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When I was growing up, 911s were known to be a bit touchy. That oversteer would bite you in no time at all and required a competent operator to really push it. Between electronics and chassis improvements, that has largely been bred out and most of us can drive a modern 911 pretty aggressively. But now self-parking has come to the 911, and, while technologically impressive, is it yet another move away from premier sports car to just another sporty GT? Kinda doubt Ferrari is going to offer self-parking anytime soon . . .
Much of the technology keeps a lot of dentists out of ditches. The inclusion of technology doesn’t make the 911 a GT. These things augment the experience of the car.
Nostalgia clouds people’s brains. Old cars were slow. Tires were terrible. Those cars would rust away and return to the earth. The posters that people had on their walls wasn’t the car that rolled off of the lots.
Heck, companies like Singer, etc exist, because people who went out to buy their “dream” air cooled 911s realized that they’re not as nearly as magical as they thought they would be.
The modern 911 is still the greatest sports car that money can buy. Sure, it’s now supercar fast, hyper-reliable, and can be a teddy bear when you don’t want to push it. The proportions have changed, but the physical growth of the 911 has been greatly exaggerated. It still feels like a 911. It drives like a 911. The bad habits have been demoted to merely character.
I enjoy that character. To that point, I am going to drive 500 miles today, because that’s what these cars are for. 👍
When I was growing up, 911s were known to be a bit touchy. That oversteer would bite you in no time at all and required a competent operator to really push it. Between electronics and chassis improvements, that has largely been bred out and most of us can drive a modern 911 pretty aggressively. But now self-parking has come to the 911, and, while technologically impressive, is it yet another move away from premier sports car to just another sporty GT? Kinda doubt Ferrari is going to offer self-parking anytime soon . . .
Originally Posted by jnkirk1974
They need to leave that technology to the Taycans, Macans, Cayennes, etc. This technology only adds more weight to a car.
The 911 should be left as pure as possible. Self parking is not needed. Anyone who wants it shouldn't be driving a 911.
The 911 is for drivers.
Who are either of you to tell us what we should or should not have in OUR 911? You can spec it anyway you want. You can ridicule at your heart's desire. But you can't tell me how best to enjoy MY 911. Unless, of course, you're writing the check. I will then gladly take your views into consideration.
Alright, I’ll bite on this one. I’m sure I’ll be in the minority here. In my opinion, safety aids make the car better and allow more of us to push and enjoy the car while reducing risk of loss of control. With the 911, all of this can be turned off if you want the non-assisted experience. On a track day, this is great. Not all performance cars allow this. My M235i forces the car into normal mode (from sport+) when you fully disable traction control. This is one of the few complaints I have on that car. It really detracts from track day experience.
As for the parking aids like parking sensors, surround view, etc., in my opinion, have nothing to do with driving the car - just parking it. With the 911, most of these assist items are optional so those who don’t want them can leave them off. For me, I chose to add LCA and Remote Park Assist. For LCA, I find this a useful tool when driving my wife’s X5 so I spec’d on my 911. For the Remote Park Assist, it was only $1k more than surround view + LCA and I like the added safety feature of rear cross traffic detect that comes with it.
Last edited by jeffclevenger; 11-28-2021 at 12:24 PM.
Who are either of you to tell us what we should or should not have in OUR 911? You can spec it anyway you want. You can ridicule at your heart's desire. But you can't tell me how best to enjoy MY 911. Unless, of course, you're writing the check. I will then gladly take your views into consideration.
I doubt the posts you quoted were directed at anyone in particular, rather, they're directed at Porsche for perhaps changing the original character of the 911 by adding electronic driver assists for EVERYTHING. To me, the self-parking option is a "look at me, look what my car can do!" feature.
They need to leave that technology to the Taycans, Macans, Cayennes, etc. This technology only adds more weight to a car.
The 911 should be left as pure as possible. Self parking is not needed. Anyone who wants it shouldn't be driving a 911.
The 911 is for drivers.
