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While I hope your current market value for your gt4 is correct, I think it’s a bit closer to the low 100s/high 90s as the values have dropped a bit over the past 6 months or so and in anticipation of the 718 gt4 coming out(but still pretty strong). To the right buyer I am sure they will pay the money.
My values were based on what Porsche would charge CPO, and those are actual numbers I recently received from Porsche dealers. Anyway, loan value on my GT4 is right around $100k; therefore if selling it myself I could maybe get a few thousand above that mainly because mine is mint and about the highest spec I've seen. Interestingly, the future GT4 hasn't had any affect on what Porsche dealers are asking for GT4s. They are right around original MSRP for low mileage cars, +/- $1k, which I think is outrageous in some cases. Occasionally there's a hot deal on one, but usually it's low spec. I really don't know what Porsche expects with a new GT4/Spyder. It's a used concept at this point. For sure they'll offer PDK and that will account for more sales than manual. The GT4 will probably have the creature comforts it lacked the first go around. But even with more power, what's unique about it? It's like a .2 version with a 4 model year gap. I guess it's the last hurrah for the type which will be eventually all EV.
As for the Carrera T, what did Porsche do to lighten the car other than the door opening straps? Are there significant differences between the T and a base Carrera? It's not much lighter than a Carrera GTS, which I thought was the point of it.
Hmmm, my guess is your GT4's spec was pretty vanilla compared to your Carrera T. That's the only way I would feel similarly.
Originally Posted by MidEngineRules
While I don't own a Carrera T and therefore can't make an owner's comparison
I don't think too many people would consider my GT4 vanilla. It was one of a small handful of PTS GT4s in Porsche Heritage slate grey. Fantastic color, I would have ordered it on my Carrera T if PTS had been allowed. I wasn't all that inspired by the GT4 and I didn't find it close to being the road car the Carrera T is. I know I'm not alone as Pete Stout and others have made similar comments. But I know plenty of people who love their GT4s, as well. Both are great little cars.
My values were based on what Porsche would charge CPO, and those are actual numbers I recently received from Porsche dealers. Anyway, loan value on my GT4 is right around $100k; therefore if selling it myself I could maybe get a few thousand above that mainly because mine is mint and about the highest spec I've seen. Interestingly, the future GT4 hasn't had any affect on what Porsche dealers are asking for GT4s. They are right around original MSRP for low mileage cars, +/- $1k, which I think is outrageous in some cases. Occasionally there's a hot deal on one, but usually it's low spec. I really don't know what Porsche expects with a new GT4/Spyder. It's a used concept at this point. For sure they'll offer PDK and that will account for more sales than manual. The GT4 will probably have the creature comforts it lacked the first go around. But even with more power, what's unique about it? It's like a .2 version with a 4 model year gap. I guess it's the last hurrah for the type which will be eventually all EV.
As for the Carrera T, what did Porsche do to lighten the car other than the door opening straps? Are there significant differences between the T and a base Carrera? It's not much lighter than a Carrera GTS, which I thought was the point of it.
These posts crack me up - its always someone trying justify why “their car” or “their choice of car” is best - and in doing so knocking other cars like the T. If you dont “get” the T that’s ok. Dont buy one. But dont come in here to a thread focused on all the great aspects of the T and ask what the point of it is. Do some reading and you’ll understand. Yes - there are differences beyond the door straps!
As for the GT4 - awesome car. When the new 4.0 na engine GT4 comes out - well thats what will be unique about it. 4.0 na motor.
If you prefer a T spec’d with a sunroof leather and pdk - and I think that is what you wrote in a previous post - something about any car over $100k must have ...
well I think it’s fair to say you don't “get” what the T car is about. Go with a base carrera.
As far as “keeping value” something you seem to feel the carrera T will not do compared to your GT4 - nobody has a crystal ball nor do we purchase $100k vehicles based on future value. Let’s talk in 10 years and we’ll see how the market has reacted to the last narrow body driver spec carrera - also the last 911 with proper door handles and possibly the last T (my bet is they do not make a 992 T)
these posts crack me up. always someone trying justify why “their car” or their choice of car” is best - and in doing so knocking other cars like the T. If you dont “get” the T thats ok. Dont buy one. But dont come in here and ask what the point of it is. Do some reading and you’ll understand.
What a great post ^^^^. And you were way more polite than I could’ve been!
Hmmm, my guess is your GT4's spec was pretty vanilla compared to your Carrera T. That's the only way I would feel similarly.
I actually think of the T as a more modern and user friendly GT4. They both are of a more purist design philosophy from most other variants (well unless you spec the purist out of the T with PDK, sunroof, etc.). But both being sub 400 hp cars they do require effort to get them to perform and their purpose is more singular than with their siblings.
