engine refreshment
12-22-2012, 09:32 AM
#1
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
engine refreshment
Hi guys,
my car was leaking badly at the end of the season and so i decided to use the winter-month to solve this problem.
My workshop (i`m for the first time there, and they are quite recommended here around munich - germany. They care about some alpenpokal - racecarscars and i think they know what they do. They are said to maintain Walter Roehrl 964RS, but this is only rumors).
I got a call, that the car was inspected and it`s fine, except the engine leaks badly on the third cylinder (foot). It`s a 92th engine with 180tKM on it. The car was quite strong until last summer and had less oil-consumption. But the engine was always a little bit oily during my four years of ownership.
We decided to drop the engine and disassemble it totally. I like the engine to pull a little bit better next year, to justify the money i throw in there now
The engine builder recommends me a complete overhaul to bring all parts (rings, bearings, ..., new bolts) back to specification. Further he wants to refresh the valve-guides, he wants to raise compression to oem-spec (most cars have not the spec-compression he said?!). He wants to install 993RS mainfolds and adapting the heads to the bigger mainfolds.
Then, i like him to install new valve-springs. He suggests to go the Schrick-route with titanium spring-plates. With the camshafts, we discussing to use the schrick-cam`s, or he told me good experiences about the 993RS camshafts.
He said, these modifications are the common upgrade package he sells his power-searching customers and all customer with this package were satisfied with the results.
Is there anything i forgot, or is something he should further install/upgrade/do on my engine to get some ponies on top?! I want a 100% streetable engine with good torque (city-traffic)...
New clutch and LWF was just installed. The car has 200cet cat & cup-pipe...
Don`t use the motec word please!!!
I think, during the winter 13/14 i`m going to install a header system, but for this off-season, the wallet is empty...
regards from munich
thilo
my car was leaking badly at the end of the season and so i decided to use the winter-month to solve this problem.
My workshop (i`m for the first time there, and they are quite recommended here around munich - germany. They care about some alpenpokal - racecarscars and i think they know what they do. They are said to maintain Walter Roehrl 964RS, but this is only rumors).
I got a call, that the car was inspected and it`s fine, except the engine leaks badly on the third cylinder (foot). It`s a 92th engine with 180tKM on it. The car was quite strong until last summer and had less oil-consumption. But the engine was always a little bit oily during my four years of ownership.
We decided to drop the engine and disassemble it totally. I like the engine to pull a little bit better next year, to justify the money i throw in there now
The engine builder recommends me a complete overhaul to bring all parts (rings, bearings, ..., new bolts) back to specification. Further he wants to refresh the valve-guides, he wants to raise compression to oem-spec (most cars have not the spec-compression he said?!). He wants to install 993RS mainfolds and adapting the heads to the bigger mainfolds.
Then, i like him to install new valve-springs. He suggests to go the Schrick-route with titanium spring-plates. With the camshafts, we discussing to use the schrick-cam`s, or he told me good experiences about the 993RS camshafts.
He said, these modifications are the common upgrade package he sells his power-searching customers and all customer with this package were satisfied with the results.
Is there anything i forgot, or is something he should further install/upgrade/do on my engine to get some ponies on top?! I want a 100% streetable engine with good torque (city-traffic)...
New clutch and LWF was just installed. The car has 200cet cat & cup-pipe...
Don`t use the motec word please
!!!I think, during the winter 13/14 i`m going to install a header system, but for this off-season, the wallet is empty...
regards from munich
thilo
Last edited by koenig_roland; 12-22-2012 at 09:59 AM.
12-22-2012, 01:47 PM
#3
I think, if you go to 993RS manifolds, then you can upgrade heads with 993RS valves too.
I made total rebuild for my 92 engine with 186000 km in last winter and upgraded it with V-Max valve springs. Revs go now till 7300 1/min and no problems. I was thinking to upgrade my engine with Schrick camshafts, but as I use my car mostly in street, i gave up. Sport camshafts have bigger lift, more power at top and less torque in mid range.
And if you not have prorgammable ECU, how can you get all ponies out from your upgraded engine?
I made total rebuild for my 92 engine with 186000 km in last winter and upgraded it with V-Max valve springs. Revs go now till 7300 1/min and no problems. I was thinking to upgrade my engine with Schrick camshafts, but as I use my car mostly in street, i gave up. Sport camshafts have bigger lift, more power at top and less torque in mid range.
And if you not have prorgammable ECU, how can you get all ponies out from your upgraded engine?
12-22-2012, 03:05 PM
#4
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
I thought about the 993Valves, yes. But this would be another €€€ to add on budget.
I spoke a buddy who drove a 964 engine with the schrick kit in an early 911 and he said there were no remarkable loss of torque under 3500 revs.
A remapping would be necesary to get the engine running perfect. Thats true...
I spoke a buddy who drove a 964 engine with the schrick kit in an early 911 and he said there were no remarkable loss of torque under 3500 revs.