Could not agree more
Every time I hear about the “latest” tech added to the newest model year I groan. Self parking? No thanks. Come on, Porsche, let the 911 be a 911. And if somebody isn’t happy with it, let them buy another car. Half these 911 owners drive them like luxury sedans anyhow, we need less of that
Who are either of you to tell us what we should or should not have in OUR 911? You can spec it anyway you want. You can ridicule at your heart's desire. But you can't tell me how best to enjoy MY 911. Unless, of course, you're writing the check. I will then gladly take your views into consideration.
I think you missed his point.
Its only your 911 when you buy it
Porsche can choose to NOT offer these options to steer people who don’t enjoy driving (and driving fast and spiritedly) towards their other offerings. And that’s all that he is saying that Porsche should consider doing.
Porsche can choose to NOT offer these options to steer people who don’t enjoy driving (and driving fast and spiritedly) towards their other offerings. And that’s all that he is saying that Porsche should consider doing.
Perhaps I did miss the point. But I do disagree with the premise. I think Porsche should allow those features on the 911. Those who want it will get it. I got the 360 surround view and park assist. I won't use all those features, but as a city daily driver, I want them. I got FAL for the same reason.
They need to leave that technology to the Taycans, Macans, Cayennes, etc. This technology only adds more weight to a car.
The 911 should be left as pure as possible. Self parking is not needed. Anyone who wants it shouldn't be driving a 911.
The 911 is for drivers.
While I tend to agree with you, not sure how much extra weight most of the software/sensor based technology adds to the overall weight of the car? Certainly FAR less than those who option for a glass sunroof (30-40lbs of extra weight at the highest party of the car), or the extended gas tank (each extra gallon of gas adds 6.1 pounds), etc.
People are gonna get the options they want, and, I would guess that the overwhelming majority of Porsche owners don’t track their cars with any kind of regularity…so an extra 50+ pounds is meaningless.
Last edited by CodyBigdog; 11-28-2021 at 12:41 PM.
Much of the technology keeps a lot of dentists out of ditches. The inclusion of technology doesn’t make the 911 a GT. These things augment the experience of the car.
Nostalgia clouds people’s brains. Old cars were slow. Tires were terrible. Those cars would rust away and return to the earth. The posters that people had on their walls wasn’t the car that rolled off of the lots.
Heck, companies like Singer, etc exist, because people who went out to buy their “dream” air cooled 911s realized that they’re not as nearly as magical as they thought they would be.
The modern 911 is still the greatest sports car that money can buy. Sure, it’s now supercar fast, hyper-reliable, and can be a teddy bear when you don’t want to push it. The proportions have changed, but the physical growth of the 911 has been greatly exaggerated. It still feels like a 911. It drives like a 911. The bad habits have been demoted to merely character.
I enjoy that character. To that point, I am going to drive 500 miles today, because that’s what these cars are for. 👍
Much of the technology keeps a lot of dentists out of ditches. The inclusion of technology doesn’t make the 911 a GT. These things augment the experience of the car.
Nostalgia clouds people’s brains. Old cars were slow. Tires were terrible. Those cars would rust away and return to the earth. The posters that people had on their walls wasn’t the car that rolled off of the lots.
Yes and no. Many tech features add safety and solve a problem, and enhance the car. But adding self-drive or self-parking just goes in a direction that is the antithesis of what the 911 is—a driver’s car. Tech, first and foremost, should solve a problem. It shouldn’t exist just to exist.
I would wager that if self parking were never offered, it wouldn’t hurt sales one bit. In fact, it would improve the car because the target market would remain driver focused people as opposed to people who want to drive like grandpas while showing off a car whose performance is meaningless to them
There probably aren’t many people using this feature, but I’m guessing the self parking tech is tied into Innodrive or something, so maybe it’s mostly a software thing.
Porsche probably needs all these options to satisfy comparison shoppers.
This car has had GT like options forever. Remember this beauty?
Think about it. If a person needs self parking (or even power steering assist) do you really want them to be in the lane next to you or coming toward you from the opposing direction whether it’s a 911 or something else?
Think about it. If a person needs self parking (or even power steering assist) do you really want them to be in the lane next to you or coming toward you from the opposing direction whether it’s a 911 or something else?
You should stop driving now. There are far more non-Porsche cars already driving in the lanes next to you with these advanced features (and available != needs). And this will only rapidly increase as (all) cars become more technologically advanced.
11-28-2021, 11:38 AM
Fear of being a Luddite
