DAS roll bar or Brey Krause harness truss?
02-10-2003, 05:08 PM
#31
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As several folks have mentioned already, it is personel preference.
I purchased a DAS bar finally after realizing that my kids are so rarely in my P-car that if I really needed, I could pull the bar out or deactivate the front airbag for them.
I was required to have harnesses for an event last year and have been hooked ever since with them. I have never been comfortable with the idea of having harnesses and no rollbar. My thoughts were, that if I have harnesses I should also have a rollbar (all or nothing).
For a few extra $$, I will have a little extra peace of mind.
I purchased a DAS bar finally after realizing that my kids are so rarely in my P-car that if I really needed, I could pull the bar out or deactivate the front airbag for them.
I was required to have harnesses for an event last year and have been hooked ever since with them. I have never been comfortable with the idea of having harnesses and no rollbar. My thoughts were, that if I have harnesses I should also have a rollbar (all or nothing).
For a few extra $$, I will have a little extra peace of mind.
02-10-2003, 05:23 PM
#32
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EJ,
Thanks for detailed and enthusiastic summary. Now, you've got me all fired up with no place to go! My first track day is still 2 months away.
As I understand it, I can get my SCCA license after the 3-day Skippy class. I think SRF would be an ideal way to get started - as you said, big fields, identical cars, reasonable costs (compared to other forms of racing).
Thanks to all for the inputs on the roll bar. It's a no-brainer, and I'll be bugging Greg soon for his help on installing the bar and GT3 seats. Greg, how about RA over Memorial Day with the Chicago "hey youse guys" gang?
Thanks for detailed and enthusiastic summary. Now, you've got me all fired up with no place to go! My first track day is still 2 months away.
As I understand it, I can get my SCCA license after the 3-day Skippy class. I think SRF would be an ideal way to get started - as you said, big fields, identical cars, reasonable costs (compared to other forms of racing).
Thanks to all for the inputs on the roll bar. It's a no-brainer, and I'll be bugging Greg soon for his help on installing the bar and GT3 seats. Greg, how about RA over Memorial Day with the Chicago "hey youse guys" gang?
02-10-2003, 06:12 PM
#33
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Originally posted by Anir:
<strong>
Thanks to all for the inputs on the roll bar. It's a no-brainer, and I'll be bugging Greg soon for his help on installing the bar and GT3 seats. Greg, how about RA over Memorial Day with the Chicago "hey youse guys" gang?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Be glad to help.
As long as the snow if gone by then I would love to go back to Road America. Send us some details please.
<strong>
Thanks to all for the inputs on the roll bar. It's a no-brainer, and I'll be bugging Greg soon for his help on installing the bar and GT3 seats. Greg, how about RA over Memorial Day with the Chicago "hey youse guys" gang?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Be glad to help.
As long as the snow if gone by then I would love to go back to Road America. Send us some details please.
02-10-2003, 06:28 PM
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Anir, I had a great post written up and then the crappy server lost it. The jist was that you should do your local scca school after the skip school whether you get your scca license or not at VIR. And do the scca school in the car of the type you think you are going to race.
It was pointed out to us many times over our weekend that a professional school like Skip teaches you how to drive a race car at the track. Heel and toe, double clutching, aero, skid control, car control etc.
SCCA doesnt give a **** about any of that. If you cant drive a car at their school, oh well. They wan't to see if you can race. SCCA school teaches you how to race a car at a track. There is a big difference.
The afternoon on Sunday is all practice races with starts and green flags and red flags and black flags and local yellows and full course yellows and pace cars and debris on track and wreckers and ambulances on track (bet you thought the white flag was for the last lap) and cars in the gravel and passing flags and all sorts of other fun stuff that I can't remember.
Maybe someone who has done both schools can tell you for sure, but you might wonder this aloud (and yes I have my flame proof Sparco suit):
Why does the SCCA not recognize a PCA license while the PCA recognizes an SCCA license?
<img border="0" alt="[icon107]" title="" src="graemlins/icon107.gif" />
E. J.
It was pointed out to us many times over our weekend that a professional school like Skip teaches you how to drive a race car at the track. Heel and toe, double clutching, aero, skid control, car control etc.
SCCA doesnt give a **** about any of that. If you cant drive a car at their school, oh well. They wan't to see if you can race. SCCA school teaches you how to race a car at a track. There is a big difference.
The afternoon on Sunday is all practice races with starts and green flags and red flags and black flags and local yellows and full course yellows and pace cars and debris on track and wreckers and ambulances on track (bet you thought the white flag was for the last lap) and cars in the gravel and passing flags and all sorts of other fun stuff that I can't remember.
Maybe someone who has done both schools can tell you for sure, but you might wonder this aloud (and yes I have my flame proof Sparco suit):
Why does the SCCA not recognize a PCA license while the PCA recognizes an SCCA license?
<img border="0" alt="[icon107]" title="" src="graemlins/icon107.gif" />
E. J.
02-10-2003, 08:42 PM
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EJ,
Sounds like good advice regarding SCCA school in addition to Skip Barber. I'm for as much preparation / education as possible before getting out there and racing. I know in my heart that racing is very different from DE's.
Greg,
Can RA seriously still have snow at the end of May? If so, I've ventured much too far from the climatic safety of my home state of Texas. I'm already getting cabin fever with all the snow we've had in Kentucky this winter.
