Thoughts on move from 991.1RS to 991.2RS
02-25-2022, 04:29 PM
#31
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As the OP, this thread sure has taken a few interesting turns 
. For the record, I was not worried about the price difference between the .1 and .2, or I would not have done it. By posting my thoughts and observations I was in NO way comparing either car to the GT2RS, or for that matter the 992 GT3. I certainly poked around for a 992 after getting a spirited ride in a friends car back in October. But I quickly realized anything short of $100K+ over sticker was impossible for me to source. For those that bit that off, I commend them. For me, that seemed ludicrous. I do think the incremental improvements and the actual motor in the .2RS will make it one of the better long term "keepers" in terms of mechanical problems, and potentially value (but cars have never been a money making venture for me). That may be wishful thinking, but I'm sticking with it for now. I keep putting miles on my new car, and I love this thing! Thats all that matters to me. The real reason for my post was to gain any insight on wing and suspension settings from experienced owners and to-date, thats been elusive. Still an entertaining read, and informative from guys that have owned more of these cars than I have.
. For the record, I was not worried about the price difference between the .1 and .2, or I would not have done it. By posting my thoughts and observations I was in NO way comparing either car to the GT2RS, or for that matter the 992 GT3. I certainly poked around for a 992 after getting a spirited ride in a friends car back in October. But I quickly realized anything short of $100K+ over sticker was impossible for me to source. For those that bit that off, I commend them. For me, that seemed ludicrous. I do think the incremental improvements and the actual motor in the .2RS will make it one of the better long term "keepers" in terms of mechanical problems, and potentially value (but cars have never been a money making venture for me). That may be wishful thinking, but I'm sticking with it for now. I keep putting miles on my new car, and I love this thing! Thats all that matters to me. The real reason for my post was to gain any insight on wing and suspension settings from experienced owners and to-date, thats been elusive. Still an entertaining read, and informative from guys that have owned more of these cars than I have.
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Taffy66 (02-26-2022)
02-26-2022, 01:05 AM
#32
Owning a GT2 RS, GT3RS (Gen 1) and (Gen 2 Weissach) and a 992 GT3 I have to say the GT2 RS (agree with carcommander) is the undisputed "King of the Hill" but greatly under appreciated by the the naturally aspirated crowd.
That said, while the 992 GT3 is a fantastic car and does many single elements better than the 991 GT3 RS (Gen 2) ultimately the (Gen2 GT3RS) is the more satisfying car to push, best described as being more visceral versus the 992 GT3 which is more clinical and muted.....translated the rewards extracted from the GT3RS (difficult) are more satisfying than those extracted for the 992 GT3 (easier)...but in terms of the Porsche formula this is exactly why the 991 GT2 RS is ultimately the "King of the Hill" and why the normally aspirated pundits (inherent bias) will never admit it..and most opining have never experienced the differences (other than sound)...Porsche knows what they are doing...more than the tuners, bench engineers and naturally aspirated advocates are willing to admit!
While not asked...I think the 991 GT3 RS (Gen 2) is a keeper versus the 992 GT3.
The obvious improvement of the Gen 2 RS over the Gen 1 RS may be lost on some.....but if it is not why would Porsche spend R&D money on it? However, because it is improved that doesn't mean that the differences will appreciated (initially) by the cognoscenti...
Just look at what happened with the air cooled cars!
I do disagree with car commander though..the 991 GT3RS is a far superior car to the 991 GT3 RS, but in typical Porsche fashion the differences are at the margin, and if you don't get there you will never know!
That said, while the 992 GT3 is a fantastic car and does many single elements better than the 991 GT3 RS (Gen 2) ultimately the (Gen2 GT3RS) is the more satisfying car to push, best described as being more visceral versus the 992 GT3 which is more clinical and muted.....translated the rewards extracted from the GT3RS (difficult) are more satisfying than those extracted for the 992 GT3 (easier)...but in terms of the Porsche formula this is exactly why the 991 GT2 RS is ultimately the "King of the Hill" and why the normally aspirated pundits (inherent bias) will never admit it..and most opining have never experienced the differences (other than sound)...Porsche knows what they are doing...more than the tuners, bench engineers and naturally aspirated advocates are willing to admit!
