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I really think you are right. something about the weight balance and actual front contact patch on the M cars is leagues better than the equivalent cars from mercedes or audi for instance. the only MB products I have liked recently are the black series GTR and the new G63 is way way better than the older ones.
audi seemingly never has enough rubber on the road- I hope that changes for the R8 GT as it's the last V10 and will be my "track toy" since I'm not getting a 3RS.
It's the certainty of that front end. I liken it to the confidence you can have in a GT3 rear axle. M3/M4 invites you to drive around that rear grip limit threshold like no other platform, balance the car at the limit = fun.
We have almost 30k miles on our C63 S. Like that one mostly because it reminds me of a modern, automatic E39 M5. Great for family road trips. And rear traction challenged similar to a modern M car. Not as confidence inspiring sideways, though.
Good luck with the R8 GT, looks sweet. Thinking it would be a perfect garage addition, I ordered and owned a '22 RWD Performance for a moment. Even with pads & fluid the (iron) brakes wouldn't take track work, maybe the carbon ceramics will work better. Also, speaking on traction, the car would not stay in either Performance traction control OR off on track for me. It defaulted to full on no matter what I tried, which was unworkable. Wouldn't let you put power down or play at all. Hope you find different.
Was a major bummer because when the brakes were still with me and traction in performance mode or off, found it really fun, predictable, nice handling balance. And V10 is $. But with no mountain roads to use and not durable enough for track I let it go. Around town speeds it was the epitome of ordinary.
it's really good. a rwd muscle car, but with excellent handling and control. steering precise, but numb with some synthetic vibrations at times. front end grip is great, rear moves around on every single drive. suspension is fantastically damped, perfect road car (though I feel the same about porsche gt cars). transmission is what it is, weak point but works if you think of it as a muscle car. seats and suspension mean 0 body roll and your always held perfectly in place.
it feels faster than a turbo s because of the terrifying way it delivers power. it's much slower because of the terrifying way it delivers power (i've never spun out wheels in reverse, until now)
gt3 is better in every category, except in terrifying the driver. also the bmw buckets are much better.
looks wise, rear end is very pretty, front is very butch. it's like a corvette you get the sense there was a lead designer for front and rear. definitely looks better in person than photos.
agree it's an "and" car
net/net, i recommend. a real drivers car.
I've had many BMW M products ... these days M just stands for marketing unfortunately. I really wish that wasn't the case because it didn't use to be that way and I loved the brand. Now days they build very nice SUVs and fast but fairly numb and disconnected cars. There are a few exceptions maybe but I'm so glad Porsche hasn't stopped putting bespoke engines in their GT products and hasn't started putting GT badges on every door sill, wheel, quarter panel, brake caliper, front grill, rear deck, etc. on their normal bulk produced vehicles and then marketed them with an upcharge for having the 'GT' package.
They certainly could and make more money but they continue to choose to not water down the GT brand and that's one of the things that I respect about Porsche and it makes them much more attractive to me than BMW in recent years.
Had a chance to drive few cars this weekend back to back on one of my favorite roads in our area
M4 CSL
992 TTS
992 GT3 touring
started with CSL .
bucket seats A+
speed A+. Crazy fast .felt faster than TTS,
Steering : amazing though somewhat numb
transmission .A
seating position B-
Size : C
overall great job by BMW
then Jumped in my TTS
felt smaller , more wrapped around me , steering feel much better, seating position great Unfortunately I did not push it too much as car was low on gas and we were in the middle of no where
then jumped in GT3 touring
first mile felt really slow compared to the other two !!
MT was engaging , but I can go with PDK .I had few GT3/RS with PDK and felt I was playing with shifting more . But that is just me
steering is where the GT3 front end shined. I don't think it is better than CSL but feel plus precision is what makes it feel better
emotional engagement goes for the GT3
overall , we always compare one of these against another one , but they all have different personalities and shine in certain applications as compared to others
and I highly suggest that people try , if financially possible, try as many of these cars over time and appreciate them for what they are
lol OK - plenty of people can wheel a car - CJ is a car dealer.
And you still can’t polish a turd
The refreshing part is that CJ is a car enthusiast who happens to own car dealerships that then allow him to support not just his love of cars (of all brands!) but to be able to field racing teams at different levels from MX5 to Porsche Cup. There is no blind, smug loyalty to brand nor is there the insecure need to own only the most expensive versions of the rarest models. This is the same guy who once picked me up at LAX in a $1.7 mil Mclaren P1 to destroy the field at Buttonwillow while the entire time telling me how much he loved tooling around in his $29k Mazda CX hatch
Recently drove a m3/4 at Thermal and walked away seriously impressed. I had no intention nor interest in the G8x platform, but placed an order for a base M3 manual, should be here by summer.
Yea it's a heavy car and steering,auto shifting feels aren't "sporty" but if you want a manual sedan, your only choice is this or the blackwing.
I haven't driven the new CSL but should be every bit better than the M4C I drove and the M finally got back on their winning track after the horrendous F10, F8x.
The refreshing part is that CJ is a car enthusiast who happens to own car dealerships that then allow him to support not just his love of cars (of all brands!) but to be able to field racing teams at different levels from MX5 to Porsche Cup. There is no blind, smug loyalty to brand nor is there the insecure need to own only the most expensive versions of the rarest models. This is the same guy who once picked me up at LAX in a $1.7 mil Mclaren P1 to destroy the field at Buttonwillow while the entire time telling me how much he loved tooling around in his $29k Mazda CX hatch
Just hung up with him...he's a great guy.
I buy all P cars from him and know thinking of an Audi R8.
I’ll add one more p-car to the comparison, the 718 gt4/spyder. I can’t believe I’m writing this, but after driving gt3, turbo and csl, the 718 spyder feels boring and it’s one of my all time favorite drivers
anyhow, if you can’t get a gt3, take a look at the csl while still available. I would take the csl over any 911 other than the gt and turbo lines and the 4rs in 718s. It’s special and raucous, if that’s what you’re after, and it’s less than the adm on an rs…
01-12-2023, 12:57 PM
