Ritter v4.0

Ya, 964s are fugly- NOT!

Guy

Had a 93 964, now have a 98 Targa.

The 993 has better looks in my opinion and I like the couple creature comforts such as keyless entry, revised door panels (with Hi-fi), dual exhaust that the 993 offers but they are minor trival differences.

Both are great cars......

cabrio993

You forgot...

964 > 996
993 > 996

Fred's 964

Flatsix, I've had a 964 Cab for over a year (3000 miles), a 993 coupe for 2 months (1300 miles). I love them both and my favorite changes from day to day. With the differences noted by others on this post, drive them both, decide on a cab or coupe, pick a clean car in the color you like, do a PPI, buy it, drive it, and enjoy it. Obviously the 964 will be less expensive than a similar 993 but will be several years older too. If you can't decide, buy 2 like I did. It may take me many many years to decide which one to keep.... By the way, the most noticable difference I felt was the gearing on the 5 speed vs the 6 speed. I liked the 1st to 2nd gear shift on the 964 5 speed much better at first (gearing is closer), but once I started driving the 993 more agressively (= higher revs) I like the 6 speed just fine now. Also the rear suspension gives a much smoother and quieter ride on the 993. My experience is much more limited than many of those on this site, but those are my inexperienced impressions. Drive both and let us know what you think.

zicoramone

This is my 911 scale of preference:
997/996GT3RSR > 997/996GT3Cup > 997 GT3RS >/= 997 GT2 > 996GT3RS > 997GT3 >/= 996GT3Mk1 > 996GT3Mk2 > 997TT > 996TT > 993 TT > 9964S > 993S > 964T > 930T> 993=964 >/= 996

Berkley

I've had the pleasure of owning two of each series......they are both great!

If I could only have one, I would be just as happy in a '92 C2 or '95 C2.....There is a special allure to the 964 driving experience...they are loud, sneaky fast and just plain fun Porsche driving machines

A '91 C2 I owned and my '98 C2S

Toddimus

My last 911 was a 1990 C4, and my current 911 is a 1997 C2, so I guess I'm somewhat qualified to submit my 2 cents...

The '90 C4 had RUF suspension and the 993 has PSS9s. I'd have to say the 993 inspires more confidence in terms of handling. The 993 is more stable and predictable. C2 and C4 cloud this comparison though. The squat under acceleration is considerably less in the 993, but I don't know if that's "better". There's something about a 911 squatting under acceleration like the 964 does.

Braking is maybe slightly better in the 993. I can't really tell the difference to tell you the truth.

Definitely more low end grunt with the varioram. WAAY more. Top end is better too. The butt dyno votes for the 993.

Aesthetics in general, for me, are far better in the 993. I like the exterior updates of the 993. That's obviously a personal preference.

Even in the interior, the ***** are different and more "modern?". Also, you're more likely to have a CDR210 in a 993. I like that stereo head in the dash. It looks like it's supposed to be there. The sunroof switch is now in the lower center console of the 993 instead of under the left side oil gauges in older 911s. I like the 993 placement better; more convenient and better for a co-pilot to operate.

The sound of the power plants is slightly different. I can't really comment on the stock exhaust comparison of the two because both cars are/were modified. The Varioram opening up sounds different than the single extra flap in the 964. The 964 just screams all at once above about 4800 while the 993 has a smoother transition to its roar at redline. I drilled the airbox in each car, so this intake crescendo is more pronounced. Both sound good in different ways. Both cars also had the sound tray removed, but I'd say the 964 was still slightly louder as a mechanism (valves, chains, etc.).

The immobilizer and factory alarm are a blessing and a curse. The immobilizer is annoying sometimes if you unlock the car and try to start the car more than three minutes later. Like at the gas station for instance. For me, the immobilizer is an extra pain in the a$$ because I don't have the right code. I just can't lose my one good remote. That's another story for another post. I love having a button remote for the 993 though.

I might someday miss having to adjust the valves, but that day hasn't come yet. I love having hydraulic valves!! Oil changes are much more involved with a 993, but I think the ease of maintenance vote goes once again to the 993.

The biggest thing I miss about the 964 is that even with a dual mass flywheel, the throttle blip is quicker. My 993 has the LWF, so it spools up really quickly. The bummer is that it comes down slowly. The Motronic seems to be taking over, keeping the auxiliary air valve open or something. I've only had one satisfying throttle blip with the 993, and that was at really high rpms.

