Ridin Dirty

Hello,

Sorry to bug you guys with some valuation aspects of a 968. I understand that's not why we buy these vehicles. My reasoning is purely to drive classics to which I really don't lose money on other than maintenance. Intent would be to keep/restore indefinitely. Wish the cab had a back seat I've got two lil girls that would enjoy that.

I claim ignorance of course so I'm probably missing something overt here but why are 968 prices so relatively.....low? These are quite good looking cars.
I can't understand why these cars do not command more of a premium; they represent that last iteration of this design.

Would you fellas mind looking at this vehicle please and talk me out of it? I've made mistakes before and it cost me dearly. So deferring to your wisdom...please offer some insight? Am I missing some grand maintenance items to which could cost more than the car itself?

thanks for your help

Joe


http://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/de...38/overview/#1

Cloud9...68

There's been a lot of discussion of this on various forums. I think there are a number of reasons why the resale value of the 968 has been so poor. One that I haven't yet seen mentioned here is the fact that none of Porsche's "transaxle" cars (924/944/968, 928) have held their value very well. This may be because Porsche abandoned the high polar moment of inertia front engine/rear transaxle design when the 968 went out of production. Another factor is that the motoring press (not to mention the buying public) wasn't very kind to the 968, ranking it behind such contemporaries as the twin-turbo RX7, 300ZX, Supra turbo, etc., in comparison tests, and of course the 968 was a total dud in terms of sales. Finally, there's the factor that the 968 was produced during some of Porsche's darkest days, and there are those who blame the car for Porsche nearly going bankrupt. But to be fair, none of the 968's contemporaries, with the possible exception of the few unmodified Supra turbos's left, have held their value particularly well, either. And you never know - it may yet catch on with collectors, especially as their numbers dwindle.

fejjj

That is a good price for that car IF all the major maintenance items have been done to it.

The downside is the Tip transmission in terms of value. Most people want the 6 speed manual.

It is hard to say if these cars will ever appreciate in value as many here have been expecting it for years but up until now the demand has not increased. I beleive with the 99-2003 or so 911's being so cheap that many people go that route or the 944/turbo variant route.

I remember when the 968 came out and I thought it was butt ugly. It has grown on me over the years and I will most likely acquire one at some point. I like the idea of building a 3l turbo motor in this chasis.

PorscheG96

You can do much better than the white tiptronic cab. Anytime I see the drooping front bumpers then I turn away, plus when buying from a used car lot vs. individual seller, you're unlikely to get the whole story of ownership, service history, etc.

As far as values, I think it's as simple as NOBODY knowing what the 968 is and hence there's no demand for these cars despite their rarity. The 968 also doesn't look good on paper when compared with more modern and higher performance German sports car options that are similarly priced like 986S, 996, E46 M3, etc.

The 968 excels on 'intangibles' like driving fun, reliability, storage space, fuel economy, rarity, cost to buy, cost to insure, etc. On rare occasions they can actually be built and driven fast which surprises most people.

touareg

I think we need to wait longer But as mentioned above, the whole non rear-engine thing and water cool do harm the mystique. But I also think as Gen X/Y gets older, these are cars they may have interest in, but it will be the more unique, original, well maintained ones.

944 N/As were made a plenty, the Turbos not as much same goes for the S2, and the 968 is pretty rare as cars go. These are things that can help. Also the 968 was the last of the line, again, something that helps.

Good article on how the lowly 914 is increasing in value, because it is mid engine and air cooled.

All are cars that are worth a lot of money today had a period were they had more value as scrap than parts cars, as we see more 968s trashed or track rats, they will decrease in numbers. These also seemed to be 2nd or 3rd cars for people originally, so I think there are gems out there to be found.

https://www.pca.org/news/2015-01-02/...nt-prices-rise

Another philosopy: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe...ticle19873611/

Honestly, the only reason I care for these cars to increase in value is to have better support in the aftermarket, for restoration and improvement. I am jealous how easy it is to get restoration parts for the 993 etc.

Yes, I would like the car I bought for 5k to be worth 200k, if it was one I didn't want to keep

jeff968

I'm one of the preachers here so you'll only get more of the same from me.

I have been a 968 owner since 1996. I fell in love with them when they were new and still feel they are fantastic cars. I've got two now.

I think they have held their value very well after the initial drop when they were new. My cab stickered at over $60K when new. That cab you posted appears to be a very good deal. True, it is a tip, which hurt the value but it is loaded with options and an early car. If it checked out, I would say that is a $17K car.

I feel 968s are good investments for the future. They hold the main characteristics of a true collector car:
Uniqueness - They only sold 4,242 of them in 4 years here in North America. Car guys love uniqueness. the 968 will always be unique.
Design - The car still looks great today. A true timeless design. Okay, the interior not so much but I like it. Plenty of room. Always a crowd around the car at car shows.
Technology - rear transaxle, 6 speed manual, ABS, vario valve technology, air bags, excellent performance and mileage, in a 1992!!!!
Pedigree - Built in Stuttgart along with the best of them, the last of the hand built cars.
Best of the breed - 924s, 944s, all great cars, but they took everything they learned and made the 968. It is a solid car with very few, if any issues. Just get in and drive!
1 of 1s - Porsche cut their teeth on the 968 with custom car manufacturing. 33 exterior colors, 98 interior options, and dozens of options. So many of the 968s are 1 of 1s. very cool IMHO.

