968 "Oilwars" Official Thread — ok just tell us your favorite oil.
10-13-2010, 11:51 AM
#31
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Yes Raj, (I am Fred), 1992 E34 M5 6 speed with the matching 3.23 diff. I was thinking at one point to use this model of TB's for the 968 turbo but there is just not enough room with a turbo to get 11-13 inches of runner before the plenum.
968 turbo (4.5 year project) I was waiting till I finished to post but there are some forums members here that (Patrick) that do not realize the changes I made as a result of just talking with them. Was waiting to say that when I finsihed. I have Raj to thank for the splitter
Other shots of the E34 - 197,000+ miles and she still will rev to 8000 rpm in every gear (but sixth - never tried it)
968 turbo (4.5 year project) I was waiting till I finished to post but there are some forums members here that (Patrick) that do not realize the changes I made as a result of just talking with them. Was waiting to say that when I finsihed. I have Raj to thank for the splitter
Other shots of the E34 - 197,000+ miles and she still will rev to 8000 rpm in every gear (but sixth - never tried it)
speechless.
[which, as you all know, for me is quite rare].
10-13-2010, 01:23 PM
#32
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Thanks Fred, you just made my day .
I currently own a E46 M3 and love that engine.
Haven't we spoken at lengths in the past? I, for some reason remember speaking to you over the phone.
Raj
.I currently own a E46 M3 and love that engine.
Haven't we spoken at lengths in the past? I, for some reason remember speaking to you over the phone.
Raj
10-13-2010, 02:03 PM
#34
Raj I am not sure but I did get that splitter from you but I think it was from the forum been a while. We obviously have the same tastes as far as cars go. That E46 M3 is such a nice platform. Surprised that is not already turbo'd Our sixes can hold alot of power and the higher rpm limit really makes things nicer. Sometimes when people want to race (which I really dont race...all i pretty much do is something small to answer the question...is it real?). I love staying in 1st gear instead of speeding, 8k in 1st gear makes for a nice conversation at the next light
10-13-2010, 02:22 PM
#35
In an effort to come back to topic a few things I seem to notice but may be my imagination....
Dirty Air filter = decrease from 340-380 a full tank spirited driving to 280-310.
OCI at 3500+ with sprited driving I notice that same daily right turn out of the sub-div into traffic at 50 mph avg (so I have to accelerate) is like I have a small anchor in tow and the gas mileage is like I have a dirty air filter.
After OC she feels like she just had a tuneup. Gas mileage like a clean air filter.
Dirty Air filter = decrease from 340-380 a full tank spirited driving to 280-310.
OCI at 3500+ with sprited driving I notice that same daily right turn out of the sub-div into traffic at 50 mph avg (so I have to accelerate) is like I have a small anchor in tow and the gas mileage is like I have a dirty air filter.
After OC she feels like she just had a tuneup. Gas mileage like a clean air filter.
10-13-2010, 04:43 PM
#36
Bannana Shine
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Originally Posted by odurandina
at one point, i had the car up around 4,700~5,000 rpm for like, maybe 7-8 minutes in top gear.
oil pressure was showing @ about 5 on the guage.
oil pressure was showing @ about 5 on the guage.
Yes Raj, (I am Fred), 1992 E34 M5 6 speed with the matching 3.23 diff. I was thinking at one point to use this model of TB's for the 968 turbo but there is just not enough room with a turbo to get 11-13 inches of runner before the plenum.
968 turbo (4.5 year project) I was waiting till I finished to post but there are some forums members here that (Patrick) that do not realize the changes I made as a result of just talking with them. Was waiting to say that when I finsihed. I have Raj to thank for the splitter
968 turbo (4.5 year project) I was waiting till I finished to post but there are some forums members here that (Patrick) that do not realize the changes I made as a result of just talking with them. Was waiting to say that when I finsihed. I have Raj to thank for the splitter
10-13-2010, 05:43 PM
#37
Thanks JDS968. I am a firm believer that what I dont know is only about 2 to 3000 mistakes away from being second hand knowledge. You should see what the car looked like when I rescued her from a Title Pawn Shop.
You should see what the car looked like when I rescued her from a Title Pawn Shop.
10-14-2010, 01:05 AM
#38
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ask any mobil lubricants engineer which oil he'd prefer to run in the most grueling conditions.