I sold my nicely prepared 964 so I could get a 993. It's a newer, better car. I guess that pretty much expresses my not-so-humble opinion.

leosayer

I owned a 964 targa for 4 years, now have a 993 coupe.

The biggest difference for me is that the 964 feels a lot more adjustable on the throttle and provides a more involving drive. The 993 however, is much more confidence inspiring through the bends and feels much faster through them.

993 feels much faster above 100mph, probably due to shorter gearing in 4th and 5th.

993c2cab

I two own both.. a 90 c4 and a 95 cab. Both are fabulous pcars and I love the look of each. the c4 has 95k and still feels very solid, the cab has 85k and feels great as well, aside from a ratlle in the drivers door I have not searched out. the biggest difference is the clutch, the 993 is much smoother and easier to drive because of this, think traffic. My 993 just feels like a nicer car even though the interiors are near identicle. I just DE'ed the c4 with much delight. it was my first time. You can't go wrong either way I don't think, just hold out for what your looking for.. color, interior, manual, ect. and you'll be fine.

flatsixforme

Great comparisons guys! Thanks for that invaluable info. I'm sure I'm not the only one wondering these things. I am just so torn as they both give me things that I want out my next p-car.

- I love the looks of 993 = 993 (caveat, then again, there are some 964's that look fantastic, like Ritter's...I would take that car in a second)
- I need AC that works properly = it sounds like a toss up on this one as long as the system is services well
- I will likely lean towards a c4 as I live in the midwest and want to drive it as much as possible = probably 993 as it is lighter and more sophisticated
- I need a loud car where I hear the engine and exhaust = sounds (punn intended) like the 964 gets the nod here but I expect to modify for sound on whatever car and from what I hear from you guys I can easily make any 993 a beast.
- I need a relaible car = both are similar but the valve work worries me as a daily driver so the nod has to go to the 993
- I need something I can afford (and maintain) = 964 gets the nod here as I am not too far away from having the 20-25K needed to get a well sorted reliable example and then enough left to deal with any hicups in the first 6 months.
- I love the ability to fling the car around and swing the tail if I desire = I don't know on this one...this is where the c2 is drawing me in. But, if I get a c4 the nod has to go to the 993 as it's system is lighter and better suited for a rear wheel feel (I am guessing on this one as I have no first hand experience)
- I want the car to "feel" as much like an older p-car as possible = I think 964 but then the heavier c4 system makes me think 993 might win in this category.

I think what it comes down to is that I would ultimately prefer a 993 C$S but by the time I would have that kind of money (and reserve funds) I would be waiting a while. It sounds like the 964 is a worthy car for me (especially if I could get my hands on a 1994 wodebody), my only hang up is it has to be set up on the "looks" department just right for me whereas I am happy with a stock 993.

Has anybody bought a 964 and regretted it the time they saw a 993 pull up afterwards? This is my biggest worry with the 964 as I don't want to always lust after another woman...I mean car

Thanks for listening...I can't believe I am losing sleep over thinking of this!!!

Best,
Adam

Berkley

Just try to find the best post March build '91 C4 or any '92 C4 you can find....it is a thrill from the time your start it up until you shut it down.....the 964 remains very popular in Europe

Good Luck

PS....C2 with winter tyres works great too

adsc4s

Miss my 1990 964 cab. Currently have a 96 TT and in between was a 97 C4S. The 964 was raw and sounded great, the C4S the best balanced and the TT the scariest to drive.

I can see myself getting back into a 964 in the future. Great cars.

Tom W

I have both and drive both often. Both are no longer stock but were close to stock in past years.

While there are some handling differences in the 993 vs 964, they are not night-and-day differences but subtle and only apparent as you approach the limit. I think most differences come from alignment issues or suspension and either car can be a pain if not aligned well or if the shocks are shot. I would not choose one instead of the other based on perceived handling differences. Both are great fun to drive on the street or track.

I'd go for the 993 every time as (1) I prefer the looks and (2) the car will not be as old and may have less age related maintenance issues. Both cars are getting to where there are lots of rubber parts that need to be replaced due to age related deterioration. The difference in cost due to valve adjustment is not an issue to me as it doesn't happen that often and there are likely to be other things that need fixing that will cost more.

Fahrer

I am confused but where does the 997/s fit in?

ElferPilot

I have neither yet, but that's the very reason I'm getting a 993. Best of luck with your decision, after all they're both great cars!