While not asked...I think the 991 GT3 RS (Gen 2) is a keeper versus the 992 GT3.
The obvious improvement of the Gen 2 RS over the Gen 1 RS may be lost on some.....but if it is not why would Porsche spend R&D money on it? However, because it is improved that doesn't mean that the differences will appreciated (initially) by the cognoscenti...
Just look at what happened with the air cooled cars!
I do disagree with car commander though..the 991 GT3RS is a far superior car to the 991 GT3 RS, but in typical Porsche fashion the differences are at the margin, and if you don't get there you will never know!
I have always hated turbo cars
UNTIL 991 GT2RS.
it doesnt drive like turbo, it doesn't sound like turbo....
I rarely drive cars that are not mine and when I do, I Neve push it.
but the 991GT2RS was a good freinds car. it was new, as in just came off the delivery truck then... it was pouring. I got it to my familiar canyon road... the car does some death defying stuff... I love it.
and I also find that it's a step above GT3RS
991.1RS vs 991.2RS
.2 is better
but improvement vs $ , is highly personal
I tend to buy a new one every time one is release
I like to try them out.
but I am not sure that everyone will be willing to pay the amount of $ for the incremental improvement.
I can only say that .2 is better, but you have to decide if that "betterness" is worth the "dollar spent"
just like some ppl find USDA select = same as $400 BMS 12 waygu... , they may be right if they don't like liquid fat... to each his own. I don't chew my steak, I just drink it.
UNTIL 991 GT2RS.
it doesnt drive like turbo, it doesn't sound like turbo....
I rarely drive cars that are not mine and when I do, I Neve push it.
but the 991GT2RS was a good freinds car. it was new, as in just came off the delivery truck then... it was pouring. I got it to my familiar canyon road... the car does some death defying stuff... I love it.
and I also find that it's a step above GT3RS
991.1RS vs 991.2RS
.2 is better
but improvement vs $ , is highly personal
I tend to buy a new one every time one is release
I like to try them out.
but I am not sure that everyone will be willing to pay the amount of $ for the incremental improvement.
I can only say that .2 is better, but you have to decide if that "betterness" is worth the "dollar spent"
just like some ppl find USDA select = same as $400 BMS 12 waygu... , they may be right if they don't like liquid fat... to each his own. I don't chew my steak, I just drink it.
and mooty, reading your posts i always thought you dislike 991, pleasantly surprised to hear your comments on the gt2rs!
02-26-2022, 03:16 AM
#33
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As the OP, this thread sure has taken a few interesting turns . For the record, I was not worried about the price difference between the .1 and .2, or I would not have done it. By posting my thoughts and observations I was in NO way comparing either car to the GT2RS, or for that matter the 992 GT3. I certainly poked around for a 992 after getting a spirited ride in a friends car back in October. But I quickly realized anything short of $100K+ over sticker was impossible for me to source. For those that bit that off, I commend them. For me, that seemed ludicrous. I do think the incremental improvements and the actual motor in the .2RS will make it one of the better long term "keepers" in terms of mechanical problems, and potentially value (but cars have never been a money making venture for me). That may be wishful thinking, but I'm sticking with it for now. I keep putting miles on my new car, and I love this thing! Thats all that matters to me. The real reason for my post was to gain any insight on wing and suspension settings from experienced owners and to-date, thats been elusive. Still an entertaining read, and informative from guys that have owned more of these cars than I have.
. For the record, I was not worried about the price difference between the .1 and .2, or I would not have done it. By posting my thoughts and observations I was in NO way comparing either car to the GT2RS, or for that matter the 992 GT3. I certainly poked around for a 992 after getting a spirited ride in a friends car back in October. But I quickly realized anything short of $100K+ over sticker was impossible for me to source. For those that bit that off, I commend them. For me, that seemed ludicrous. I do think the incremental improvements and the actual motor in the .2RS will make it one of the better long term "keepers" in terms of mechanical problems, and potentially value (but cars have never been a money making venture for me). That may be wishful thinking, but I'm sticking with it for now. I keep putting miles on my new car, and I love this thing! Thats all that matters to me. The real reason for my post was to gain any insight on wing and suspension settings from experienced owners and to-date, thats been elusive. Still an entertaining read, and informative from guys that have owned more of these cars than I have.but that said, NO 991 are keepers, really. not even the R.
they are good but they are not quad cams, RS4.0, 964RSR 3.8 or 993GT2EVO or 993RS club sport.
there are good and there are GOOD.
