The first I hate that the new GT3 doesnt have a clutch thread
03-07-2013, 12:24 AM
#106
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Ive seen drivers in underpowered Miatas passing other guys in plenty of higher powered cars, and it all boils down to the skill level. Too many people are looking to "cheat" their way to quicker laps rather than improving their own abilities. Then when the more skilled drivers switch to quicker cars, those will lower skill levels will still be left behind.
People want any shortcut they can take. On the contrary, some of us love the experience of earning it, especially when it comes to a hobby. The experience trumps the end result every time. The end result is nothing for most of us, we don't get paid,r signed to a pro team, or any recognition, there is no other incentive to do it than for the feeling you get while doing something you love to do. That cannot be trumped by a 1% gain in lap time in a street car. Those that suggest that lap times are really that important in DE is laughable at best.
It is true that 911 owners love the driving experience and manual transmissions but the fact is that the day of the stick shift is gone. It is slow and outdated compared to newer competition in the high performance world.
I enjoy my manual gearbox but i must admit that for track time i have grown tired of the heal/toe with crappy stock pedals. Acceleration and braking are what i find important. Shifting is just a distraction.
With all the high horse power cars out there it is nice to have anything that will help keep a level playing field. PDK is it.
You are right in saying that passoniate drivers love a manual. I can only imagine that a PDK car on the street for weekend blasts will be no more exciting then a drive in a S class benz.
PDK etc is no doubt the future for performance vehicles but as i mentioned before that is why we have older 911s to fill those voids. I will always have a manual 911 in the garage, just not a new one i suppose.
I enjoy my manual gearbox but i must admit that for track time i have grown tired of the heal/toe with crappy stock pedals. Acceleration and braking are what i find important. Shifting is just a distraction.
With all the high horse power cars out there it is nice to have anything that will help keep a level playing field. PDK is it.
You are right in saying that passoniate drivers love a manual. I can only imagine that a PDK car on the street for weekend blasts will be no more exciting then a drive in a S class benz.
PDK etc is no doubt the future for performance vehicles but as i mentioned before that is why we have older 911s to fill those voids. I will always have a manual 911 in the garage, just not a new one i suppose.
I don't think about shifting other than on straights to time up the shift which you would still want to do with PDK in manual mode. I'd quit driving on track rather than drive in auto mode. Auto mode on track is a joke to me. Gas, brake turn. Even sounds boring.
And according to everything we know, the car will be better in auto, so all of the people posting about optimum lap times will drive in Auto wont they? NOPE. They will click the paddles because it's more fun. Making immediate hypocrites of themselves.
03-07-2013, 12:35 AM
#107
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I'm happy for all you guys that got your automatic but not offering a manual choice in a car that has carried the manual mantra higher, louder, and more stridently than any other is beyond weak. People can kid themselves that this was a performance decision, F1-this, 100ms that, but at the end of the day it's clear that this was a margin decision; nothing more, nothing less.
03-07-2013, 02:21 AM
#108
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Manual is not slow, even with the superfast shifts a PDK worth less than a second for a skilled driver. Slower - yeah maybe, SLOW, not so much. And , the fastest cars we see on a regular basis around any track are still manual. So it's not that slow or outdated. It's lighter, that much is certain.
I don't think about shifting other than on straights to time up the shift which you would still want to do with PDK in manual mode. I'd quit driving on track rather than drive in auto mode. Auto mode on track is a joke to me. Gas, brake turn. Even sounds boring.
And according to everything we know, the car will be better in auto, so all of the people posting about optimum lap times will drive in Auto wont they? NOPE. They will click the paddles because it's more fun. Making immediate hypocrites of themselves.
I don't think about shifting other than on straights to time up the shift which you would still want to do with PDK in manual mode. I'd quit driving on track rather than drive in auto mode. Auto mode on track is a joke to me. Gas, brake turn. Even sounds boring.
And according to everything we know, the car will be better in auto, so all of the people posting about optimum lap times will drive in Auto wont they? NOPE. They will click the paddles because it's more fun. Making immediate hypocrites of themselves.
