chuck911

I just downloaded pics from a recent trip, and after all the nitpicking factory paint to death I have to say it is absolutely shocking how utterly stunning the 991 is! Granted this is a 1979 911SC. But I use the same Griot's clay/polish/wax as Hammer, and am able to get the same shine. What I cannot get however is the supreme smoothness and uniformity as routinely rolls off the line today. This is due to more than paint. The underlying sheet metal itself is much more precisely molded today. All the more impressive when considering the different metals they use now. Mine by comparison is a North Sea of waves, the big ones from sheet metal, smaller ones paint. Hammers 991 is by comparison Lake Placid. The final coup though is in the overall shape and design. Where the SC has lots of areas like the fender lips and bumpers that look almost tacked on, the surface of the 991 flows as pure and graceful as a bottle nosed dolphin. This in itself sets a higher bar for the 991, because the eye will more readily spot flaws on the larger more gradual curves. And yet you have to strain to find them. Like I said, stunning!

jlanka

It does not get hit by a sprinkler. Period.

Why do water spots not wash off? Are they embedded in the clear coat?

Here's another pic. Look at the jagged edged of the buildings in the reflection.

chuck911

That's actually really, REALLY good looking paint! You've got absolutely nothing to complain about. Sure you could go for perfect. But is it really worth it?

You need to give some serious thought to putting things in perspective. What you are looking at right now is not perfection, but lets say 98% of perfection. Yes I see the telephone lines. Big whoop. Look at the edge of the hood, the way the outline of the building dips down then spikes sharply up just before the edge. The same happens on the other side where the fender ends, only this ones not so dramatic, plus it does a 180 and flips back down right at the edge. I guarantee if you go around your car you'll notice this happening, to various degrees, all along the edges of every single body panel. If we said the overall paint is 98%, in these areas we might say its 75-95%.

Now here's the thing. Right now those 75-95 areas blend right in. But color sand to make the body look great, now the only waves will be these, and they will stand out like you won't believe because there's nothing left around to blend into. And if you wonder (and you should!) about how much skill it takes to perfectly color sand the gently curving body panels, you should wonder 10 times that about how much trial and error it'll take to perfect these edges.

Put away the camera, pour yourself a cold one, sit back at least 5 feet from that beauty, relax and enjoy the view.

As water evaporates, minerals and particles remain, with the concentration going up and up as the water evaporates. Mildly acidic water can become very acidic in the brief time before the last water dries. This can etch into the paint. Also minerals can form crystals bonded to the paint. Always try the least aggressive first. Wash, clay, polish. Gently.

Hammer911

The minerals in the water can indeed etch into the clear coat. I believe you will have to start with the mildest remedy possible, and work your way up until you see the results you want.

Not to offend, but I think you might be too critical of your paint. Plain gloss black is certainly the most unforgiving finish. If you study other black cars, and look at most any other car of any color with the same discerning eye you may be surprised at what you find.

*** update: Chuck apparently posted while I was composing. Obviously indicated by my text above, I agree.***
btw-Great looking ride Chuck!

jlanka

Thanks Chuck and Hammer for your insight. I really need to get together with some other black car owners and compare notes more, in person.

I definitely need to get rid of those "etched in" water spots - I'm thinking they came from rain, I got caught a couple of times.

Is "clay" the same as a polish?

stealthboy

Clay is just a lump of exactly what it's called that you rub over the surface of the car (with a lubricant) to remove small impurities that are stuck onto the surface of the car. It is not a polish.

Granted, it's some special formulation clay, but basically it kind of looks like silly putty. You just break off a small chunk of it, flatten it into a little mini pancake, and start spraying some lubricant (quick detailer, etc) and rub it on the surface of the paint. You'll feel it grab and then suddenly get smooth when it's lifted the impurities. You knead the lump every so often to get a fresh surface. It's really cool stuff.

jlanka

thanks stealthboy

So to work on those water spots, what would be less aggressive to start? Clay or polish?

Hammer911

Clay will lift impurities that have adhered to the surface, but will not correct any etching. Look at a couple websites like Griot's or Detailed Image for instructional videos. There are professionals on this forum that can tell you more, but I suggest washing, then clay to remove any mineral deposits from the surface. Etching will require polish to remove the pitted areas in the clear coat. Certainly start with the finest (least abrasive) polish. Always try to get by with as gentle a process as possible. Less is more. Use a random orbital with an appropriate foam pad for the polish. Practice on swirl marks or water marks on a kid's car or the wife's car if appropriate. If you are uncomfortable doing it yourself, pay a pro, then focus on maintenance. Keep it clean and make sure you keep a good coat of wax on it. I use a detail spray or spray wax after each washing - only adds five minutes, looks nice, and I assume offers some protection- certainly can't hurt! Don't let anyone else wash your car. If you think the rain is acidic, maybe you can spray it off with your deionizer when you get home. Make sure to check the water coming out of your deionizer - the resins don't last forever - the harder your water, the fewer gallons of efficacy you will get.

chuck911

Hammers detailed answer is superb.

Couple weeks ago at Exotics at Redmond http://www.exoticsat.com I ran into Mark, who until recently was the chemist who helped formulate the clay and other products made and sold by Griot's. Their clay is completely man made, extensively tested, and I could tell he's quite proud of it and genuinely convinced its the finest (meaning both best quality and least aggressive) on the market. He told me a funny story. In 15+ years they had only one dissatisfied customer. Of course they told the customer to return the clay for a full refund. When Mark got the clay he called the customer to ask exactly how did he use the clay? Mark listened patiently as the customer recounted exactly what he did and how his car just kept getting scratched worse and worse. At the end Mark said, "I have just one more question. The clay bar comes wrapped in plastic. How did you get the plastic back on so perfectly?" Dead silence.

jlanka

Thats funny. Reminds me of the time I ordered a "wrap" at a diner and ate half of it, thinking it was a little "chewy". Only after that did I discover I hadn't taken the paper off it was wrapped in. d'oh!

Question about the deionizer - what do I need to replace if it has become stale? The filters contained inside the blue cylinders?

I've only had that since July - is it typical for them to only last 4 months with weekly (sometimes more) washing?

MerlinsGarage

I've had a few black and ink blue - no flake painted vehicles. As an FYI if you get water on the car, rain or otherwise rinse the car as soon as feasible and dry it. The water droplets act like little magnifying glasses which will etch the paint, the effects will be additionally enhanced if the droplets have acid or other imperfections.

jlanka

Good advice. Thanks.

Hammer911

The resins inside the blue cylinders have to be replaced periodically. After a while they lose their ability to attract and attach the dissolved solids in the water. With a little research, you can find out the parts per million of dissolved solids in your local water supply. I believe most municipalities test frequently and publish the results. The manufacturer of your deionizer also will publish a table that estimates the number of gallons of deionized water your unit will yield based on the dissolved solids in your water.

I estimate i only use two to three gallons to wash and rinse my car, my local water is not too bad in terms of hardness, so my resins may last longer than average. My deionizer has a meter on it, and you can also buy a separate meter if your deionizer does not have one built in. You should also be careful to not turn your hose valve on very high when using the deionizer - too much pressure will force water through the system faster than it can attach the dissolved solids.

stealthboy

jlanka, one more data point for you about the 'orange peel'. This is a pic from my 911. If you notice the line across the middle has some waviness to it, but to me this looks pretty normal and you have to look closely to see it.

I think we have every right to be very picky about our cars - they do cost a lot after all. But I think the paint is pretty nice indeed. I am obsessed about detailing my car so I notice everything on the paint - there is a nice layer of clear coat on there so we should be happy about that, too.

MerlinsGarage

There ya have it.