15w-50 mineral oil or mobil 1 0w-40.
they're about the same at engine temperature.
yes, that's right. they're about on the same order when it comes to protection.
but one is far superior to the other at start up. that's the oil i run in the winter. this will be my third winter running that oil.
anyone who takes my advice as gospel without checking is not being prudent. i guess the young guys are quite impressionable. i'm sticking very close to what bob talks about on his page, though when it comes to wear from cold weather startups. i daily drive the hell out of my car, and so that's a serious consideration for me. if people want to demonize me for taking his side that's ok. if someone's engine has really faded his oil pressure will show that he needs to be running a thicker oil. that's always a possibility. if he's got a fading engine to begin with or he's driving the **** out of it, he might have an engine failure no matter what he runs in there.
some of the comments on the 944 forum were pretty typical for that house of horrors.
and i would include one of the crass 968 people in that discussion and he also lost my respect.
it wasn't a thread about racing. or running in the australian outback.
15w-50 mineral oil or mobil 1 0w-40.
they're about the same at engine temperature.
yes, that's right. they're about on the same order when it comes to protection.
but one is far superior to the other at start up. that's the oil i run in the winter. this will be my third winter running that oil.
anyone who takes my advice as gospel without checking is not being prudent. i guess the young guys are quite impressionable. i'm sticking very close to what bob talks about on his page, though when it comes to wear from cold weather startups. i daily drive the hell out of my car, and so that's a serious consideration for me. if people want to demonize me for taking his side that's ok. if someone's engine has really faded his oil pressure will show that he needs to be running a thicker oil. that's always a possibility. if he's got a fading engine to begin with or he's driving the **** out of it, he might have an engine failure no matter what he runs in there.
some of the comments on the 944 forum were pretty typical for that house of horrors.
and i would include one of the crass 968 people in that discussion and he also lost my respect.
it wasn't a thread about racing. or running in the australian outback.
10-16-2010, 02:13 PM
#39
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did a lot of driving this week (including some driving between 4000~5000 rpm) on a trip w/ the fresh 0w-40 mobil 1... the oil shows no signs of breakdown as it was banging 45 pounds of pressure on the highway at 3,000 rpm after the oil change and still doing about the same w/ no oil loss after 2 k miles.
i now have 125 k miles on this engine and it's still pulling almost like new.
the oil's still a bit too thick at startup though, just as bob the oil guys maintains. lol.
shows about 48 pounds of pressure at cold startup @ ~ 45 degrees F before dropping to about 30 pounds at idle after warmup. then the pressure bumps back up to about 45 pounds once you "give 'er the gas."
but, i would still prefer to be running the thicker summer oil in there...
i now have 125 k miles on this engine and it's still pulling almost like new.
the oil's still a bit too thick at startup though, just as bob the oil guys maintains. lol.
shows about 48 pounds of pressure at cold startup @ ~ 45 degrees F before dropping to about 30 pounds at idle after warmup. then the pressure bumps back up to about 45 pounds once you "give 'er the gas."
but, i would still prefer to be running the thicker summer oil in there...
10-16-2010, 04:07 PM
#40
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[QUOTE=odurandina;79729
some of the comments on the 944 forum were pretty typical for that house of horrors.
and i would include one of the crass 968 people in that discussion and he also lost my respect.
If your are making reference to my reply on that thread and I believe it is me since I was the only one from the 968 forum over there, tell you one thing you also did lost respect from me by posting such nonsense.
some of the comments on the 944 forum were pretty typical for that house of horrors.
and i would include one of the crass 968 people in that discussion and he also lost my respect.
If your are making reference to my reply on that thread and I believe it is me since I was the only one from the 968 forum over there, tell you one thing you also did lost respect from me by posting such nonsense.
10-16-2010, 06:36 PM
#41
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independent oil shootout. wow ! who knew ? they like this oil.
http://www.performanceoilnews.com/oi...nst_oils.shtml
"In the 0 up to 40 weight category, it seems Mobil's new 0W-40 produces terrific power, insignificant viscosity loss and a middle-to-fair wear particles rating..."
mobil's website ALSO selects the 0w-40 synthetic for our 3.0 engines on their site.
http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/....aspx?option=2
i assume they're basing that on cold weather.
are they taking into consideration 15 ++ year old engines ? probably not.
from my original post,
i was clearly over-zealous about running that grade oil in the summer with the older 944/968 engines.
http://www.performanceoilnews.com/oi...nst_oils.shtml
"In the 0 up to 40 weight category, it seems Mobil's new 0W-40 produces terrific power, insignificant viscosity loss and a middle-to-fair wear particles rating..."
mobil's website ALSO selects the 0w-40 synthetic for our 3.0 engines on their site.
http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/....aspx?option=2
i assume they're basing that on cold weather.
are they taking into consideration 15 ++ year old engines ? probably not.
from my original post,
i was clearly over-zealous about running that grade oil in the summer with the older 944/968 engines.
