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How is the initial bite at low speed or at higher speed with the ap racing brakes?
I don t really like the feeling of the std drilled rotors even if they work fine.
I fitted some pagid rs29 and also goodrige brake hoses and changed the fluid different times but I still feel that above a certain temp the pedal start to feel a little weak and you start to feel even more the drilled rotor.
I tried the ferodo ds 1.11 already but on another car and the pads were quiet good.
How is the initial bite at low speed or at higher speed with the ap racing brakes?
I don t really like the feeling of the std drilled rotors even if they work fine.
I fitted some pagid rs29 and also goodrige brake hoses and changed the fluid different times but I still feel that above a certain temp the pedal start to feel a little weak and you start to feel even more the drilled rotor.
I tried the ferodo ds 1.11 already but on another car and the pads were quiet good.
The J Hook slot pattern is designed primarily to distribute heat evenly across the disc face. From our website:
When you cut a slot or drill a hole in a disc you impact heat transfer. The area around the slot or hole acts as a cool spot when the disc heats up, which is not ideal. Ideally, heat is distributed uniformly around the disc so it can be hit with the cooling air that is pumping through the disc, radiate outwards away from the disc, etc. Cool spots create stress risers and increase the likelihood of the disc cracking. They also cause the face of the disc to distort unevenly, leading to uneven pad deposits, vibration, and judder.
During exhaustive R&D testing, AP's J Hook design was found to create a constant pathway of evenly distorted material on the face of the disc. The hooks are spaced out as evenly as possible both around the circumference of the disc, as well as from the inside edge (where the hat attaches) to outer edge, with a slight overlap to promote even heat distribution/distortion. In addition to reducing cracking, the even heating of the disc also helps provide an even transfer layer of pad material on the disc when you bed them in.
Additionally, the J Hook slot pattern produces a greater number of leading edges for the pads to bite into vs. a traditional curved slot pattern. While this may lead to slightly more whirring or scraping noises from the discs when applying the brakes, the benefits of more even heat distribution, less propensity to crack, cleaner pad material transfer during bed-in, and more bite far outweigh the slight increase in NVH for the serious enthusiast.
If your pedal is feeling soft, you're likely boiling your brake fluid. That is likely because your discs are running too hot. The brake discs --->brake fluid is a long chain. If your discs run hot, your pads run hot, your pads heat your caliper pistons and body, and your caliper pistons and body boil your brake fluid. Our discs are far more efficient and flow considerably more air than an OEM disc. As such, the temps all the way through that chain are lower with the AP Racing discs.
The J Hooks generally lie somewhere between a standard slotted disc and a drilled disc in terms of feel. There aren't as many small leading edges on the J Hooks as there are on a drilled disc.
I'll let other owners comment on the bite of the DS1.11 vs. other pads they've tried. Thanks.
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'09 Carrera 2S, '08 Boxster LE (orange), '91 Acura NSX, Tesla Model 3 Performance, Fiesta ST
Jeff Ritter
Mgr. High Performance Division, Essex Parts Services Essex Designed AP Racing Radi-CAL Competition Brake Kits & 2-piece J Hook Discs Ferodo Racing Brake Pads Spiegler Stainless Steel Brake Lines
704-824-6030 jeff.ritter@essexparts.com
I can't comment vs oem pads because they were pulled within 24 hours of ownership.
However, vs pfc11, the ds1.11 require much less pedal effort and travel for maximum braking force. It took me a while to get used to it, as I was engaging abs too much because of my heavy foot, which worked well for pfc11.
I am using brembo type 3 steel brakes with pagid rs29 pads on my 430 scuderia and of course I think that probably the feeling of the ap racing would
be similar to the brembo compared to the oem drilled gt3 rotors.
Probably I would prefer the pads that require les pedal effort and especially less travel as that is one think I don t really like with the rs29 on the gt3.
Only small downside I feel on the brembo type 3 rotors at least on the scuderia is that when used on the street it s not easy to modulate when at really low speeds and coming to a stop but of course they are racing brakes.
Thanks for all of the orders over the winter gents!
We've been very busy working on some cool new products...stay tuned for those.
In the meantime, we have the front and rear 2-piece AP Racing discs on the shelf and ready to ship, along with the Ferodo pads. We also have some killer Spiegler SS Brake Lines. These have custom stainless fittings designed specifically for Porsches. They're also designed, built, and tested in the USA...extremely high quality. You can read more on Spiegler here.
I'm thinking of giving the DS1.11's a shot. I've had at least 7 track days and almost 7000 miles on my car and the stock pads look to be done.
I don't really daily my car and it's primary purpose is track duty (I drive it occasionally around town and to work). Can I just run these all the time (I would put them on my stock rotors since they seem fine right now)? What negatives would I see from such a setup? On my GT-R, I ran Endless ME20's and Project Mu 999's around town with no issues (the ME20's destroyed the stock rotors though).
I can't comment vs oem pads because they were pulled within 24 hours of ownership.
However, vs pfc11, the ds1.11 require much less pedal effort and travel for maximum braking force. It took me a while to get used to it, as I was engaging abs too much because of my heavy foot, which worked well for pfc11.
Interesting to know the Ferodo has more initial bite than PFC11. From what I've read posted, I would have guess it the other way around.
Haven't tried either, and probably won't as long as 08's are available for the 987, to be honest.
Hey Essex / AP, what is the recommended wear limit for the AP Racing 2-piece rotors? I assume there is one limit (based on cracking), and a second based on thickness of disk remaining / depth of groove? Please do share. Thanks!
Interesting to know the Ferodo has more initial bite than PFC11. From what I've read posted, I would have guess it the other way around.
Haven't tried either, and probably won't as long as 08's are available for the 987, to be honest.
I personally haven't tried the PFC11's, but all of the customer feedback I've been getting is that the DS1.11's do have more initial bite than those.
I do have some big news on this front though. We are now offering the Ferodo DSUNO compound in the 991 GT3 shape.
Many of my customers on other platforms who wanted more bite after trying the DS1.11 are extremely happy with the DSUNO.
They have higher overall mu across the entire temperature when compared to the DS1.11. The shape of their torque curve is doesn't decline as much as the DS1.11, and is flatter up to 1600 degrees F.
In terms of wear rates, Ferodo has always told us that the DS1.11 will last longer than the DSUNO. Over the past few years since its introduction, we're actually finding that the wear rates between the two are very similar.
Also an important note...if you're running DS1.11 or DS2500 now, you can switch to DSUNO without having to re-bed your pads. They all work very well when run over top of the other on the discs.
Hey Essex / AP, what is the recommended wear limit for the AP Racing 2-piece rotors? I assume there is one limit (based on cracking), and a second based on thickness of disk remaining / depth of groove? Please do share. Thanks!
AP doesn’t have a minimum thickness for their racing discs. 99% of our customers crack them before they wear them thin. That said, I’ve had customers wear them down until the J Hooks disappear. At that point, they should definitely be replaced.
AP doesn’t have a minimum thickness for their racing discs. 99% of our customers crack them before they wear them thin. That said, I’ve had customers wear them down until the J Hooks disappear. At that point, they should definitely be replaced.
I'm enjoying my J hooks on my GT4, they are a great combination paired with Ferodo DS1.11!
Do you have pictures of J hook rotors that demonstrate cracking to the point where they should be replaced? I'm only two track days in on mine, so I have plenty of life left on my friction rings, but it would be nice to have a visual reference so I know when they need replacing.
10-24-2015, 09:02 PM
