Matrix Lighting: NHTSA approval/Porsche activation
#61
Porsche has explicitly stated in the configurator and literature that the matrix functionality is unavailable in the US market. They’ve been unambiguous on this point on the web site and literature.
Porsche never promised that it would function in the future via a software update. If they’re able to do that, great, but if it requires re-homologation, don’t be surprised if they don’t.
There’s no basis for a lawsuit here. If the 992.2 gets homologated with matrix headlights, you can’t sue Porsche anymore than you could sue them for the 992.2 making more horsepower than the 992.1.
Any casual search on RennList would show hundreds of posts within the Porsche community recognizing that matrix headlights look cool, but don’t have the matrix functionality enabled in the US market. The vast majority of folks purchased them for purely aesthetic reasons.
Is Porsche a company with a history of gratis software updates? Ask a MY20 or MY21 992 owner when they got their last PCM update. Heck, first year Taycan owners are already being told that they’re not getting the software updates landing on the new cars — and that’s the car where Porsche promised frequent updates.
I don’t mean to be a wet blanket here. It would be a pleasant surprise if Porsche did an update. With that, I suspect that the SA referenced above didn’t pull that response out of the air. I wouldn’t be surprised if PCNA starts pushing talking points to dealers to set expectations regarding the matrix headlights.
We’ll have to wait and see here, but don’t get your hopes up.
Porsche never promised that it would function in the future via a software update. If they’re able to do that, great, but if it requires re-homologation, don’t be surprised if they don’t.
There’s no basis for a lawsuit here. If the 992.2 gets homologated with matrix headlights, you can’t sue Porsche anymore than you could sue them for the 992.2 making more horsepower than the 992.1.
Any casual search on RennList would show hundreds of posts within the Porsche community recognizing that matrix headlights look cool, but don’t have the matrix functionality enabled in the US market. The vast majority of folks purchased them for purely aesthetic reasons.
Is Porsche a company with a history of gratis software updates? Ask a MY20 or MY21 992 owner when they got their last PCM update. Heck, first year Taycan owners are already being told that they’re not getting the software updates landing on the new cars — and that’s the car where Porsche promised frequent updates.
I don’t mean to be a wet blanket here. It would be a pleasant surprise if Porsche did an update. With that, I suspect that the SA referenced above didn’t pull that response out of the air. I wouldn’t be surprised if PCNA starts pushing talking points to dealers to set expectations regarding the matrix headlights.
We’ll have to wait and see here, but don’t get your hopes up.
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#62
There would be no basis for a lawsuit, they never said it would be turned on in the US. There are plenty of features on vehicles that are coded off unless the buyer orders them with the hardware present regardless, Tesla has even coded on and off battery capacity based on the model ordered. Porsche very likely will turn on the feature, unless the NHTSA insists in some sort of certification for prior year models.
Per Porsche’s Note in the configurator, the LED matrix capabilities in certain markets (one would assume due to legal restrictions) have been “disabled through software”. If it’s no longer illegal, then turn it on, as it is in many markets. If Porsche doesn’t want to do right by their customers, to save a few bucks, then bye-bye…they lost me as a customer…and if there ever were a class action, sign me up.
Last edited by CodyBigdog; 02-17-2022 at 09:19 PM.
#63
It would make sense for them to enable a software upgrade to get this functionality. But it would also make sense that they would charge a service fee for this. I don’t see how it would be considered a warranty claim.
When you bought the car, you knew it wasn’t available. Now it is, but if you want it, you have to pay for installation.
When you bought the car, you knew it wasn’t available. Now it is, but if you want it, you have to pay for installation.
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CanAutM3 (02-18-2022)
#64
It would make sense for them to enable a software upgrade to get this functionality. But it would also make sense that they would charge a service fee for this. I don’t see how it would be considered a warranty claim.
When you bought the car, you knew it wasn’t available. Now it is, but if you want it, you have to pay for installation.
When you bought the car, you knew it wasn’t available. Now it is, but if you want it, you have to pay for installation.
Last edited by peterdouglas; 02-18-2022 at 11:14 AM.
#65
It would make sense for them to enable a software upgrade to get this functionality. But it would also make sense that they would charge a service fee for this. I don’t see how it would be considered a warranty claim.
When you bought the car, you knew it wasn’t available. Now it is, but if you want it, you have to pay for installation.
When you bought the car, you knew it wasn’t available. Now it is, but if you want it, you have to pay for installation.
But one could also argue that we already paid for the privilege? Check the prices paid for an activated matrix system in Canada, for example, against what we paid in the US for an unactivated system. I suspect the price is the same in both markets? Porsche didn’t say, because your matrix headlight system isn’t activated, we’re gonna give you a price break? The price was already baked into the system, whether it worked as intended, or not.
As I stated above - I bought the matrix system with the expectation that one day, either fed regs would allow (which seems to be the case), or, like BMW, Mercedes, Audi, VW, etc, etc the coding community would activate the system ahead of any relaxation in Federal regulations.
Last edited by CodyBigdog; 02-17-2022 at 10:42 PM.
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rouxeny (02-18-2022)
#66
I’m fine with that (within reason).
But one could also argue that we already paid for the privilege? Check the prices paid for an activated matrix system in Canada, for example, against what we paid in the US for an unactivated system. I suspect the price is the same in both markets? Porsche didn’t say, because your matrix headlight system isn’t activated, we’re gonna give you a price break? The price was already baked into the system, whether it worked as intended, or not.