10-28-2010, 11:22 AM
#42
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Thanks ModdedEverything951S for the owner's manual image. I was thinking that this may clear things up for those that don't possess.
So are our cars.
New technology is great, but the lack of ZDDP that comes with the modern oils is a potential problem. Our cars were designed to run on the oil of-the-day. That is why adding ZDDP to the newer oils is important and worth serious consideration.
So are our cars.
New technology is great, but the lack of ZDDP that comes with the modern oils is a potential problem. Our cars were designed to run on the oil of-the-day. That is why adding ZDDP to the newer oils is important and worth serious consideration.
it seems the Mobil 1 people did indeed use some loophole to leave the high ZDDP in some of the oils.
the 0w-40 (winter oil) has the higher levels of the stuff you guys want in your oil.
the 15w-50 (summer oil) has even more w/ 1200 ppm phosphorus, and 1300 ppm zinc,
why ? because the oil is designed for Porsches ? apparently, the short answer seems to be "yes,"
read the comments next to the oils.... another myth busted.
http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/...duct_Guide.pdf
scroll down and see the 3rd oil and the 8th oil on this PDF chart.
these are the two oils i run !! look at the numbers !! from Mobil 1 site:
http://www.mobiloil.com/usa-english/...otor_Oils.aspx
"The engine manufacturers are confident that this level of phosphorus will protect both new and older engines. However, there are Mobil 1 products which have a higher level of phosphorus (phos) and can be used in engines in racing or high performance applications...."
amazing.
10-28-2010, 07:30 PM
#43
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it seems the Mobil 1 people did indeed use some loophole to leave the high ZDDP in some of the oils.
the 0w-40 (winter oil) has the higher levels of the stuff you guys want in your oil.
the 15w-50 (summer oil) has even more w/ 1200 ppm phosphorus, and 1300 ppm zinc,
why ? because the oil is designed for Porsches ? apparently, the short answer seems to be "yes,"
read the comments next to the oils.... another myth busted.
http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/...duct_Guide.pdf
the 0w-40 (winter oil) has the higher levels of the stuff you guys want in your oil.
the 15w-50 (summer oil) has even more w/ 1200 ppm phosphorus, and 1300 ppm zinc,
why ? because the oil is designed for Porsches ? apparently, the short answer seems to be "yes,"
read the comments next to the oils.... another myth busted.
http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/...duct_Guide.pdf
Also, their online store has 55-gallon drums for "only" 3 grand...sooo tempting
10-30-2010, 05:04 PM
#44
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i first said about 0w-40 all year round. i do regret that. but i quickly retracted...
i believe there is a preferred grade of oil, Mobil 1 15w-50 over 0w-40 for the summer.
oil war thread 1 (from 944 forum): https://rennlist.com/forums/924-931-...r-mineral.html
Again, why? Even with an older engine, if the engine maintains sufficient oil pressure (say, over 4-5 bar at 5000-ish RPM), there's no reason why 0W-40 would be a problem, and again, unless your car has cooling problems, your oil temperature is probably exactly the same in the winter and the summer anyway.
if you really want to be entertained visit the oil war threads, where i make the same argument,
from here: https://rennlist.com/forums/924-931-...mineral-3.html
Just to add to this. You don't need to be driving on the racetrack to create high oil temps and low pressure. Just traffic on a hot day will do it....
in very cold conditions I would be listening to the advice given by running a 20w/50 with plenty of ZDDP and lower detergent content.
you just spewed one of the biggest common myths that all the oil white papers talk about....
amazing how much i'm hearing all the dynosaur knowledge from the dynosaur motor oil era.
Bob the oil guy:
"When you drive that car down the road mid-winter in upstate New York or mid-summer in Florida the engine and oil temperatures will be around 212 F. But your Florida vacation is suddenly altered by a hurricane. You have to get out of Tampa, but so do a million other people. It is now 95 F and you are in a snarl. Everyone thinks they need a thicker oil for this situation. This is false.
