Palting

Okay, before you all label me as a troll for posting this on the GT3 board, I want you all to know that I am already on the hook for a 991.2 GT3. I just happen to have had a very interesting conversation with a soon-to-be GTS buyer friend.

The 991.2 GTS has been proven to be faster around the 'Ring than the 991.1 GT3. Here's a link to the vid:
My friend's statement is that the 991.2 GTS has significantly more torque (405 lb.-ft) than the 991.2 GT3 (339 lb.-ft) and pretty close on HP (450 vs 500). The higher torque will let it get off corners faster, up the inclines better, etc, etc. So, it should also be faster around the 'Ring. For the sake of having a decent discussion and not get anyone's panties in a twist, let's add the word "potentially" to that statement. Obviously, we won't know the answer until some pro will actually take the 991.2 GT3 to the 'Ring., but I thought I'd get opinions.

What say you all, friends?

-eztrader-

And What's the point?

Palting

Eh, I think it's moot. I just found a time of 7:12 at the 'Ring for the 991.2 GT3. Have to find that vid.

The point? Nothing really. Regardless of the truth, I'm getting a GD 991.2 GT3. LOL. Just thought we can BS around a bit while waiting for delivery.

NiteCrawlr

991.2 gt3 lap time was 7:12

The difference between gt3 and gts line is more than just outright speed though. The feel of the cars and power delivery are different. Both excellent cars it just depends on what you are looking for. Since a moderately optioned gts is about the same price as a stripper gt3 get what you want and enjoy driving the most.

CDinSing

From what I have seen of the .2 platform it should be very close and perhaps faster. A friend has a .2 C4S targa and at our March Autocross he came within 0.6 sec of a very fast (FTD) GT3. The next fastest car, a GT4 was 1.8sec behind him. All three experienced track and Autocross drivers. Take into account a targa S is not the ideal Autocross car and I am very impressed. Full disclosure, the targa was on stock p-zeroes but had a GIAC software upgrade which claims 85hp and 100 lb-ft! So I think the potential to be faster than the GT3 is definitely there.

It would be fun to run with one at the track. However buying one for bragging rights over a GT3, is the wrong reason. Buy a GT3 or GTS because you prefer the drive and it fits what you want from your car.

Tangerine

There's a lof of (cheaper!) cars that have more HP/torque than either of those. And while I haven't remotely explored the limits of the 991 (not skilled, and not tracking) I have tried other cars here and there and anything that is setup as more of a racing car is just supremely more confident when things start going fast. Some of the amazing times from non-GT cars we see I am scared watching them--yes they can get some close times but the effort/skill required with the lighter steering/suspension setup is not to be forgotten.

I suggest you just nod along and agree with your friend and tell him how awesome his GTS will be--and make sure he's getting PDK if he wants to be the fastest on the block. We don't need anyone else looking for GT3 allocations.

(also to correct the math the GT3 has only 83% the torque of the GTS and the GTS has 90% of the HP, so using "significantly more" for one and "pretty close" for the other--sounds like he's trying to justify the GTS, which is fine--encourage him even!)

Lapis

I'd like to have both...

GTS with PDK for a daily driver, thanks to rear seats, normal ground clearance, softer ride, quieter motor, more torque for better driving experience in city traffic.

GT3 with 6-speed manual for weekend fun and occasional track use, thanks to stickier tires, better steering, rev-happy better sounding more exciting engine, better handling from firmer lower suspension, better braking from larger rotors, and much racier looks.

Two quite different cars cars for two quite different uses.

BenDiem

^^^ This!

GrantG

You need to explain to your friend that although the GTS makes more torque at the flywheel, it doesn't necessarily make more torque to the wheels at all times.

Because the GT3's absolute gearing is much lower (9k rpm redline vs. 7,500 rpm with similar top speeds allows this), the GTS doesn't enjoy as much torque multiplication through the gearbox as does the GT3.

That being said, the GTS is a very fast car (particularly if it's on Cup tires like the GT3) and it would perhaps be better bang for the buck if it enjoyed the same depreciation curve as the GT3...

randr

It comes down to the driver in most instances - a poor driver in a GT3 will set slow times irrespective of what the car is capable of. Obviously the same applies to the GTS.

Also, specification is very important - the RAS (rear axle steering) makes an enormous difference through the corners, and on track, this is where you make the most difference to overall times e.g. a GTS without RAS (PDCC+SPASM) will not be that close. Close being a relative proposition.

One thing is for sure tho, the .2 Carreras are capable of and offer very serious performance.

smcqueen

i have a 2018 991.2 gts with pdcc and rear steerling axle and my lap time was very similar to a 991.2 GT3.

Kaizu

The leading automotive tester German Sport Auto did a review of 991.2 GTS vs. 991.2 GT3 in their 991.2 GT3 test.

Conclusion: The GTS is surprisingly fast and easy to drive.

Their lap times with same setup and same driver (not optimizing with tire heaters and the craziest pro pro Porsche paid driver):

Tires:

GTS: PZero Corsa "new model"
GT3: Michelin CUP2 "new model"

Times:

Ring:
GTS 7:24
GT3 7:18

Hockenheim:
GTS 1:08.0
GT3 1:07:9

They found the GTS easier to drive on the limit, the GT3 can be for drivers even a too sharp of a car.

So, in terms of performance they are close to each other. Other is a turbo, other is a N/A. Just presenting the facts here, I have GT3 in order btw.

bccars

That doesn't surprise me at all. Current GT3 doesn't seem to be set up for track work from the factory. I do roughly the same laptimes with it than with my previous virtually stock 991 C2 ! I'm hoping a simple geo tune will fix this though !

MaxLTV

Well, I tried the new P Zero Corsas once - they are slightly faster than old MPSC2 tires but much easier to drive - better feedback and when the car starts to slide, almost all the traction is still there, while with MPSC2 each slide is a bit of a snap because sliding traction is much less than non-sliding. The downside is they lasted 1.5 track days before fronts delaminated. Can't compare to the new MPSC2 tires, though.

AlvinHuyN

+1

people who don’t own a GT3 will justify their other Porsche purchase somehow. And that’s fine with me 😊 it’s hard enough to get a GT3 as it is!