PPI COSTS?? Explain your experiences
12-19-2018, 09:16 AM
#1
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Thread Starter
PPI COSTS?? Explain your experiences
To all 993 owners,
Im considering getting into a 993. I want to potentially purchase a DRIVER. Im focusing on S/4S but not entirely dead set. No tracking. Im not looking for a concourse/garage queen so this leads to my question. What would you estimate a thorough PPI to cost? Cars I’m considering are out of my state so I can’t just pop over and test drive easily. What items to make sure of? What things did you perhaps over look at time of purchase? Thank you in advance for any guidance .
Im considering getting into a 993. I want to potentially purchase a DRIVER. Im focusing on S/4S but not entirely dead set. No tracking. Im not looking for a concourse/garage queen so this leads to my question. What would you estimate a thorough PPI to cost? Cars I’m considering are out of my state so I can’t just pop over and test drive easily. What items to make sure of? What things did you perhaps over look at time of purchase? Thank you in advance for any guidance .
12-19-2018, 09:40 AM
#2
Race Director
$400 to $500 for leakdown and thorough review. TRE in CA did mine with the agreement that if they saw anything that may be a dealbreaker, they would stop before wasting any more time and money. They didn't find anything and the seller and I agreed to split the cost of spark plugs since they were out anyway for the leakdown.
12-19-2018, 09:58 AM
#3
Rennlist Member
In the last few years, mobile PPI inspectors have popped up all over the country. For like $150 you get a thorough eval with lots of pics. The downside is that they don't know porsches in particular, so it's a more general inspection. But it's cheap and thorough. Never use the scam national ppi aggregators like Lemon-something-something. Use yelp to find someone local and reputable.
OTOH, p-car specialists might know particular problems to look for and can give you price estimates to fix, but inspections aren't their main biz so they aren't very detailed or thorough.
Today, I'd probably use a mobile inspector and just give him a list of 993-specific things to check out in addition to his normal list.
OTOH, p-car specialists might know particular problems to look for and can give you price estimates to fix, but inspections aren't their main biz so they aren't very detailed or thorough.
Today, I'd probably use a mobile inspector and just give him a list of 993-specific things to check out in addition to his normal list.
12-19-2018, 11:48 AM
#4
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There is one very important area to be aware of regarding 993s and PPIs. Some 993s have an issue with their valve guides. They will fail causing excess oil usage and SAI failure. A normal PPI with a compression check and leak down test will NOT detect this issue. If you purchase a 993 with bad valve guides the fix is very expensive.
Back in 2005 Steve Weiner-Rennsport Systems (RL Technical Advisor) posted......
.....the side-wiggle test is subjective and its requires someone with extensive experience to make a judgement about how much sideplay is OK and what constitutes too much. Fortunately or unfortunately, this is the only way I know of to make an assessment of valve guide wear aside from taking everything apart and measuring guide-to-stem clearances.
For me, the side-wiggle test has proven to be accurate in making a judgement about whether the guides need replacement but I've been doing this a LONG time,....
Like many other endeavors, a minimum level of competance is required for ANY PPI to be useful and valuable.
Cost wise I paid $800 for a comprehensive PPI..... and they missed the valve guides and a few other issues. Good luck and keep us posted,
Back in 2005 Steve Weiner-Rennsport Systems (RL Technical Advisor) posted......
.....the side-wiggle test is subjective and its requires someone with extensive experience to make a judgement about how much sideplay is OK and what constitutes too much. Fortunately or unfortunately, this is the only way I know of to make an assessment of valve guide wear aside from taking everything apart and measuring guide-to-stem clearances.
For me, the side-wiggle test has proven to be accurate in making a judgement about whether the guides need replacement but I've been doing this a LONG time,....
Like many other endeavors, a minimum level of competance is required for ANY PPI to be useful and valuable.
Cost wise I paid $800 for a comprehensive PPI..... and they missed the valve guides and a few other issues. Good luck and keep us posted,
12-19-2018, 11:55 AM
#5
There is always a risk buying a used car that is now 20+ years old. I would either ask a local rennlister with 993 experience (or one of the local PPI inspectors) to have a first look for some easy items that would make someone walk away. If a car passes this test and you are looking at and S or 4S (60k plus investment) I would get it to a shop that knows 993 and at least get a PPI including a leakdown test.
12-19-2018, 02:45 PM
#6
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Thank you for responses thus far. Very helpful. Hope to join the family.
