Drove a 991.2 - wow!
06-21-2018 | 09:03 AM
#76
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 201
Likes: 22
I’ve never driven a base .1, but have driven a base .2 pdk and own a .1s manual.
i definitely didn’t think the .2 base felt much of any quicker than my .1s. It sounded good imo, but was notably quieter than the .1S. Both with pse.
i would have been happy with either engine personally, both felt great and sounded good.
In the end the reason I didn’t like the .2 base is that you can’t get most of the performance options with it. I wanted pdcc, sport suspension, sport exhaust and aerokit. Now the Carrera t is interesting because you finally can get all the performance options with the base engine.
i am sure the .2S/GTS motors are very strong, but I didn’t feel like the base engine felt overly powerful.
in fact I’d say the better throttle response and sound made the 3.8 n/a engine feel more urgent.
but the base motor feels more like the 3.8L than it does say an S55 from an f8x m3 or something.
i wouldn’t be opposed to picking up a .2 gts in the future at all.
i do like the looks inside and out better on the .2 cars, if equipped with the aero kit / sport design pack
i definitely didn’t think the .2 base felt much of any quicker than my .1s. It sounded good imo, but was notably quieter than the .1S. Both with pse.
i would have been happy with either engine personally, both felt great and sounded good.
In the end the reason I didn’t like the .2 base is that you can’t get most of the performance options with it. I wanted pdcc, sport suspension, sport exhaust and aerokit. Now the Carrera t is interesting because you finally can get all the performance options with the base engine.
i am sure the .2S/GTS motors are very strong, but I didn’t feel like the base engine felt overly powerful.
in fact I’d say the better throttle response and sound made the 3.8 n/a engine feel more urgent.
but the base motor feels more like the 3.8L than it does say an S55 from an f8x m3 or something.
i wouldn’t be opposed to picking up a .2 gts in the future at all.
i do like the looks inside and out better on the .2 cars, if equipped with the aero kit / sport design pack
06-21-2018 | 09:17 AM
#77
Rennlist Member
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 884
Likes: 395
From: Houston, TX
Originally Posted by Dewinator
Just out of pure curiousity, for the .2 drivers does it bother you that, even though the .2 is objectively better in every way, in every car that sees you the guy mansplains to his girlfriend, “oh that’s the crappy new one with the smaller engine for the Chinese market”?
06-21-2018 | 09:34 AM
#78
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 2,452
Likes: 139
06-21-2018 | 09:34 AM
#79
Nordschleife Master
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,128
Likes: 906
From: Destin, Nashville, In a 458 Challenge
Yeah, PDK alone changes the character drastically. No tracking here either, so some tenths or a few MPH here or there doesn't matter to me much. As long as it feels right (to some, that certainly feels right). Have you driven a base .1 with PDK? If so, how'd the auto aspect affect the characteristic compared to your car? It's nuts to see how many tenths PDK shaves off now, like half a second 1/4 or 0-60 in some instances. Regardless, I still get jealous when I hear an uncorked 911 being manually shifted.
06-21-2018 | 09:38 AM
#80
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 2,452
Likes: 139
Lol, trying hard aren't we? The time difference is in the launch. The difference is none to negligible in a straight line once moving and the acceleration part once moving and in between shifts may/should favor of the manual. I personally can essentially run same lap times with pdk or manual, but in straight line acceleration the actual feel or "driving characteristics" (once moving) would not be different . . . just a tad quicker pop into new gear with same acceleration force.
And for the record, I wasn’t referring to PDK affecting his take on the .1 vs .2, more so broadly referring to PDK’s affect on a car’s character in general. I feel my same car with PDK builds up speed noticeably quicker than it does driving a manual iteration.
06-21-2018 | 10:25 AM
#81
Race Car
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,410
Likes: 714
From: Northern Virginia
LOL. Talk about "trying hard." I'm sure you're Andretti skills are sound, but no you're not shifting as fast as a PDK. Every shift into a new gear will pull back on a manual. Watch literally any vid of a 911 PDK vs manual, and you'll see considerable ground gained during shifts. And I'm talking pro drivers. But idk, maybe you're the fastest shifter in the world.
And for the record, I wasn’t referring to PDK affecting his take on the .1 vs .2, more so broadly referring to PDK’s affect on a car’s character in general. I feel my same car with PDK builds up speed noticeably quicker than it does driving a manual iteration.
Sucker shifts so quickly!
06-21-2018 | 10:34 AM
#83
Nordschleife Master
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,128
Likes: 906
From: Destin, Nashville, In a 458 Challenge
LOL. Talk about "trying hard." I'm sure you're Andretti skills are sound, but no you're not shifting as fast as a PDK. Every shift into a new gear will pull back on a manual. Watch literally any vid of a 911 PDK vs manual, and you'll see considerable ground gained during shifts. And I'm talking pro drivers. But idk, maybe you're the fastest shifter in the world.
And for the record, I wasn’t referring to PDK affecting his take on the .1 vs .2, more so broadly referring to PDK’s affect on a car’s character in general. I feel my same car with PDK builds up speed noticeably quicker than it does driving a manual iteration.
As far as straight line, again it’s the launch. The 0-30 times have the difference. That difference typically remains same or lessens to 60 or in 1/4 mile. Nevertheless, when people are talking about the better low end acceleration characteristics of the .2 . . . that is the torque curve of FI versus NA and has zero to do with pdk.
