breljohn

I would love the Singer underpinnings but keep the exterior of my 964NB.
the performance numbers shown above are very interesting.
See, for me, it's about the driving experience and I love the look of a sleeper car (964TT comes to mind - one of my favorite 964).

cobalt

Thanks,

It is an impressive car and it should be for $575k over the cost of a 964. I would like to see what the 3.6 and 3.8L do the 4.0 is undoubtedly a monster and is quick off the line but appears to slow a little in the upper speeds that we can't use in this country legally. So against a stock 3.6T it would win all but top speed which is limited by singer. It isn't much faster than a stock 993TT in most respects other than 0-60. A 993TT does 0-100 in 8.4 sec.

I admit the Turbo 3.6 stock is a pig off the line unless you don't mind dumping the clutch. In stock form they will do 0-62 in 4.6 seconds all day long if you dump the clutch you can see numbers closer to 4.0 but it is abusive to the car and not worth it. The biggest issue with the old single turbos is 0-20 where they are pigs. Heck my C2 is faster from 0-20mph. A standard launch will see 0-20 in 1.4 to 1.8 sec and still see between 4.4 & 4.8 seconds from 0-62. Once the boost comes on it is a freight train but 0-60 was never what the car was about.

Stock 3.6T will easily do

0-62 in 4.6 seconds
0-100 in 9.0 seconds
0-125 in 14.5 seconds

Porsche seriously under stated these cars dump the clutch the numbers improve.

I don't see any 60-120 times I am sure they were not as favorable as the other numbers they show which is where the turbo shines.

When I made the changes to my turbo using simple bolt on mods I tested the car with the GTech. Granted it is old technology but what I saw in a number of passes was quite impressive 10 years ago. Understand I don't like to destroy my car so this is with a simple launch not R&T style clutch dumping:
0-62 in 4.2 seconds
0-100 in 8.0 seconds
1/4 mile in 11.6 seconds at 124.5mph the car actually gets faster as you pass the 1/4 mile mark. This was with seeing 0-20 numbers still in a slow 1.2 seconds which kills all the other numbers. Interestingly the turbo has nearly identical 0-60 times if you are from stand still or rolling start. Where it is the fastest is 60-120 or up.

If it wasn't for the lag of the single turbo off the line the 3.6T modified as mine is would more than likely give it a hell of a run for the money and has a -.1 # advantage on power to weight. What these numbers show me is if we were side by side and both downshifted and punched it the turbo would easily pull from the singer. That is the beauty of the 3.6T even with its younger siblings the 993TT and 996TT being faster on paper the single turbo pulls much stronger in 2-4 gears. simple mods and once you punch it with the 460 ft pounds of torque my car generates it is scary. You can spin the 295 PS2 back tires in 2nd 3rd and 4th gear at 5000 rpm without thinking about it.

I have no doubt the singer is an impressive car in every respect. It is undoubtedly an easier car to drive fast and has great benefits after all it is 20+ year newer technology. I also can't comment on handling since i have never driven one and unless you modify the turbos antiquated suspension it would be too much of a handful to drive quickly and safely against a car with all the latest and greatest components. However if you have $300k over the cost of a pristine 3.6T I have no doubt you can make the turbo do everything you wanted.

IMO none of these cars are worth the $$ they are fetching but as they said in the article they aren't making any more and with so few left I have no doubt the turbo will be worth more than a singer one day. It is also a pure feeling that is so totally Porsche I have to wonder if that was retained or engineered out.

I also don't get why they make any comparisons to a base C2 unless they were willing to post info for the 3.6l and 3.8l engines. I wonder if I added some frills to my track car and made it street legal could i get huge money for it. I have no doubt with a power to weight ratio 6 to 1 it would be much faster than both and has all the goodies that are needed to make it faster on the track.

Anyone want to buy a 450 hp 2700 pound rocket for $575k. LOL

I appreciate the article. It is an impressive ride but I wonder how many will be built with the 4.0l engine and if it were with a 3.6 or 3.8l I am sure it would not be as impressive.

I still know the virtues of the turbo and nothing here has changed my mind for pure looks alone I would take the 3.6T IMO and most I speak with it is one of the best looking Porsche's of all time.

Big Al HURT123

3.6 all day long. As long as they stay in business you can always buy a singer. They're not making any more 3.6s I don't think. They will keep going up. It kills me that I passed on one about 2 years ago for 100k.

canuck964

If I wanted a car to just park somewhere and hold it as an investment - 3.6 Turbo.

If I wanted a car to drive everyday - Singer.

It would seem to me that the 3.6 Turbo would be more sensitive to mileage vs. the Singer in terms of future appreciation.

IMHO a clean low mileage Turbo will appreciate more than a Singer.

In other words, a higher mileage Singer will keep its value more than a higher mileage Turbo. But a low mileage Turbo will appreciate more than a low mileage Singer.

My opinion ....... only the market will confirm if I am right or wrong.

Unfortunately I cannot afford even 10% of either car.

cobalt

That is what bothers me about spending nearly $600k to have a 964 modified and retains its original odo reading. Imagine having this pristine singer that was built on a tub that had 200k+ miles on it. I have no doubt it would be no different than any other but when someone looks in the window and sees 225,000 miles on the odo I would think it might detract from the perception.

Kind of like some posting the picture of Caitlyn Jenner posing in the GT3RS and realizing it wasn't what they thought. (no offense intended)

Nylasurf

I wish I had enough spare cash lying around for both as each is amazing in their own right, yet I barely have enough to keep my 964 on the road as my daily driver. In the end I had always dreamed of a Singer targa as for me that would be the quintessential Porsche(IMHO). Well now I am seriously envious of those with such a degree of disposable income as this weekend at Goodwood Festival the car of my dreams will be made public...
http://www.autoblog.com/2015/06/24/e...red-by-singer/

blackboy

That is nothing short of a JEWEL.