12-21-2018, 07:27 PM
#7
When you have a PPI done, get someone who has a lot of experience with air cooled cars.
Even then, they can be wrong.
They guy who did my PPI said the sunroof was rattling and it would be an expensive fix.
The noise was from the factory cassette hold in the console rattling. The sunroof had no issues.
Even then, they can be wrong.
They guy who did my PPI said the sunroof was rattling and it would be an expensive fix.
The noise was from the factory cassette hold in the console rattling. The sunroof had no issues.
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12-21-2018, 08:23 PM
#8
Rennlist Member
Before ponying up for a PPI, have a Rennlist 993 owner nearby the car go eyeball it and the paperwork.
His mission is to answer the question, “is the car the real deal”? That’ll eliminate some dogs and the PPI expense.
Did this w the 997 then with thumbs up from
the Rennlister did the PPI.
His mission is to answer the question, “is the car the real deal”? That’ll eliminate some dogs and the PPI expense.
Did this w the 997 then with thumbs up from
the Rennlister did the PPI.
12-21-2018, 10:00 PM
#9
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Where are you located?
12-22-2018, 07:23 PM
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There is always a risk buying a used car that is now 20+ years old. I would either ask a local rennlister with 993 experience (or one of the local PPI inspectors) to have a first look for some easy items that would make someone walk away. If a car passes this test and you are looking at and S or 4S (60k plus investment) I would get it to a shop that knows 993 and at least get a PPI including a leakdown test.
12-22-2018, 08:58 PM
#12
2K!
Even Ferrari dealers don't charge that.
Can get pretty expensive once you start racking up 911 turds that you don't buy.
If anyone in the Niagara Falls area needs one - I'll do it for a coffee and gas money.
Even Ferrari dealers don't charge that.
Can get pretty expensive once you start racking up 911 turds that you don't buy.
If anyone in the Niagara Falls area needs one - I'll do it for a coffee and gas money.
12-23-2018, 01:13 PM
#13
Rennlist Member
12-23-2018, 03:07 PM
#14
In the past year I got PPIs for two different 993s, one in CO and one in CA, and both were in the $350-$500 range (don't recall exact prices). Both included leak-down tests. One had a thorough write up and the other did not (but it was for a sub-23k car, so that could explain some).
I sourced the PPI providers by soliciting input from RL and I was pleased with the outcome of both PPIs.
I sourced the PPI providers by soliciting input from RL and I was pleased with the outcome of both PPIs.
12-23-2018, 09:19 PM
#15
I have had good and bad experiences with PPIs. As others have stated, getting a PPI done by someone/a shop that really knows 993s is important. In fact, if you cannot find someone with experience local to the car, I would lean away from a PPI and spend the money on flying out to see the car in person.
I recently purchased a "driver" 993 Turbo from out of a state. I am in TX, and the car was in MA. I had a copy of the "Essential 993 Companion" and took thorough notes on the included PPI section. I also researched a lot on RL prior to flying out to see the car. The problem with PPIs is that there are certain things that could potentially bug you that the inspector wont notice. For example, if you say something like, check for any funny smells, that does not mean much to the inspector unless its very noticeable, especially when they are not familiar with what these air cooled Porsches smell like. I made my own checklist and went through everything with the owner. Including the test drive, I spent 3 hours going over the car. I did not have a compression or leak down check done on this car. I could not find a place local to the PO to have one done. I did, however, look for the symptoms of low compression during my time with the car. Once I was satisfied, I made the deal and drove the car home 1800 miles to TX. Zero issues over 1800 miles and three days on the road. I have a lot of confidence in the car at this point.
I recently purchased a "driver" 993 Turbo from out of a state. I am in TX, and the car was in MA. I had a copy of the "Essential 993 Companion" and took thorough notes on the included PPI section. I also researched a lot on RL prior to flying out to see the car. The problem with PPIs is that there are certain things that could potentially bug you that the inspector wont notice. For example, if you say something like, check for any funny smells, that does not mean much to the inspector unless its very noticeable, especially when they are not familiar with what these air cooled Porsches smell like. I made my own checklist and went through everything with the owner. Including the test drive, I spent 3 hours going over the car. I did not have a compression or leak down check done on this car. I could not find a place local to the PO to have one done. I did, however, look for the symptoms of low compression during my time with the car. Once I was satisfied, I made the deal and drove the car home 1800 miles to TX. Zero issues over 1800 miles and three days on the road. I have a lot of confidence in the car at this point.