Time difference will depend on tracks of course.
Manual is indeed not slow, but not as fast when compared to automatic.
Currently the fastest street cars on road courses are generally manual because only a select few cars offer automatic. However the cars that have the automatics are very fast. Not so reliable however which i fear of the PDK.
Driving in auto mode is not boring when you focus on line and cleaner, faster driving. All the ferrari challenge cars and now the Cup cars are automatic and i cant see them being boring on the track.
You are right about the auto mode and paddle mode. Auto mode will be the better of the two and yet everybody will be using the paddle mode
03-22-2013, 08:50 AM
#110
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But it's faster! It's faster! Anything you put in the car that makes it faster is better! Even if it's doing what you ought to be doing. By that logic, they should just put Randy Pobst in your car and you can sit in the paddock and watch. Hey, it may not be as much fun, but it's faster.
03-22-2013, 09:28 AM
#111
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PDK offers zero lift upshifts and rev matched down shifts.
Time difference will depend on tracks of course.
Manual is indeed not slow, but not as fast when compared to automatic.
Currently the fastest street cars on road courses are generally manual because only a select few cars offer automatic. However the cars that have the automatics are very fast. Not so reliable however which i fear of the PDK.
Driving in auto mode is not boring when you focus on line and cleaner, faster driving. All the ferrari challenge cars and now the Cup cars are automatic and i cant see them being boring on the track.
You are right about the auto mode and paddle mode. Auto mode will be the better of the two and yet everybody will be using the paddle mode
Time difference will depend on tracks of course.
Manual is indeed not slow, but not as fast when compared to automatic.
Currently the fastest street cars on road courses are generally manual because only a select few cars offer automatic. However the cars that have the automatics are very fast. Not so reliable however which i fear of the PDK.
Driving in auto mode is not boring when you focus on line and cleaner, faster driving. All the ferrari challenge cars and now the Cup cars are automatic and i cant see them being boring on the track.
You are right about the auto mode and paddle mode. Auto mode will be the better of the two and yet everybody will be using the paddle mode
Audi R8
Lambo - All of them
Ferrari - All of them
Lexus LFA
Nissan GT-R
Porsche - Turbo
Mclaren - MP4-12C
Mercedes - all of them
BMW - M5, M6, M3
There are far more high performance cars with Auto's than manuals. Yet I still see a Corvette and Viper with much smaller budgets stomping mud holes in them with a H-pattern.
03-22-2013, 09:45 AM
#112
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But it's faster! It's faster! Anything you put in the car that makes it faster is better! Even if it's doing what you ought to be doing. By that logic, they should just put Randy Pobst in your car and you can sit in the paddock and watch. Hey, it may not be as much fun, but it's faster.
03-22-2013, 04:41 PM
#116
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But it's faster! It's faster! Anything you put in the car that makes it faster is better! Even if it's doing what you ought to be doing. By that logic, they should just put Randy Pobst in your car and you can sit in the paddock and watch. Hey, it may not be as much fun, but it's faster.
Funny how that works, isnt it?
03-22-2013, 08:07 PM
#118
Rennlist Member
03-22-2013, 08:13 PM
#119
Rennlist Member
But it's faster! It's faster! Anything you put in the car that makes it faster is better! Even if it's doing what you ought to be doing. By that logic, they should just put Randy Pobst in your car and you can sit in the paddock and watch. Hey, it may not be as much fun, but it's faster.
03-22-2013, 10:42 PM
#120
What's everyone worried about???
I can't tell you how many times I've seen someone on this forum reply with the words "invest in a de before doing any mods to improve lap times."
So if you are one of those guys complaining that pdk is the track worlds equivalent of liposuction or an ab belt then just invest in a de or just enjoy your day at the track or go buy a 991 gt3 but stop complaining.
I can't tell you how many times I've seen someone on this forum reply with the words "invest in a de before doing any mods to improve lap times."
So if you are one of those guys complaining that pdk is the track worlds equivalent of liposuction or an ab belt then just invest in a de or just enjoy your day at the track or go buy a 991 gt3 but stop complaining.