Originally Posted by chucknorrisjr

My current Mercedes lease is running out, so I decided last week I'd get either a Cayman or a Jaguar F-Type. I went to both Porsche and Jaguar dealers today and did test drives. The Porsche salesman spent about 2.5 hours with me, filling me in on all this info about the brand I had no idea about. My notes are below and I was hoping since there are so many experts here, if anyone gets a chance to review them, if they could let me know if what I was told checks out?

-Porsche salesman says Jaguars depreciate much worse than Porsches. They still have electronics problems, so people lease them, then don't buy them out at the end cause they don't want to stay in Jaguar after their bad experience, so dealers then have to discount them further to sell them used. This is also why you can get much better leases on Jaguars than Porsches
-Porsches do not lease well; it's better to own
-Macans, Cayennes, and base Caymans depreciate like normal cars. Base 911s depreciate better than normal cars. Special editions 911s can actually appreciate, allowing you to basically drive the car for free.
-While we were walking the lot, a guy pulled up in a Boxster Spyder 2011. My salesman said that car is still worth MSRP even after all these years.
-In terms of value and investment, salesman recommended not buying new Cayman or 911 like my original plan was. He said if you only want to drive the car for 2 years and then get rid of it, buy a preowned Cayman or 911. If you intend to hold for 5 years or more, he had 3 recommendations:
-1) Buy a Carrera T (dealer had 5 on the lot all for around $130k) and if you drive it normally, it will dip in value for the first 2 or so years. If after 2 years you put it in your garage and don't drive it much by year 5 it'll be back around MSRP. Said Porsche is only making them for 2018 and 2019, and while they haven't released the numbers, it will be less than a 1000 production run. The T hasn't been built since 1960s so this car is likely to be a collectors item.
-2) Buy a 2012 911 997 Turbo S with 14k miles which he had on the lot for $115k. MSRP was $165k. He said the value was bottoming out now, but going forward the car was going to appreciate
-3) Buy a 2018 911 991 GT3 for $203k with 8k miles with some sort of special green paint job. He said, this thing was a sure bet. He said it will never dip below MSRP.
-He said if you have the money, option 3 is the surest bet, followed by 2, then 1.
-If I don't want to spend that kind of money, then he recommended a CPO 2016 911 991 with 3.4l engine and premium package with 5k miles for $85k
-The big risk factor on the above "investment" cars is that if you ever get in an accident, there goes all your collector premium, as collectors discount cars with accident histories by huge amounts.
-One way to mitigate this risk is the lease, drive the car as your daily, if you get in an accident, give the car back at term end, if not, then buy out the car, and wait for appreciation. He didn't necessarily recommend this, but said it's something some people do.

So after all this my head was spinning, as I had no idea how complex and involved the Porsche market is. I like getting good value though, so I'm willing to put some time into understanding this market, though I'm sure it takes years to really know it. After test driving the Jaguar F-Type, while I think it's a nice looking car, the Porsche drives, sounds, and looks better (more classic and refined), so I'm inclined to go with Porsche assuming I can find a good deal. My thoughts as of now, which are easily subject to change based on any input from the experts here is either do a 2 or 3 year old preowned Cayman or 911 or the Carrera T. Any thoughts or advice is much appreciated!

Originally Posted by chucknorrisjr

Ok, here's the list I compiled. I like all of these cars, and would be happy in any of them, so I just want the best deal out of these. I have no idea what to offer the dealer though, so if anyone has opinions I'm all ears. Since these are all 718s, should I post this as a new thread in the 718 forum instead? Thanks again to everyone who's written so far. You guys have been super helpful.

