Battery woes
04-07-2022, 08:35 PM
#61
Not anymore. If the issue doesn't fulfill VW criteria, the dealer won't warrant the part.
Basically, PIWIS code, test failure (eg battery) or visible failure (PDK lever crack on 992) are covered.
On my past car (991.2), a rubber grommet inside the top cover was defective and scratched the top to the point of marking the canvas. The dealer tried with the local Porsche warrant "manager", that goes from time to time to the shop and he denied it.
If you have an electronic issue that is not generating a code and/or is intermittent, they won't fix it under warranty. For example, key fob issues. Mine works from time to time. The door handle needs to be caressed prolongou to respond and open the door. Same for closing. It doesn't matter if I show right in front of them. The reply is "we can't just throw parts at the car". I think if that fixes it, they must as they promise by warranting the car. Some of this is dealer dependent or SA dependent. With dealers not exactly everywhere, you need some degree of luck. Currently my SA is a car guy that I have a decent rapport. I don't push some issues and don't abuse the loaner availability. He helps me out being accommodating.
One could hope things would improve if the IPO goes forward, but I doubt.
Basically, PIWIS code, test failure (eg battery) or visible failure (PDK lever crack on 992) are covered.
On my past car (991.2), a rubber grommet inside the top cover was defective and scratched the top to the point of marking the canvas. The dealer tried with the local Porsche warrant "manager", that goes from time to time to the shop and he denied it.
If you have an electronic issue that is not generating a code and/or is intermittent, they won't fix it under warranty. For example, key fob issues. Mine works from time to time. The door handle needs to be caressed prolongou to respond and open the door. Same for closing. It doesn't matter if I show right in front of them. The reply is "we can't just throw parts at the car". I think if that fixes it, they must as they promise by warranting the car. Some of this is dealer dependent or SA dependent. With dealers not exactly everywhere, you need some degree of luck. Currently my SA is a car guy that I have a decent rapport. I don't push some issues and don't abuse the loaner availability. He helps me out being accommodating.
One could hope things would improve if the IPO goes forward, but I doubt.
Man, this not a confidence builder. But thank you for sharing your experiences.
So far, I’ve been pretty lucky, and have only had one issue (not a warranty issue) involving a rattle coming from my passenger door. They fixed, no questions asked.
04-07-2022, 09:09 PM
#62
If it were me, and knowing what my service adviser said, I would see if you can connect to the grounding post that Porsche stipulates. They seem to make a big deal out of it? Normally, ground is ground and shouldn’t make any difference, but grounds can be funny, and what you think is ground, is not true ground, and therefore, may do something to the battery voltage sensor he mentions?
04-07-2022, 09:40 PM
#63
Changed my connection to the grounding post (which is difficult as that post has a captive washer and can't put the O-ring underneath w/o squashing the connector) ... but no difference. Shortly after starting the car I did see 13.3V but after idle calms down it goes right back to 12.2-4V. Used the car all day and stop and go and car started w/o issues. So, not sure what is going on.
Hopefully, the dealers ship can get to the bottom of what’s going on?
04-08-2022, 09:47 AM
#64
So, when starting to drive the car this morning it was 12.2V...goes up to 14.9V when breaking only. Then after some time it settled 13.1 to 13.3...and only goes higher when breaking. Stopped at my service dealer and explained what I see - he says sounds normal ...but I have an appointment next Friday to get it checked in detail. Until then, I have his direct number in case I get stranded somewhere.
04-08-2022, 10:12 AM
#65
So, when starting to drive the car this morning it was 12.2V...goes up to 14.9V when breaking only. Then after some time it settled 13.1 to 13.3...and only goes higher when breaking. Stopped at my service dealer and explained what I see - he says sounds normal ...but I have an appointment next Friday to get it checked in detail. Until then, I have his direct number in case I get stranded somewhere.
Never, ever had any of my cars do anything like this?