I think the 968 will only be more appreciated in the future. I just need to find a spot to store my third one!!! :O

Ridin Dirty

Thanks gentlemen.

So it's still a consideration. Let's see if i can low ball em. Been sitting there for two months.

Also see if they will allow a PPI

interesting points you fellas mentioned

1. i know its an auto (sigh). I'm a proponent of standard shift of course. Hate to see them go away. But with Porsche actually leading the way in dual clutch tech it's hard to ignore...i mean shifts in fractions of a second is unbelievable.
But this way my wife can drive it if she so chooses....and less and less people can drive standard shift transmissions these days.



2. indeed, why is the front fascia sagging?

3. back seat was not on "any" 968 cabs?...difficult to sort?

thanks

joe

jeff968

Joe,
Shifting at this point is all about driver engagement (ie, fun). The auto has it in every other category but it will never be as much fun.

As for rear seats, my 968 cab has one. It is an easy conversion. The seat belt nuts are already in the floor pans. You just need to get a rear seat from a 944 cab or you can go with the plain carpets which are there. BTW, 968 cabs in Canada and Europe had the rear seats (with a lap belt).

Jeff

Vendetta NY

Something is off with that car. The front fascia fitment, the warping of the front skirt, the rear clip fitment, and the seal of the trunk all strike me as being not right.

"Allow" a PPI? If they don't, then walk away and don't look back.

My .02: I've got an '05 911 Turbo Cab with full bolt-on performance mods, and an '94 968 Cab. Both are manual, and both put an enormous smile on my face. I don't track or race either of them, but I do drive them pretty aggressively from time to time. It's a LOT easier to do in the 968 than the Turbo. But that's why I got the 968 to begin with - for the pure driving fun without seriously risking life and limb. In other words, it's easier to get a 968 into the 7-8/10ths range on the street than a worked Turbo. In my opinion, the 968 is neither powerful enough nor "appointed" enough on the interior to be considered either performance or "luxury sport" - despite the badge on the hood. Which is why I opted for the cabrio. With the top down, instead of being drawback, the lack of distracting interior whizbangery becomes a "feature!" And what power is available seems amplified by the wind-in-your-hair experience.

GOTTA be a manual though.

Good luck dude,
-V

Cloud9...68

A lot of good points here, including several I hadn't thought of. The way I see it, someone with a near-unlimited budget (so having the ability to spend over $50K on a car) has many choices of incredible cars - a new Boxster or Cayman, a C7 (or even C6) Corvette, a 991 or 997, BMW M235i, E90 M3, etc. For those less well-heeled, who want to come as close as possible to one of these dream machines for, say, under $20K, have several options - an earlier Boxster/Cayman, 996, RX7, E46 M3, etc. The 968 is in this conversation. It's a great car - I regularly beat what should be much faster cars on the track with mine (heavily modified, though). But to be objective about it, it really doesn't stand out against the cars I've listed, certainly not in terms of performance bang for the buck, which is what cars like this are primarily bought for. But it does have rarity, and the Porsche name going for it, so maybe it will be "discovered" one of these days. Nothing we say matters - the market will decide.

jeff968

I've seen this car before. It was listed on Cars.com in February 2005 in Maryland with 21K miles on it. It is an early car, built in November of 1991 (281 of 2,008), I think it has the recessed hood. Lots of options; dual heated seats, full power driver's seat, headlight washers, hi-fi sound with amps, partial leather, and the Tip.

PorscheG96

So, basically anywhere that you browse to lately will have enthusiasts saying things like 'the values of our cars are starting to go up - find a good one now before you get priced out', etc. This is bubble talk and I see it on pretty much every Porsche forum, Ferrari, Viper, NSX, M Coupe, M1, old Benzos, VW Buses, etc etc. Cars are not investments, especially at a time when everyone around here thinks that the one they're riding in is appreciating. 968's are great driving cars with relatively low weight, excellent styling and road trip storage / comfort utility.

touareg

My bet on the sagging rear bumper, above each of the tail lights is the bumper has been removed and the bolts that hold those corners were snapped off the body. Over time the plastic drooped. They are welded to the underside of the light housing in the body. The middle above porsche is on nice and tight, since that is bolted through the interior with clamps on a metal strip attached to the bumper.

jeff968

Trevor,

Agreed. That said, not always. My first car was a 1970 Dodge Challenger 340 convertible in plum crazy purple. I paid $400 for it back in 1980. I sold it. The last owner sold it for $50K!

I think most of us are happy with the slow depreciation curve that the 968 enjoys. If someday, they appreciate, well great, but for now, we just enjoy them.

Jeff

uscarrera

I truly believe the 968 is one of the few undervalued Porsches left in the marketplace. The cost of an "entry" level new Porsche is rising all the time one suggestion I would make to all of us is do your best to get other Porsche enthusiasts into our 968s for a ride. It seems a lot of the prejudicial opinions of the 968 by 911 guys fades away after a ride in our sleds. I remember when I used to take folks out in the 968CS at track events and 911 race guys were amazed at the braking and handling features of the car. SPREAD THE WORD!!!

Rich