On a race track and in theory, one loses about .2 seconds of acceleration, not time, on the upshift. That is countered by the impact of additional weight on acceleration, braking and cornering. There is not that many upshifts on most race tracks. Actual acceleration between up shifts (what the body feels "driving characteristics") will be same or nominally quicker in the manual.
Last edited by Doug H; 06-21-2018 at 11:00 AM.
06-21-2018 | 11:32 AM
#84
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 2,452
Likes: 139
Not talking about shifting as fast. That is not where time is gained or lost on a track with pdk with the average driver. I am talking track times on a road course.
As far as straight line, again it’s the launch. The 0-30 times have the difference. That difference typically remains same or lessens to 60 or in 1/4 mile. Nevertheless, when people are talking about the better low end acceleration characteristics of the .2 . . . that is the torque curve of FI versus NA and has zero to do with pdk.
On a race track and in theory, one loses about .2 seconds of acceleration, not time, on the upshift. That is countered by the impact of additional weight on acceleration, braking and cornering. There is not that many upshifts on most race tracks. Actual acceleration between up shifts (what the body feels "driving characteristics") will be same or nominally quicker in the manual.
I do, however feel that the .1’s revvy powerband feels like it’s benefitted by PDK more than maybe some other models are, that’s just my opinion.
I think we’re sort of talking about two different things re: PDK performance. I’m talking about a 1/4 mile run where you’ll get at least 3 shifts if I’m not mistaken. Each one of those shifts will see the manual lose its momentum as the PDK car will increase its lead. Generally speaking, you often see PDK cars putting up nearly half a second advantages over equal manual cars.
That’s not to say I’m putting the manual down. Clearly I don’t care about every tenth or MPH as I state that to my perspective, a few tenths and a few MPH and a few to several seconds on the Ring don’t matter to me, hence why I don’t see the performance gap between .1 and .2 *that* large. I’m just saying that I feel like the performance difference between manual and PDK is pretty considerable *if* we’re having a discussion about every last tenth and every MPH counting. Othwerwise, I actually prefer manual. I love the way those rapid PDK shifts sound, but I’d prefer a manual.
06-21-2018 | 12:58 PM
#85
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 2,009
Likes: 263
From: CT
Originally Posted by LavaGTS
Someone needs to make a 991.1 coping circle thread.
It's like a battle of power where in every thread waves of 991.1 defenders come out of the woodworks trying to feel better about themselves. Some blunt, some passive aggressive, some timid, some sarcastic, and some cheerleaders. Such a sad group.
It's like a battle of power where in every thread waves of 991.1 defenders come out of the woodworks trying to feel better about themselves. Some blunt, some passive aggressive, some timid, some sarcastic, and some cheerleaders. Such a sad group.
In fact I bought a lesser car couple of weeks ago and got a speeding ticket...
Discuss what's left to discuss...
06-21-2018 | 01:18 PM
#86
Drifting
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 3,096
Likes: 44
Every new 911 every introduced has come with advantages, particularly, as a rule, being faster than the outgoing model. However, they’ve all come with lamentable tradeoffs as well. The delusional ones are the ones that pretend the new model renders the old obsolete and useless, not those who note the plusses and minuses to trading in for it.
Personally what tempts me most if I change out my 911 is a 997.2 GT3, even though I’m sure to some going to an older car is crazy. Everyone has different preferences, claiming that someone that isn’t attracted to the car you like could only be because they couldn’t afford it or need a support group or whatever else is only masking your own insecurities. If you’re truely 100% happy with your car, it shouldn’t matter what someone else thinks about it.
Personally what tempts me most if I change out my 911 is a 997.2 GT3, even though I’m sure to some going to an older car is crazy. Everyone has different preferences, claiming that someone that isn’t attracted to the car you like could only be because they couldn’t afford it or need a support group or whatever else is only masking your own insecurities. If you’re truely 100% happy with your car, it shouldn’t matter what someone else thinks about it.
06-21-2018 | 03:47 PM
#88
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 2,009
Likes: 263
From: CT
Originally Posted by tse
And here I thought this thread was getting boring.
Bemo to the rescue!
Bemo to the rescue!
I have a turbo car. I hate the damned thing and the wife loves it. As far as I'm concerned it exists to remind me why the other 3 NA vehicles that we have reign supreme.
We drove the new .2 car too. It was a "wow" alright but not in a good way.
To each their own...
06-21-2018 | 03:57 PM
#89
Drifting
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 3,096
Likes: 44
You're welcomed.
I have a turbo car. I hate the damned thing and the wife loves it. As far as I'm concerned it exists to remind me why the other 3 NA vehicles that we have reign supreme.
We drove the new .2 car too. It was a "wow" alright but not in a good way.
To each their own...
I have a turbo car. I hate the damned thing and the wife loves it. As far as I'm concerned it exists to remind me why the other 3 NA vehicles that we have reign supreme.
We drove the new .2 car too. It was a "wow" alright but not in a good way.
To each their own...
Some people love the way turbo cars drive and there’s nothing wrong with that, it just doesn’t interest me and I can’t figure out why that’s not ok to certain people on here.