As a suggestion, go out again and replicate, but this time, make a video of the voltage fluctuations as you do this…and then show to your service manager….so you don;t get in the usual, “our tech can’t replicate the issue”. That could save you some time.
Last edited by CodyBigdog; 04-08-2022 at 10:16 AM.
04-08-2022, 10:38 AM
#66
Changed my connection to the grounding post (which is difficult as that post has a captive washer and can't put the O-ring underneath w/o squashing the connector) ... but no difference. Shortly after starting the car I did see 13.3V but after idle calms down it goes right back to 12.2-4V. Used the car all day and stop and go and car started w/o issues. So, not sure what is going on.
04-08-2022, 12:08 PM
#67
Seriously? He said that your voltage changing from 12.2v to 14.9v “only while breaking”, “was normal”?? Unless you have some kind of regenerative braking system on your car, I call BS (on your service person).
Never, ever had any of my cars do anything like this?
As a suggestion, go out again and replicate, but this time, make a video of the voltage fluctuations as you do this…and then show to your service manager….so you don;t get in the usual, “our tech can’t replicate the issue”. That could save you some time.
Never, ever had any of my cars do anything like this?
As a suggestion, go out again and replicate, but this time, make a video of the voltage fluctuations as you do this…and then show to your service manager….so you don;t get in the usual, “our tech can’t replicate the issue”. That could save you some time.
04-08-2022, 12:15 PM
#68
actually that’s how it works. The alternator kicks in when you step on the brakes if the car is in gear the idea is that it saves fuel because the alternator takes power.. I read the technical explanation it started with a 991. You have a bad combination a charging system that works as little as possible for a fuel economy,and a lot of parasitic draw when the car sits Plus a relatively small battery. Perfect storm for charging problems. Carl
I’ll repeat, never seen that on any cars I’ve owned, including the 992. I would assume that if the battery is fully charged (which the OP claimed it was) and working correctly, you won’t see a 2.7v swing, in the battery voltage as you accelerate or brake. Most I ever see in the Porsche is +/- 0.2v swing, if that, as I drive, or brake.
Last edited by CodyBigdog; 04-08-2022 at 12:18 PM.
04-08-2022, 12:34 PM
#69
I know how an alternator works, but thanks.
I’ll repeat, never seen that on any cars I’ve owned, including the 992. I would assume that if the battery is fully charged (which the OP claimed it was) and working correctly, you won’t see a 2.7v swing, in the battery voltage as you accelerate or brake. Most I ever see in the Porsche is +/- 0.2v swing, if that, as I drive, or brake.
I’ll repeat, never seen that on any cars I’ve owned, including the 992. I would assume that if the battery is fully charged (which the OP claimed it was) and working correctly, you won’t see a 2.7v swing, in the battery voltage as you accelerate or brake. Most I ever see in the Porsche is +/- 0.2v swing, if that, as I drive, or brake.
this is how it works.. carl
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04-08-2022, 12:55 PM
#70
I know how an alternator works, but thanks.
I’ll repeat, never seen that on any cars I’ve owned, including the 992. I would assume that if the battery is fully charged (which the OP claimed it was) and working correctly, you won’t see a 2.7v swing, in the battery voltage as you accelerate or brake. Most I ever see in the Porsche is +/- 0.2v swing, if that, as I drive, or brake.
I’ll repeat, never seen that on any cars I’ve owned, including the 992. I would assume that if the battery is fully charged (which the OP claimed it was) and working correctly, you won’t see a 2.7v swing, in the battery voltage as you accelerate or brake. Most I ever see in the Porsche is +/- 0.2v swing, if that, as I drive, or brake.
04-08-2022, 01:01 PM
#71
It's normal. When you start the car the immediate reading will be around 12.2-12.4 (you just cranked the car). When driving / breaking you will see the fluctuations as described with a BMS. This is no area of concern. You should not play with the PCM for prolonged time without the car running. You do risk a discharge as described. Mine (AGM not Li) does fine without a trickle charger for 2-3 weeks. Nevertheless, I connect the CTEK via a pigtail whenever I expect not to drive for a week or so.