2017 CPO Cayman Silver 12,719 miles, $53,981 asking, $67,250 MSRP, prod 10/28/16
https://nationalpreownedporsche.com/...tallic+2086905

2017 CPO Cayman Silver 5,097 miles, $59,395 asking, $68,385 MSRP, prod 10/25/16
https://nationalpreownedporsche.com/...tallic+2117327

2017 CPO Cayman Silver 6,555 miles, $59,700 asking, $75,670 MSRP, prod 4/12/17
https://nationalpreownedporsche.com/...tallic+2271569

2018 CPO Cayman Black 7,887 miles, $59,900 asking, $66,200 MSRP, prod 11/3/17
https://nationalpreownedporsche.com/...+Black+1556699

2018 CPO Cayman Black 8,389 miles, $60,999 asking, $69,340 MSRP, prod 6/14/17
https://nationalpreownedporsche.com/...tallic+2075501

2018 CPO Cayman Navy 7,467 miles, $61,950 asking, $68,350 MSRP, prod 11/20/17
https://nationalpreownedporsche.com/...tallic+1587139

Originally Posted by chucknorrisjr

.....but I think I'm confident that I want to go with the 718 Cayman.
-While the Cayman S was faster and had a nicer, more guttural engine sound than the regular Cayman, I enjoyed both cars about the same, so I'm fine with a Cayman vs a Cayman S. Also I wonder if I want to drive a Cayman S as a daily driver since it drives quite aggressively even in non sport mode.
-I also want value and the used Cayman I drove was in such great shape, that I forgot it was used, so I'm fine with used, so I'll go with a CPO per people's advice.
-So in summary, I've narrowed down my choice to a 718 (2017 or 2018) CPO Cayman in black, silver, or navy.

For next steps, what about the following plan?
1) Collect all the listings for 2017 or 2018 CPO Caymans from nationalpreownedporsche.com, autotrader.com, and autotempest.com (am I missing any other important sources? Are the latter two redundant since I'm only looking at CPO, so will they all be in nationalpreownedporsche.com and no need to look elsewhere?)
2) Choose 4 or 5 of the lowest price ones that have my preferred colors, wheels.
3) Post the links here and ask for people's opinions on what they are worth.
4) Email or call each dealer and make them offers a couple grand less than what they are worth to leave room for negotiation, and then go with whoever says yes or gives the best deal.

Originally Posted by chucknorrisjr

Thanks for the tip on the Cayman S. I'll compile a list of those too then. To have the most selection and then have dealers compete against each other, I should be looking at CPOs nationwide and not just in my local area right? Then they'll just ship the car to wherever I am for around $600 I assume? Since it's CPO, I assume it's fine to buy sight unseen (just based on the pics) and then just do a quick check upon delivery before it comes off the truck?

Originally Posted by chucknorrisjr

The dealer was Champion Porsche in Florida. Wow, so somehow you know the exact green GT3 I'm talking about? Is that cause there's only one?

Anyway, great replies so far. Super helpful and direct, and makes my life much easier not having to worry about "investing" in a car.

So I like the Cayman but only the latest 718 refresh, so for best value, I'd assume I should go for a CPO 2017 model year instead of 2018? As for 911, I imagine model year 2015, 2016 would be best value in terms of the depreciation curve. If I'm only going to keep the car 2 or 3 years and then sell, since 911s have better depreciation curves, might I end up losing the same amount whether I go with a 2017 Cayman or a 2015/2016 911, in which case I should just buy a used 911?

Originally Posted by GT3RS-Fan1

Originally Posted by chucknorrisjr

Thanks for the tip on the Cayman S. I'll compile a list of those too then. To have the most selection and then have dealers compete against each other, I should be looking at CPOs nationwide and not just in my local area right? Then they'll just ship the car to wherever I am for around $600 I assume? Since it's CPO, I assume it's fine to buy sight unseen (just based on the pics) and then just do a quick check upon delivery before it comes off the truck?

Originally Posted by HelpMeHelpU

Yes, include Cayman S;
Yes, focus on CPO cars anywhere in the US, though perhaps starting with those closest to you;
Depending upon how far a car has to be shipped, it's likely to cost much more than $600;
Don't rule out flying there and driving home--great way to become acquainted with a car;
Despite CPO, don't assume everything is A-OK--don't forsake an adequate PPI from a competent mechanic--better to learn and address issues BEFORE it gets on a truck.
Don't forget to drive the car and have fun.