"Your engine is not producing much heat at low RPM and low BHP output. The production of heat is relatively slow. It can easily be transmitted to your cooling system. The problem is that your cooling system has trouble getting rid of the heat. The oil and the coolant will slowly rise in temperature. They both rise together. The increase is no big deal for your oil. It goes to 220, then 230 F. The problem is that the cooling system can only handle heat up to 230 F. After that you overheat the cooling system and the car must be shut off. The oil never got that hot, It was just that the water got a little hotter than its system design."
od;
nobody's talking about running the thick 0w-40 synthetic in the summer anyway.
we mostly all run 50 weight oils during the summer. a few guys run 15w-40 synthetic and conventional oils then.
two january's ago near Boston, we had about 20 nights below -15 C. we had a few nights down to about -25 C.
a conventional 20w-50 motor oil will not flow at those temperatures at startup.
nobodys gonna blow an engine from running Mobil 1 0w-40 or 10w-40 Mobil 1 high milage synthetic during the winter months.
"it gets real hot... in the end, your oil reaches a temperature about about 220~240 degrees Farenheit."
ummmm, even i have my limits.... those wide spread oils really give people the *******..... so.
use that stuff at your own risk, lol..... on the oil-war threads, i got stomped on pretty hard.
they are pretty entertaining...
but in the end they had nothing of real substance and exhausted themselves.
oil war thread 2: https://rennlist.com/forums/924-931-...ngine-oil.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKtxq...layer_embedded
are we having fun yet ?
Mobil 1: 0w-40 winter - 15w-50 summer. plenty of zddp
.
i believe there is a preferred grade of oil, Mobil 1 15w-50 over 0w-40 for the summer.
oil war thread 1 (from 944 forum): https://rennlist.com/forums/924-931-...r-mineral.html
Again, why? Even with an older engine, if the engine maintains sufficient oil pressure (say, over 4-5 bar at 5000-ish RPM), there's no reason why 0W-40 would be a problem, and again, unless your car has cooling problems, your oil temperature is probably exactly the same in the winter and the summer anyway.
if you really want to be entertained visit the oil war threads, where i make the same argument,
from here: https://rennlist.com/forums/924-931-...mineral-3.html
Just to add to this. You don't need to be driving on the racetrack to create high oil temps and low pressure. Just traffic on a hot day will do it....
in very cold conditions I would be listening to the advice given by running a 20w/50 with plenty of ZDDP and lower detergent content.
you just spewed one of the biggest common myths that all the oil white papers talk about....
amazing how much i'm hearing all the dynosaur knowledge from the dynosaur motor oil era.
Bob the oil guy:
"When you drive that car down the road mid-winter in upstate New York or mid-summer in Florida the engine and oil temperatures will be around 212 F. But your Florida vacation is suddenly altered by a hurricane. You have to get out of Tampa, but so do a million other people. It is now 95 F and you are in a snarl. Everyone thinks they need a thicker oil for this situation. This is false.
"Your engine is not producing much heat at low RPM and low BHP output. The production of heat is relatively slow. It can easily be transmitted to your cooling system. The problem is that your cooling system has trouble getting rid of the heat. The oil and the coolant will slowly rise in temperature. They both rise together. The increase is no big deal for your oil. It goes to 220, then 230 F. The problem is that the cooling system can only handle heat up to 230 F. After that you overheat the cooling system and the car must be shut off. The oil never got that hot, It was just that the water got a little hotter than its system design."
od;
nobody's talking about running the thick 0w-40 synthetic in the summer anyway.
we mostly all run 50 weight oils during the summer. a few guys run 15w-40 synthetic and conventional oils then.
two january's ago near Boston, we had about 20 nights below -15 C. we had a few nights down to about -25 C.
a conventional 20w-50 motor oil will not flow at those temperatures at startup.
nobodys gonna blow an engine from running Mobil 1 0w-40 or 10w-40 Mobil 1 high milage synthetic during the winter months.
"it gets real hot... in the end, your oil reaches a temperature about about 220~240 degrees Farenheit."
Forget 0W-40 and 15W-50...look at this! I never realized they were selling this...now I wish I'd found it years ago !
use that stuff at your own risk, lol..... on the oil-war threads, i got stomped on pretty hard.
they are pretty entertaining...
but in the end they had nothing of real substance and exhausted themselves.
oil war thread 2: https://rennlist.com/forums/924-931-...ngine-oil.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKtxq...layer_embedded
are we having fun yet ?
Mobil 1: 0w-40 winter - 15w-50 summer. plenty of zddp
.
Last edited by odurandina; 10-30-2010 at 05:37 PM.
10-30-2010, 05:07 PM
#45
Bannana Shine
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Why? I mean sure, a 0W-50 isn't going to be quite as thin on startup as a 0W-20, but it can't be any thicker cold than a 5W-30, which would be considered perfectly standard for most applications.