* ? re 3.6 engine - hot engine/performance
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Former Vendor
Joined: Jul 2004
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From: Kirkland, WA
* ? re 3.6 engine - hot engine/performance
Have a 330hp 1997 Varioram 3.6 in the 79SC.
What system(s) are on the 993 engine with regards to:
Oil temp
Cylinder/engine case temp
I need some specific 993 engine system details that might explain a performance change based upon oil & or engine temperatures.
Ideas?
Thanks a ton!,
Craig
What system(s) are on the 993 engine with regards to:
Oil temp
Cylinder/engine case temp
I need some specific 993 engine system details that might explain a performance change based upon oil & or engine temperatures.
Ideas?
Thanks a ton!,
Craig
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Craig,
What makes you think that you have a 330hp motor. They came with 282 at the crank. I'm curious if this is a real number and if yes what was done with the motor...
As for oil temp. The 993 has a rather large oil cooler located in the front right area behind the headlight. The 993 oil cooling system is even somewhat inadequate and many have installed auxillary oil coolers on the driver's side with the appropriate plumbing.
I'm sure someone here has a detailed design. If you'd like i can scan in the shop manual diagram.
Cheers,
Boris
What makes you think that you have a 330hp motor. They came with 282 at the crank. I'm curious if this is a real number and if yes what was done with the motor...
As for oil temp. The 993 has a rather large oil cooler located in the front right area behind the headlight. The 993 oil cooling system is even somewhat inadequate and many have installed auxillary oil coolers on the driver's side with the appropriate plumbing.
I'm sure someone here has a detailed design. If you'd like i can scan in the shop manual diagram.
Cheers,
Boris
Thread Starter
Former Vendor
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 4,299
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From: Kirkland, WA
Well, what makes me think that I have the HP is this:
RS 3.8 cams
Steve Weiner ECU optimized for 96 octane
**280.5 hp/247 tq to the wheels on Dynojet 248C**
What I need is someone that is able to tell what system(s) dials back timing etc based on oil or cylinder temp.
This is installed in a 79SC with 2 oil coolers that need repositioning for better cooling.
RS 3.8 cams
Steve Weiner ECU optimized for 96 octane
**280.5 hp/247 tq to the wheels on Dynojet 248C**
What I need is someone that is able to tell what system(s) dials back timing etc based on oil or cylinder temp.
This is installed in a 79SC with 2 oil coolers that need repositioning for better cooling.
Thread Starter
Former Vendor
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 4,299
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From: Kirkland, WA
It does! Oil temps of above 210 it feels slower.
This engine is in a 2500 lb 1979 911SC chassis ;-)
Essentially a street legal race car with all the changes I have made -
Ideas???
This engine is in a 2500 lb 1979 911SC chassis ;-)
Essentially a street legal race car with all the changes I have made -
Ideas???
Race Car
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,547
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From: Switzerland
Originally Posted by RSRS
Well, what makes me think that I have the HP is this:
RS 3.8 cams
Steve Weiner ECU optimized for 96 octane
**280.5 hp/247 tq to the wheels on Dynojet 248C**
What I need is someone that is able to tell what system(s) dials back timing etc based on oil or cylinder temp.
This is installed in a 79SC with 2 oil coolers that need repositioning for better cooling.
RS 3.8 cams
Steve Weiner ECU optimized for 96 octane
**280.5 hp/247 tq to the wheels on Dynojet 248C**
What I need is someone that is able to tell what system(s) dials back timing etc based on oil or cylinder temp.
This is installed in a 79SC with 2 oil coolers that need repositioning for better cooling.
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From: yorba linda, ca
Originally Posted by RSRS
Well, what makes me think that I have the HP is this:
RS 3.8 cams
Steve Weiner ECU optimized for 96 octane
**280.5 hp/247 tq to the wheels on Dynojet 248C**
What I need is someone that is able to tell what system(s) dials back timing etc based on oil or cylinder temp.
This is installed in a 79SC with 2 oil coolers that need repositioning for better cooling.
RS 3.8 cams
Steve Weiner ECU optimized for 96 octane
**280.5 hp/247 tq to the wheels on Dynojet 248C**
What I need is someone that is able to tell what system(s) dials back timing etc based on oil or cylinder temp.
This is installed in a 79SC with 2 oil coolers that need repositioning for better cooling.
I must say that those HP numbers are pretty impressive. Thats about a 60hp increase for reading at the wheels, compared to typical 993 dyno results..
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Thread Starter
Former Vendor
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 4,299
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From: Kirkland, WA
"Sorry, but ask Steve W.: no way you can have 330 hp with just those two mods. And I do not trust dynos either... IMHO: you need to do a "before mod " and "after mod" dyno with the same dyno and the same dyno parameters to see what improvement resulted."