04-08-2022, 02:02 PM
#72
It's normal. When you start the car the immediate reading will be around 12.2-12.4 (you just cranked the car). When driving / breaking you will see the fluctuations as described with a BMS. This is no area of concern. You should not play with the PCM for prolonged time without the car running. You do risk a discharge as described. Mine (AGM not Li) does fine without a trickle charger for 2-3 weeks. Nevertheless, I connect the CTEK via a pigtail whenever I expect not to drive for a week or so.
04-08-2022, 02:08 PM
#73
04-08-2022, 02:13 PM
#74
It's normal. When you start the car the immediate reading will be around 12.2-12.4 (you just cranked the car). When driving / breaking you will see the fluctuations as described with a BMS. This is no area of concern. You should not play with the PCM for prolonged time without the car running. You do risk a discharge as described. Mine (AGM not Li) does fine without a trickle charger for 2-3 weeks. Nevertheless, I connect the CTEK via a pigtail whenever I expect not to drive for a week or so.
Not even close to what I see…My voltage, as measured both on the instrument panel and the at the accessory power outlet is always between 13.2 and 13.4 v when first started. Even if left a week. Then it may fluctuate +/- 0.2v as I drive. been that way since the day I got it. I have the LiPO4 battery….different voltage profile/characteristics for AGM.
Last edited by CodyBigdog; 04-08-2022 at 02:32 PM.
04-08-2022, 02:30 PM
#75
Do people even bother to read all the posts. There are a number of posts from the Antigravity folks. The Lithium battery folk. The experts. Here is one of their posts:
”13.2v is where a LFP Battery will sit at, 12.8 is actually discharged. It may read from 13.7 down to 13.2v... but after a day or two of sitting it will always to go 13.2 and sit there during the majority of its capacity. Also sometimes the BMS can hold a little of what we call phantom voltage while the battery is sitting. but if you put a little load on it it goes back to where the battery cell pack is sitting at.... which, after is have settled down from a Charge, will be 13.2v”
So, if it’s swinging all the way from 12.2v up to 13.9v, your battery was NOT fully charged when you had it on a trickle charger, or it drained as soon as you took it off the charger (defective cell??) . You mentioned it was “fully charged”? 12.x is NOT “fully charged”. Doesn’t mean the car won’t necessarily start, But if you successfully trickle charged to the point it indicated it was “fully charged”, and then that day, or the next, or the next, or the next you got in and it was reading 12.2 v….well, I’m saying, and the antigravity people are saying, your battery is not, and maybe never was, “fully charged”. But people gonna believe what they want. Go to the dealership and have it checked out. I’m sure they will tell you it’s “fine”. Good luck. I’m done with this thread.
”13.2v is where a LFP Battery will sit at, 12.8 is actually discharged. It may read from 13.7 down to 13.2v... but after a day or two of sitting it will always to go 13.2 and sit there during the majority of its capacity. Also sometimes the BMS can hold a little of what we call phantom voltage while the battery is sitting. but if you put a little load on it it goes back to where the battery cell pack is sitting at.... which, after is have settled down from a Charge, will be 13.2v”
So, if it’s swinging all the way from 12.2v up to 13.9v, your battery was NOT fully charged when you had it on a trickle charger, or it drained as soon as you took it off the charger (defective cell??) . You mentioned it was “fully charged”? 12.x is NOT “fully charged”. Doesn’t mean the car won’t necessarily start, But if you successfully trickle charged to the point it indicated it was “fully charged”, and then that day, or the next, or the next, or the next you got in and it was reading 12.2 v….well, I’m saying, and the antigravity people are saying, your battery is not, and maybe never was, “fully charged”. But people gonna believe what they want. Go to the dealership and have it checked out. I’m sure they will tell you it’s “fine”. Good luck. I’m done with this thread.
Last edited by CodyBigdog; 04-08-2022 at 02:34 PM.