As I stated above - I bought the matrix system with the expectation that one day, either fed regs would allow (which seems to be the case), or, like BMW, Mercedes, Audi, VW, etc, etc the coding community would activate the system ahead of any relaxation in Federal regulations.
But one could also argue that we already paid for the privilege? Check the prices paid for an activated matrix system in Canada, for example, against what we paid in the US for an unactivated system. I suspect the price is the same in both markets? Porsche didn’t say, because your matrix headlight system isn’t activated, we’re gonna give you a price break? The price was already baked into the system, whether it worked as intended, or not.
As I stated above - I bought the matrix system with the expectation that one day, either fed regs would allow (which seems to be the case), or, like BMW, Mercedes, Audi, VW, etc, etc the coding community would activate the system ahead of any relaxation in Federal regulations.
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rouxeny (02-18-2022)
#67
The thing is, it’s not “free” for Porsche to enable the functionality either. There’s a cost to have a dealer take the car in, occupy a service bay, hook up a computer, download the software and check that everything went well. If they make this upgradable, I seriously doubt it will be free.
#68
The thing is, it’s not “free” for Porsche to enable the functionality either. There’s a cost to have a dealer take the car in, occupy a service bay, hook up a computer, download the software and check that everything went well. If they make this upgradable, I seriously doubt it will be free.
Last edited by peterdouglas; 02-17-2022 at 11:19 PM.
#69
But reading a number of threads about issues that new Porsche owners have had with their cars, after only a few hundred miles, and owners getting the response, “that’s normal”, does NOT give me any confidence Porsche will do the right thing. That’s too bad because a little good will could go a long way towards future purchases. I was looking at getting the Taycan for my wife….but for now, I’ve decided to take a wait and see attitude.
Last edited by CodyBigdog; 02-17-2022 at 11:30 PM.
#70
I’m not sure. I’d bet that Porsche will decide it isn’t worth the potential hassles, service time, complications to fix something that’s not broken.
Service bays are backed up enough as it is. Porsche has a hard time delivering cars with functioning steering columns.
Hopefully I’m wrong.
Service bays are backed up enough as it is. Porsche has a hard time delivering cars with functioning steering columns.
Hopefully I’m wrong.
#71
No question it was already baked into the price - activated, or not. But nobody knows what Porsche will do? Take a hard line and charge us more money, or sprinkle some good will to people that just spent $100K-$200K.
But reading a number of threads about issues that new Porsche owners have had with their cars, after only a few hundred miles, and owners getting the response, “that’s normal”, does NOT give me any confidence Porsche will do the right thing. That’s too bad because a little good will could go a long way towards future purchases. I was looking at getting the Taycan for my wife….but for now, I’ve decided to take a wait and see attitude.
But reading a number of threads about issues that new Porsche owners have had with their cars, after only a few hundred miles, and owners getting the response, “that’s normal”, does NOT give me any confidence Porsche will do the right thing. That’s too bad because a little good will could go a long way towards future purchases. I was looking at getting the Taycan for my wife….but for now, I’ve decided to take a wait and see attitude.
Last edited by CanAutM3; 02-18-2022 at 07:31 AM.
#72
It does not seem like the US market has paid proportionally more than the ROW for the LED Matrix headlights, where they are already fully enabled and dont need reprogramming. So I am not sure why you are assuming the price is “factored in”. Porsche has an opportunity to cash in on this, I am not sure why they wouldn’t.
#73
Rennlist Member
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 4,410
Likes: 2,923
From: Newport Beach, CA and Melbourne, Australia
Fun fact, even though Mercedes has been selling full LED matrx headlights in the US for some years, which like Porsche have the active part disabled, they're physically different to LED matrix headlights sold in other countries. They can still be activated via config but they use a different mechanism to provide corner lighting, and hence have a different construction.
Not saying Porsche is the same (I wouldn't know) but it's not safe to assume that something like this is necessarily the same component between markets.
Not saying Porsche is the same (I wouldn't know) but it's not safe to assume that something like this is necessarily the same component between markets.
Last edited by aggie57; 02-18-2022 at 09:23 AM.
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peterdouglas (02-18-2022)
#74
Porsche is charging owners do go from 3G to 5G because “their” hardware is not functional, and I think they should pay because the cars are under warranty as the owner purchased a functioning service. This is the opposite it was never functional due to a regulation, and now they can do anything for good will ………just don’t see it for the lights.
#75
Porsche is charging owners do go from 3G to 5G because “their” hardware is not functional, and I think they should pay because the cars are under warranty as the owner purchased a functioning service. This is the opposite it was never functional due to a regulation, and now they can do anything for good will ………just don’t see it for the lights.
But to be 100% clear, I think most of us that have dealt with Porsche before, don’t expect Porsche to do this gratis. That would be out of character for the company who’s 911 model is the most profitable car in the world…for a reason. I expect they will either make up excuses why it can’t be done, or will charge $500 for the change. I think either is far more likely. Oh, and whatever they charge (if that’s what they do), is absolutely not the issue with me. I just paid over $155K for a car, so what’s another few hundred? price of an oil change? It’s about Porsche stepping up to make a very minor change to keep it’s customers happy. this issue is about customer relations. Period.
Last edited by CodyBigdog; 02-18-2022 at 10:45 AM.
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