They are REAL numbers. This entire project was coordinated with Steve Weiner.
All parts and software purchased from Steve Weiner.
Dyno sheet worked on and analyzed by Steve Weiner.
Ran on a dynojet 248C used by about 50 other Porsche racers in the Seattle area.
Virtually the same conditions (humid, Seattle weather).
Indeed they are real.
My signature line from the PelicanParts discussion list:
Euro 79SC no options/3.6 Varioram/3.8 RS cams/Ti retainers Aase springs/Weiner ECU/B&B headers/Flowmaster/330 hp & 292 tq/WEVO-ized/Recaro PP
So there are many other mods.
End result: 330hp/291tq accounting for 15% loss.
Air intake temps are ambient, BTW - measured them. Was pretty happy with this.
Took the stock cover, installed it in a jig, bandsawed most of it off, leaving only a 1/2" lip.
They are REAL numbers. This entire project was coordinated with Steve Weiner.
All parts and software purchased from Steve Weiner.
Dyno sheet worked on and analyzed by Steve Weiner.
Ran on a dynojet 248C used by about 50 other Porsche racers in the Seattle area.
Virtually the same conditions (humid, Seattle weather).
Indeed they are real.
My signature line from the PelicanParts discussion list:
Euro 79SC no options/3.6 Varioram/3.8 RS cams/Ti retainers Aase springs/Weiner ECU/B&B headers/Flowmaster/330 hp & 292 tq/WEVO-ized/Recaro PP
So there are many other mods.
End result: 330hp/291tq accounting for 15% loss.
Air intake temps are ambient, BTW - measured them. Was pretty happy with this.
Took the stock cover, installed it in a jig, bandsawed most of it off, leaving only a 1/2" lip.
Thread Starter
Former Vendor
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 4,299
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From: Kirkland, WA
Its a little ugly right now - until the hole-sawed front bumper gives way to the RUF F&R bumpers and a front repaint.
The underpinnings are top rate though
Here are some pics from awhile back -
The underpinnings are top rate though
Here are some pics from awhile back -
RL Technical Advisor
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 11,870
Likes: 75
From: Portland Oregon
Craig:
A few things to note,.....
1) Power does drop off precipitously in 911 engines when oil temps exceed 210 deg F. Its been that way since 1966,....
One does what one must do to keep oil temps below that for maximum performance and that includes properly installed dual oil coolers.
2) These knock-sensored engines are adaptive. They cannot however, restore lost power when the oil and cylinder head temps get too high. They will supress incipient detonation at high operating temps by retarding ignition timing to suit and thats part of what you feel when the engine gets hot.
Get those oil temps down to 185-190 deg F and it will run stronger (and last longer).
P.S. I never compare or extrapolate rear wheel HP figures with HP at the flywheel. There are FAR too many variables to make any accurate predictions and it simply comes conjecture and tavern talk,.... RWP is just that; Rear Wheel Power.
A few things to note,.....
1) Power does drop off precipitously in 911 engines when oil temps exceed 210 deg F. Its been that way since 1966,....
One does what one must do to keep oil temps below that for maximum performance and that includes properly installed dual oil coolers.2) These knock-sensored engines are adaptive. They cannot however, restore lost power when the oil and cylinder head temps get too high. They will supress incipient detonation at high operating temps by retarding ignition timing to suit and thats part of what you feel when the engine gets hot.
Get those oil temps down to 185-190 deg F and it will run stronger (and last longer).
P.S. I never compare or extrapolate rear wheel HP figures with HP at the flywheel. There are FAR too many variables to make any accurate predictions and it simply comes conjecture and tavern talk,....
RWP is just that; Rear Wheel Power.
Thread Starter
Former Vendor
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 4,299
Likes: 4
From: Kirkland, WA
"P.S. I never compare or extrapolate rear wheel HP figures with HP at the flywheel. There are FAR too many variables to make any accurate predictions and it simply comes conjecture and tavern talk,.... RWP is just that; Rear Wheel Power."
Yup I agree - and that is why I ONLY refer to HP comparisons when using:
Same dyno (Dynojet 248C)
Same location - Totem Lake area of Kirkland
Nearly the same conditions (easy to do here in the Seattle area) *&* corrected numbers
Then we are just about in the same ballpark. Without that.......well, its all a bunch o' hooey isn't it?
Yup I agree - and that is why I ONLY refer to HP comparisons when using:
Same dyno (Dynojet 248C)
Same location - Totem Lake area of Kirkland
Nearly the same conditions (easy to do here in the Seattle area) *&* corrected numbers
Then we are just about in the same ballpark. Without that.......well, its all a bunch o' hooey isn't it?