Sounds like good advice regarding SCCA school in addition to Skip Barber. I'm for as much preparation / education as possible before getting out there and racing. I know in my heart that racing is very different from DE's.
Greg,
Can RA seriously still have snow at the end of May? If so, I've ventured much too far from the climatic safety of my home state of Texas. I'm already getting cabin fever with all the snow we've had in Kentucky this winter.
02-10-2003, 11:35 PM
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EJ said it all. I'm selling my race bits for the 993 and then will sell the car. I love it but it's a school bus to drive. Too 'set-up' for everyday use on the street and too expensive to take club racing for real. 3000lbs is positively heavy. Still fun to drive but after driving sports races it's hard to go back to production cars.
SRF is a good choice..good value and a lot of competition. There are a lot of guys who live for SRF, so don't be mistaken, guys will outspend you. IE buy 3 engines, dyno all three and put the best in the car. New tires every weekend, etc. But it's close racing and takes real skill to run up front.
Also consider Spec Miata if costs are an issue. Probably $12k for a starter car (I'm guessing). Again, its "spec" but don't forget that means you get to spend money within the rules. Huge Spec Miata fields out here in CA. 72 Miatas did the CART support race at Laguna..much better racing to watch that CART that day in my opinion.
Mark Dalen (993TT) went the SRF route and just got a Radical SuperSport (CSR) to add to the garage. Just saw Mark race at Cal Speedway 2 weekends ago. He was looking good out there.
FF..i'll email you some more on the topic.
PS...if anyone in SoCal is looking for a DAS Bar for their 993, let me know. The garage sale is on!
Jason
SRF is a good choice..good value and a lot of competition. There are a lot of guys who live for SRF, so don't be mistaken, guys will outspend you. IE buy 3 engines, dyno all three and put the best in the car. New tires every weekend, etc. But it's close racing and takes real skill to run up front.
Also consider Spec Miata if costs are an issue. Probably $12k for a starter car (I'm guessing). Again, its "spec" but don't forget that means you get to spend money within the rules. Huge Spec Miata fields out here in CA. 72 Miatas did the CART support race at Laguna..much better racing to watch that CART that day in my opinion.
Mark Dalen (993TT) went the SRF route and just got a Radical SuperSport (CSR) to add to the garage. Just saw Mark race at Cal Speedway 2 weekends ago. He was looking good out there.
FF..i'll email you some more on the topic.
PS...if anyone in SoCal is looking for a DAS Bar for their 993, let me know. The garage sale is on!
Jason
02-10-2003, 11:55 PM
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I don't see the purpose of simply using a harness bar, a harness needs to be mounted to the roll cage. The only use for a harness bar is to mount a digicam IMO.
02-11-2003, 12:53 AM
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Hey Anir
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva"> Greg, how about RA over Memorial Day with the Chicago "hey youse guys" gang? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">You spell like you're from Kentucky.
Everyone knows there is no "e" at the end yous.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva"> Greg, how about RA over Memorial Day with the Chicago "hey youse guys" gang? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">You spell like you're from Kentucky.
Everyone knows there is no "e" at the end yous.
02-11-2003, 12:58 AM
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Greg
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva"> As long as the snow if gone by then I would love to go back to Road America. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Real men race on Blizzaks.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva"> As long as the snow if gone by then I would love to go back to Road America. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Real men race on Blizzaks.
02-11-2003, 12:32 PM
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Over the past 3-4 years, I've done the full circle from DE'ng a street car, to time trialing the same, to developing a full blown 964 based racecar with big trailer, to selling the race car and buying a street 993.
I'd agree with the posts in this thread that the 993 is not the best racing vehicle, nor is any street Porsche IMO. Not only is it heavy, but it is (the most) expensive to run, maintain, and fix when you bend it. Looking back on it, if I knew any better, I'd have kept my Porsches at the POC Improved class specs, which is basically a street car with better shocks (no Pss9's alllowed), DAS rollbar, adjustable sway bars, and R compound tires. This allows you to have fun on track occaisonally, and not give up the streetability.
For the racing part, I would have done exactly what people are expousing in this thread: Buy a SRF, a Radical, even a spec class Miatta. I figure that a Radical would have cost me approximately 1/2 of what it cost to develop the 911 race car. A Miatta would have cost.....christ like 1/6th.
Additionally, the classes are much larger, more competitive, with less variation in the cars.
The people going to these SCCA spec class cars have the right idea.
Learn from them and keep the expensive/heavy 911 mostly on the street.
I'd agree with the posts in this thread that the 993 is not the best racing vehicle, nor is any street Porsche IMO. Not only is it heavy, but it is (the most) expensive to run, maintain, and fix when you bend it. Looking back on it, if I knew any better, I'd have kept my Porsches at the POC Improved class specs, which is basically a street car with better shocks (no Pss9's alllowed), DAS rollbar, adjustable sway bars, and R compound tires. This allows you to have fun on track occaisonally, and not give up the streetability.
For the racing part, I would have done exactly what people are expousing in this thread: Buy a SRF, a Radical, even a spec class Miatta. I figure that a Radical would have cost me approximately 1/2 of what it cost to develop the 911 race car. A Miatta would have cost.....christ like 1/6th.
Additionally, the classes are much larger, more competitive, with less variation in the cars.
The people going to these SCCA spec class cars have the right idea.
Learn from them and keep the expensive/heavy 911 mostly on the street.