02-26-2022, 03:18 AM
#34
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GT2RS = superhornet
GT3RS = not quite supersonic
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rominl (02-26-2022)
02-26-2022, 10:48 AM
#35
Owning a GT2 RS, GT3RS (Gen 1) and (Gen 2 Weissach) and a 992 GT3 I have to say the GT2 RS (agree with carcommander) is the undisputed "King of the Hill" but greatly under appreciated by the the naturally aspirated crowd.
That said, while the 992 GT3 is a fantastic car and does many single elements better than the 991 GT3 RS (Gen 2) ultimately the (Gen2 GT3RS) is the more satisfying car to push, best described as being more visceral versus the 992 GT3 which is more clinical and muted.....translated the rewards extracted from the GT3RS (difficult) are more satisfying than those extracted for the 992 GT3 (easier)...but in terms of the Porsche formula this is exactly why the 991 GT2 RS is ultimately the "King of the Hill" and why the normally aspirated pundits (inherent bias) will never admit it..and most opining have never experienced the differences (other than sound)...Porsche knows what they are doing...more than the tuners, bench engineers and naturally aspirated advocates are willing to admit!
While not asked...I think the 991 GT3 RS (Gen 2) is a keeper versus the 992 GT3.
The obvious improvement of the Gen 2 RS over the Gen 1 RS may be lost on some.....but if it is not why would Porsche spend R&D money on it? However, because it is improved that doesn't mean that the differences will appreciated (initially) by the cognoscenti...
Just look at what happened with the air cooled cars!
I do disagree with car commander though..the 991 GT3RS is a far superior car to the 991 GT3 RS, but in typical Porsche fashion the differences are at the margin, and if you don't get there you will never know!
That said, while the 992 GT3 is a fantastic car and does many single elements better than the 991 GT3 RS (Gen 2) ultimately the (Gen2 GT3RS) is the more satisfying car to push, best described as being more visceral versus the 992 GT3 which is more clinical and muted.....translated the rewards extracted from the GT3RS (difficult) are more satisfying than those extracted for the 992 GT3 (easier)...but in terms of the Porsche formula this is exactly why the 991 GT2 RS is ultimately the "King of the Hill" and why the normally aspirated pundits (inherent bias) will never admit it..and most opining have never experienced the differences (other than sound)...Porsche knows what they are doing...more than the tuners, bench engineers and naturally aspirated advocates are willing to admit!
While not asked...I think the 991 GT3 RS (Gen 2) is a keeper versus the 992 GT3.
The obvious improvement of the Gen 2 RS over the Gen 1 RS may be lost on some.....but if it is not why would Porsche spend R&D money on it? However, because it is improved that doesn't mean that the differences will appreciated (initially) by the cognoscenti...
Just look at what happened with the air cooled cars!
I do disagree with car commander though..the 991 GT3RS is a far superior car to the 991 GT3 RS, but in typical Porsche fashion the differences are at the margin, and if you don't get there you will never know!
People treat these models as PC hardware such as CPUs or new graphics cards. Each year faster clock speeds, more memory, more shader units. It kinda makes sense in PC world because faster hardware means being able to play games you cant or being able to use monitor resolutions you couldnt before. Its a bit different in cars. Faster laptimes and harder cornering speeds matter only if you are competitive and do get paid (or get something tangible) for faster lap times. For most people, all that matters is the experience of each car. This experience will be pretty much the same any model of the same car that has the same engine/transmission combination. 2018 GT3, 2019 GT3RS, 2022 GT3, all PDK will provide the same experience up to 90-95%. The remaining 5-10% is what you are paying substantial price premium for. But lets be honest:
- 99% of our non track driving will not come even 50% of the capabilities of any of these cars. We will get in the car, go to some canyon type road, drive for 50 miles, redline/downshift/brake rinse and repeat 10-12 times and come right back home. You may feel “different” in each car but what the hell is the point? Its the same damn engine, same transmission.