While I don't own a Carrera T and therefore can't make an owner's comparison, I do have a GT4 and a fat and heavy 991.2 Targa 4S, which had a MSRP of $178k. Now the 3k mile Targa's retail value is roughly $140k. My 1 year older 2.4k mile GT4 with a $117 MSRP is worth roughly $107k today. I don't see the Carrera T keeping its value any better than my Targa has, especially if daily driven. So from a value perspective, the GT4 is the keeper. Not sure if the Carrera T will ever be well understood in the future market. Most don't really know about it today. Plus perhaps it's easily discounted for being sub 400 hp? That's why I think its value won't hold like other low production Porsche offerings have. Time will tell. If my wife didn't love her Targa so much, I wouldn't mind having a Carrera T. But it would be PDK for her and that would make me think I didn't have what Porsche envisioned, and I wouldn't like that as much.
Incidentially when I spec out a Carrera T it comes out to around $140k. And that's with no sunroof or PDK, or side stripes. I would opt for the traditional "908" side stripes instead. In my way of thinking PCCB and full leather are musts for cars over $100k (and rear axle steering on 911s). PCCB even more so for the Carrera T since it's spec'd with the base brakes. Not sure why Porsche did that considering the base price is higher than a base Carrera??
Full leather? Sure, for a cush-mobile like the TTS or something. But haven't seen too much leather in the $250+ GT3 Cup cars... just sayin'.
If you prefer a T spec’d with a sunroof leather and pdk - and I think that is what you wrote in a previous post - something about any car over $100k must have ...
well I think it’s fair to say you don't “get” what the T car is about. Go with a base carrera.
Picture me shaking my head, and sorry if I hurt your feelings.
If you're going to pigeon hole what I do or don't get, at least get it right. What I clearly advocated for was PCCB, full leather and rear axle steering. Thanks for getting it completely wrong and flogging me over it. Nonetheless The last thing I would do with this car is make it heavier as it's not that light to start with. As the current and former owner of some of the lightest and most minimalist Porsches of late (987 R and Spyder, 981 GT4 and Spyder) I think I get the Carrera T concept which is why I've been very complimentary of the car. It's really the only 991 I'd buy for my own enjoyment. But yes I am a little confused in that I just don't see where it differs very much from a base Carrera other than the way if can be optioned.
What's really funny (actually sad) is even on a supposed Porsche enthusiast message board there is such division to the point owners need isolation from opposing view. Or they're compelled to want to chase away anyone who they take as personally attacking their choice of a luxury asset. I'd like to think one doesn't have to f**king own here something to engage in simple conversation, especially when you think you share their enthusiasm. Guess not. What Rennlist proves over and over every day is that so many people here are so thin skinned and narrow minded. It's a shame.
Picture me shaking my head, and sorry if I hurt your feelings.
If you're going to pigeon hole what I do or don't get, at least get it right. What I clearly advocated for was PCCB, full leather and rear axle steering. Thanks for getting it completely wrong and flogging me over it. Nonetheless The last thing I would do with this car is make it heavier as it's not that light to start with. As the current and former owner of some of the lightest and most minimalist Porsches of late (987 R and Spyder, 981 GT4 and Spyder) I think I get the Carrera T concept which is why I've been very complimentary of the car. It's really the only 991 I'd buy for my own enjoyment. But yes I am a little confused in that I just don't see where it differs very much from a base Carrera other than the way if can be optioned.
What's really funny (actually sad) is even on a supposed Porsche enthusiast message board there is such division to the point owners need isolation from opposing view. Or they're compelled to want to chase away anyone who they take as personally attacking their choice of a luxury asset. I'd like to think one doesn't have to f**king own here something to engage in simple conversation, especially when you think you share their enthusiasm. Guess not. What Rennlist proves over and over every day is that so many people here are so thin skinned and narrow minded. It's a shame.
Full leather? Sure, for a cush-mobile like the TTS or something. But haven't seen too much leather in the $250+ GT3 Cup cars... just sayin'.
To each their own, but once I owned a full leather Porsche I could never go back. Particularly with all the deviated stitching in the T. It made me check even more boxes for leather options than I normally would have.
I’ve owned both. Carrera T is a keeper, GT4 was not. And you picked the right seats, too.
I'm going to take a win on this too as I painfully passed on the LWBS and optioned the "base" 4WSS+ seats. In the past I purchased ($$$) a pair of LWBS for my first Gen-1 Spyder and then purchased my latest Gen- Spyder with them already optioned. But, despite my love of them, the way they look, and a frantic unsuccessful call to me dealer after my build close, I am happy with my choice. For a daily drive I just am not sure about the gymnasts required for entry and exit.
Waiting a couple more days for it to leave Emden...
03-15-2019, 06:26 PM
