have you seen these stout NASCAR cars go tumbling end-over-end or barrel-rolling, only to have the driver walk away with minor injuries? Additionally, I would think that you would want the cockpit area, which is the are in question for PCA/NASA stock car, to remain a solid and intact cocoon, ala NASCAR style. So many of those pro racers have emerged unscathed due to the strength of tubes surrounding them, these cages having been built by guys who are similar to many of the custom cage builders out there available to the sports car crowd.
Does the Heigo cage that is available for the 993 utilize similar design elements (cage-to-body attachment, point-topoint attachments, etc.) that Porsche has spec'd out for the 964/993/996 cup cars? IIRC, the Heigo 993 cage uses pivot points; all of the other cup car cages use bent and welded tubing (Matter?).
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Joined: Feb 2004
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From: Roseville, CA
Check out what Tony Collicchio is doing now. I posted this on another thread recently. Godsend to have a kid like him local to us. http://www.modified.com/sportculture/tcracecar.html
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From: Roseville, CA
They kinda changed the link, go find "page 2". Another name to note on that car is Marshall Pruett, who we're also privileged to have locally. He's ex-CART/IRL/various other pro road racing.
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Mark, I believe there are four designs for the 993 including those spec'd for the RS and cup cars. I don't know exactly what each variant has in terms of specs....not easy getting info in English. I have yet to place a call to FVD and get more particulars.
Ken, many thanks for the link. I have been made aware of Tony's work. Maybe a ride down to CA might be in order for next spring...
Ken, many thanks for the link. I have been made aware of Tony's work. Maybe a ride down to CA might be in order for next spring...