- A substantial portion of these owners never track their car OR never push their car to close to its limits in a track for those once a year track events.
For large majority, this is all about the high income earner first world problems of “I want the latest and greatest” just like most goes and buys the newest iphone when iphone X from 4 years ago works just fine.
02-26-2022, 11:10 AM
#36
Race Car
^^^ Very few things are 100% this way or that. But I'd posit that very few folks are actually moving from a 991.2 GT variant (touring, RS, GT3) to a 992 because of performance. The entire 991.2 line-up is exceptional. We are "upgrading" because the entire package is better and performance is one aspect of that. I've enjoyed all of my 991 GT cars but none of them were so exceptional that dissuaded me from buying something else. Time will tell if the 992.1 touring is "that good". I doubt it. But I'm encouraged that Mooty speaks so highly of the 992 - he's a discerning owner to say the least.
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bogey1 (02-27-2022)
02-26-2022, 12:21 PM
#37
^^^ Very few things are 100% this way or that. But I'd posit that very few folks are actually moving from a 991.2 GT variant (touring, RS, GT3) to a 992 because of performance. The entire 991.2 line-up is exceptional. We are "upgrading" because the entire package is better and performance is one aspect of that. I've enjoyed all of my 991 GT cars but none of them were so exceptional that dissuaded me from buying something else. Time will tell if the 992.1 touring is "that good". I doubt it. But I'm encouraged that Mooty speaks so highly of the 992 - he's a discerning owner to say the least.
- Trade in a GT car without a replacement 992 GT3
- Wait several months (at best 6, average 8, sometimes 10) and hope you are not hit by constraints, shipping delays, or fires in atlantic
- Pay a substantial markup for the new car, which by itself as MSRP vs MSRP costs much more ($25k more for the same build). With a very “modest” $50k markup and a $25k increase in build (with options), and a loss of $30-40k for 991 at the time of trade in, best case you are paying a difference of $100k+, most will pay $125k
This “better” car may not be $100k better for most here due to how they use the car and the overall experience each car provides and how much of that experience we all can extract.
Of course if you are like mooty with somewhat unlimited amount of cash, lots of cars and lots of options to buy/sell these GT cars easier than some here go grocery shopping (sarcasm) then yeah by all means go ahead and upgrade. I bet when 992.2 comes out, we’ll have these 992 keepers show up here and tell us how the 992.2 is such a keeper and a “better upgrade”.
02-26-2022, 08:35 PM
#38
02-26-2022, 10:32 PM
#39
02-27-2022, 12:14 AM
#40
If history is any indicator, the 991 GT3 RS (Gen 2) will achieve mythical status in a few years because it retains the old world visceral charm.... it will take a new generation (99X) before the 992 is awarded that accolade.
Here is a challenging "thought" - The better (more engaged) driver you are, perhaps the more you appreciate the 991 over the 992?. The fun part is you get to decide where you fit on the spectrum, but remember the 992 is significantly easier to drive (IMO)!
Do I sound cynical? Lets see how all this plays out!
02-27-2022, 03:14 AM
#41
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My point exactly. There is always something “better” but the overall “experience” of owning a naturally aspirated, high revving, almost sequential gearbox like shifting is going to be pretty similar between all variants of this car. The cost of “better package” is quite substantial in the current environment where you have to:
- Trade in a GT car without a replacement 992 GT3
- Wait several months (at best 6, average 8, sometimes 10) and hope you are not hit by constraints, shipping delays, or fires in atlantic
- Pay a substantial markup for the new car, which by itself as MSRP vs MSRP costs much more ($25k more for the same build). With a very “modest” $50k markup and a $25k increase in build (with options), and a loss of $30-40k for 991 at the time of trade in, best case you are paying a difference of $100k+, most will pay $125k
This “better” car may not be $100k better for most here due to how they use the car and the overall experience each car provides and how much of that experience we all can extract.
Of course if you are like mooty with somewhat unlimited amount of cash, lots of cars and lots of options to buy/sell these GT cars easier than some here go grocery shopping (sarcasm) then yeah by all means go ahead and upgrade. I bet when 992.2 comes out, we’ll have these 992 keepers show up here and tell us how the 992.2 is such a keeper and a “better upgrade”.
