Steel v. PCCB - Paul Watson
03-26-2019, 02:01 PM
#61
Drifting
since I track my cars and also couldn't care less how clean my wheels or even my car is, its always steels for me. I maybe wash my car once a year. I buy GT cars to drive the crap out of. I love how they feel and sound on track, how clean they are never enters the equation. I'm more worried about my house being clean with 3 little kids trying to destroy it.
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wlittleman (01-05-2020)
03-26-2019, 03:24 PM
#62
It is simple: PCCB for street only + occasional track.. Steel for track only, occasional street.
Take your pick. Or you can get PCCBs at 9K and swap out to steel rotors. Put back PCCBs when you sell it.. Problem solved...
PCCBs at 9K from a factory is a bargain. Non issue at all. get PCCBs and swap to steel rotors if you need to track it.
Take your pick. Or you can get PCCBs at 9K and swap out to steel rotors. Put back PCCBs when you sell it.. Problem solved...
PCCBs at 9K from a factory is a bargain. Non issue at all. get PCCBs and swap to steel rotors if you need to track it.
03-26-2019, 03:25 PM
#63
Burning Brakes
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It reminds me of the mid-90s when I had an e36 M3 and was at my first BMWCCA track event at Road Atlanta. I was telling my assigned instructor how I wanted a chip, headers and all kind of things to make more power. This was in the middle of the Michael Schumacher era. That wise instructor ask me, do you think Schumacher could turn a faster laptime around Road Atlanta in your(my) car than you can? I responded, yes. He then said, then wait until you can turn a better lap time in your car than Schumacher could before you search for more power than you know how to use.
Last edited by parkerfe; 03-26-2019 at 04:45 PM.
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hellboy_mcqueen (01-05-2020)
03-26-2019, 04:32 PM
#64
Interestingly enough, given that only a minority of GT3 owners actually track their cars, PCCBs are a very attractive option on GT cars for resale (and trade-in values). Spec PCCBs, and take them off if you track the car (which is what a lot of us do). It's incredible but a buddy's friend who was looking for a GT3 said that if he sees a GT3 for sale with cast iron/steel rotors, he assumes the car was at least 50/50 street/track driven and avoids them or at least, does a much deeper dive. The potential buyer pool for PCCB equipped GT cars is larger than for those without...
03-26-2019, 04:52 PM
#65
Burning Brakes
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Interestingly enough, given that only a minority of GT3 owners actually track their cars, PCCBs are a very attractive option on GT cars for resale (and trade-in values). Spec PCCBs, and take them off if you track the car (which is what a lot of us do). It's incredible but a buddy's friend who was looking for a GT3 said that if he sees a GT3 for sale with cast iron/steel rotors, he assumes the car was at least 50/50 street/track driven and avoids them or at least, does a much deeper dive. The potential buyer pool for PCCB equipped GT cars is larger than for those without...
03-26-2019, 05:32 PM
#66
03-26-2019, 10:31 PM
#67
SJW, a Carin' kinda guy
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Paul is an IDIOT and SHOULD BE FIRED!!! This is SAD for someone at all respectable within the Porsche camp to say 'PCCB are for Cars & Coffee and people who don't want dirty wheels'!?
While there is 'some truth' in his post... if you're looking for a dedicated track car, and looking for the most cost effective solution with little loss in performance vs. PCCB then Iron are absolutely the way to go, that's what he should have said.
However, if you're looking for that absolute last tenth of a second on the track, or that hundredth of a second in straight line acceleration and enjoy the benefit of clean wheels... then PCCB's are for you. (Paul you can use this quote in your next interview)
Best Regards,
Dave
While there is 'some truth' in his post... if you're looking for a dedicated track car, and looking for the most cost effective solution with little loss in performance vs. PCCB then Iron are absolutely the way to go, that's what he should have said.
However, if you're looking for that absolute last tenth of a second on the track, or that hundredth of a second in straight line acceleration and enjoy the benefit of clean wheels... then PCCB's are for you. (Paul you can use this quote in your next interview)
Best Regards,
Dave
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hellboy_mcqueen (01-05-2020)
03-26-2019, 10:41 PM
#68
I’m not so sure. From the factory it’s a $9K option. For a car driven primarily on the street, it’s a relative bargain if you ask me. It’s the replacement cost that is prohibitive, however a street driven GT3 would likely not need to replace the PCCBs for practically the entire ownership experience. All bets are off for a GT3driven on track.
03-26-2019, 11:01 PM
#69
RL Community Team
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03-26-2019, 11:26 PM
#71
RL Community Team
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03-26-2019, 11:38 PM
#72
Rennlist Member
people are free to spend $30,000 how ever they want and should be - I have chosen not to spend that in replacement brakes - but please don’t ask me the tile budget for the bath room remodel - but the tiles are ceramic just like the brakes.
03-27-2019, 12:30 AM
#73
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
03-27-2019, 06:05 AM
#74
Its temp.
In generally cold climates I think the ceramics are less of a must then in hot climates.
And they maybe a bit scare driving to the track in freezing temps.
On the very heavy on brakes tracks where it is hot, steel just cant cope.
Most all tracks I have driven aren't has hard on brakes then is Sebring and VIR for example.
Eventually after 30 minutes you have to back off, or the pedal will get softer and softer until you will back off.
Also, the front tires gain a lot more PSI because they just get too hot as well..
Most tracks and most climates are OK, but the few that are not, really demand Ceramic rotors if you want to hammer the brakes all day long as if its a cold day..
So when I went from steel to ST rotors it was an instant .5 seconds due to weight and stopping power, but the thing that blew me away was that the brakes and front tires were still able to go for a fast lap at the end of the session, something not possible on steel brakes.
Cost is another story of course but the refurbishing cost of the ST rotors @$600 a corner and half price of the cost of PCCB, make it a nice middle of the road option for me.
In generally cold climates I think the ceramics are less of a must then in hot climates.
And they maybe a bit scare driving to the track in freezing temps.
On the very heavy on brakes tracks where it is hot, steel just cant cope.
Most all tracks I have driven aren't has hard on brakes then is Sebring and VIR for example.
Eventually after 30 minutes you have to back off, or the pedal will get softer and softer until you will back off.
Also, the front tires gain a lot more PSI because they just get too hot as well..
Most tracks and most climates are OK, but the few that are not, really demand Ceramic rotors if you want to hammer the brakes all day long as if its a cold day..
So when I went from steel to ST rotors it was an instant .5 seconds due to weight and stopping power, but the thing that blew me away was that the brakes and front tires were still able to go for a fast lap at the end of the session, something not possible on steel brakes.
Cost is another story of course but the refurbishing cost of the ST rotors @$600 a corner and half price of the cost of PCCB, make it a nice middle of the road option for me.
What I find superior in PCCB is their consistency lap over lap. Steels even if kept in their operating temps were in my case not that consistent. That is translated to confidence and precision especially when trail braking
03-27-2019, 08:35 AM
#75
Rennlist Member
I had somewhere around 20 track days on PCCBs on the GT4, and had gone through a set of front and rear pads. When the rotors were measured while mounted the rears read down 40% so I freaked out and put giros all around. When I sold the car, before I put the PCCBs back on, the rotors were measured again off the car. Less then 5% gone all around. My GT3 has PCCBs and I'm not going to worry about them with the 6-7 days a year I do. If I get to the point somehow where I have worn them out I'll put the AP setup on the car.