- Trade in a GT car without a replacement 992 GT3
- Wait several months (at best 6, average 8, sometimes 10) and hope you are not hit by constraints, shipping delays, or fires in atlantic
- Pay a substantial markup for the new car, which by itself as MSRP vs MSRP costs much more ($25k more for the same build). With a very “modest” $50k markup and a $25k increase in build (with options), and a loss of $30-40k for 991 at the time of trade in, best case you are paying a difference of $100k+, most will pay $125k
This “better” car may not be $100k better for most here due to how they use the car and the overall experience each car provides and how much of that experience we all can extract.
Of course if you are like mooty with somewhat unlimited amount of cash, lots of cars and lots of options to buy/sell these GT cars easier than some here go grocery shopping (sarcasm) then yeah by all means go ahead and upgrade. I bet when 992.2 comes out, we’ll have these 992 keepers show up here and tell us how the 992.2 is such a keeper and a “better upgrade”.
992.2 will replace it
not many KEEPER cars out there.
02-27-2022, 03:17 AM
#42
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^^^ Very few things are 100% this way or that. But I'd posit that very few folks are actually moving from a 991.2 GT variant (touring, RS, GT3) to a 992 because of performance. The entire 991.2 line-up is exceptional. We are "upgrading" because the entire package is better and performance is one aspect of that. I've enjoyed all of my 991 GT cars but none of them were so exceptional that dissuaded me from buying something else. Time will tell if the 992.1 touring is "that good". I doubt it. But I'm encouraged that Mooty speaks so highly of the 992 - he's a discerning owner to say the least.
991 is good and fast but you don't feel the speed.
992 is little better and faster, and you FEEL the speed, if that makes sense.
in my 991RS either .1 or .2, I am embarrassed to say rarely am in below triple digit. b/c it doesnt feel good until you are about to go off the cliff.
in 992. I am pretty happy at 50mph, and I can dial it up to speed if I wanted too.
THERE IS A BAD THING about 992
the exhaust while loud, it kinda drones.....
I can drive any of my cars ,even modified ones from SF to LA, no probl
I am not sure I can't put up with the drone of 992 in sport mode for 450miles
02-27-2022, 08:08 AM
#43
Drifting
lot of great points...pick your flavor and enjoy
I have alot of miles on 991.1RS...almost 30k miles between two cars.
When my 992GT3 arrived I was torn...do i sell my 991RS. I did end up selling(for reference also have 992s cab with stick)
As mooty^above pointed out my 991RS with GMG exhaust sounded better.
The 992GT3 performs better...not much faster but handles better/more precise.
I have alot of miles on 991.1RS...almost 30k miles between two cars.
When my 992GT3 arrived I was torn...do i sell my 991RS. I did end up selling(for reference also have 992s cab with stick)
As mooty^above pointed out my 991RS with GMG exhaust sounded better.
The 992GT3 performs better...not much faster but handles better/more precise.
02-27-2022, 08:23 AM
#44
Race Car
since u drive the cars everywhere, I think you will really enjoy 992
991 is good and fast but you don't feel the speed.
992 is little better and faster, and you FEEL the speed, if that makes sense.
in my 991RS either .1 or .2, I am embarrassed to say rarely am in below triple digit. b/c it doesnt feel good until you are about to go off the cliff.
in 992. I am pretty happy at 50mph, and I can dial it up to speed if I wanted too.
THERE IS A BAD THING about 992
the exhaust while loud, it kinda drones.....
I can drive any of my cars ,even modified ones from SF to LA, no probl
I am not sure I can't put up with the drone of 992 in sport mode for 450miles
991 is good and fast but you don't feel the speed.
992 is little better and faster, and you FEEL the speed, if that makes sense.
in my 991RS either .1 or .2, I am embarrassed to say rarely am in below triple digit. b/c it doesnt feel good until you are about to go off the cliff.
in 992. I am pretty happy at 50mph, and I can dial it up to speed if I wanted too.
THERE IS A BAD THING about 992
the exhaust while loud, it kinda drones.....
I can drive any of my cars ,even modified ones from SF to LA, no probl
I am not sure I can't put up with the drone of 992 in sport mode for 450miles
02-27-2022, 09:25 AM
#45