A remapping would be necesary to get the engine running perfect. Thats true...
12-27-2012, 10:58 AM
#6
12-27-2012, 11:37 AM
#7
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
chains & ramps get`s renewed.
@edit
ARP: the engine builder did some turbo-conversions on these cars and maintains sport-engines and he says ARP is not necessary for the rods, because the oem-solutions lasts up to 7,5thousand revs. The rod-bolts gets renewed too.
the head studs get`s renewed. He uses GT3 stuff with little modifications (the GT3-bolts are to long).
He offered a boat-tailing and he does it on his own engines and engines with higher rev-limit than stock, but on an stock-revs engine it is useless he said...
regards
@edit
ARP: the engine builder did some turbo-conversions on these cars and maintains sport-engines and he says ARP is not necessary for the rods, because the oem-solutions lasts up to 7,5thousand revs. The rod-bolts gets renewed too.
the head studs get`s renewed. He uses GT3 stuff with little modifications (the GT3-bolts are to long).
He offered a boat-tailing and he does it on his own engines and engines with higher rev-limit than stock, but on an stock-revs engine it is useless he said...
regards
Trending Topics
12-27-2012, 11:47 AM
#8
chains & ramps get`s renewed.
@edit
ARP: the engine builder did some turbo-conversions on these cars and maintains sport-engines and he says ARP is not necessary for the rods, because the oem-solutions lasts up to 7,5thousand revs. The rod-bolts gets renewed too.
the head studs get`s renewed. He uses GT3 stuff with little modifications (the GT3-bolts are to long).
He offered a boat-tailing and he does it on his own engines and engines with higher rev-limit than stock, but on an stock-revs engine it is useless he said...
regards
@edit
ARP: the engine builder did some turbo-conversions on these cars and maintains sport-engines and he says ARP is not necessary for the rods, because the oem-solutions lasts up to 7,5thousand revs. The rod-bolts gets renewed too.
the head studs get`s renewed. He uses GT3 stuff with little modifications (the GT3-bolts are to long).
He offered a boat-tailing and he does it on his own engines and engines with higher rev-limit than stock, but on an stock-revs engine it is useless he said...
regards
In my amateur mind, I don't know if it's useless. Although I would say it's only very few horses - so it's really a luxury that makes sense when scraping hp everywhere.
With a 993RS intake system, it'll be real nice! You must be excited mate? Who are you planning on using for you rolling road remap?
Also let us know your head specs if your builder is happy to divulge? Here are some specs to think about...
964:
Intake port entrance diameter = 41.5mm
Intake Valve diameter = 49.0mm
Exhaust valve diameter = 42.5mm
Valve stem diameter = 9.0mm
993
Intake port entrance diameter = 43.0mm
Intake Valve diameter = 49.0mm (50mm Varioram)
Exhaust valve diameter = 42.5mm (43mm Varioram)
Valve stem diameter = 8.0mm
993RS
Intake port entrance diameter = 46.0mm
Intake Valve diameter = 51.5mm
Exhaust valve diameter = 43.0mm
Valve stem diameter = 8.0mm
12-27-2012, 12:25 PM
#9
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Hi Frank,
the question about the remap is in the mail i just sent him today :-).
The valve-size still remains on stock 964 diameter. He only increasses the compression rate and he extends the heads-intake port to fit the size of the 993RS mainfolds. It gets assembled with schrick valve-spring kit and titanium retainers.
The camshaft selection is an open point on the list. 993RS as a first possibilty he brought to the ballpark - he used it on some engines yet and the customers where satisfied. Or schrick camshafts (the mild ones with ~280deg and 2,1mm lift) i brougth to the ballpark....
For the boattailing he quotes realy only round about 2 or 3 hours.
regards
the question about the remap is in the mail i just sent him today :-).
The valve-size still remains on stock 964 diameter. He only increasses the compression rate and he extends the heads-intake port to fit the size of the 993RS mainfolds. It gets assembled with schrick valve-spring kit and titanium retainers.
The camshaft selection is an open point on the list. 993RS as a first possibilty he brought to the ballpark - he used it on some engines yet and the customers where satisfied. Or schrick camshafts (the mild ones with ~280deg and 2,1mm lift) i brougth to the ballpark....
For the boattailing he quotes realy only round about 2 or 3 hours.
regards
12-28-2012, 04:21 AM
#11
Valve clearance
Be careful if running with 993RS valves and RS cams as it is very easy to run into piston clearance issues. I had this problem and ended up having to buy a new set of pistons!
You may find some of this useful (post #54 onwards):
https://rennlist.com/forums/964-foru...rebuild-4.html
You may find some of this useful (post #54 onwards):
https://rennlist.com/forums/964-foru...rebuild-4.html
12-28-2012, 06:59 AM
#13
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
What are the specs for the 993RS camshafts?
Schricks has a lot more duration and a lot more lift.
@alex
thx for your hint, i just read the whole thread.
No plans to increase the valve-size yet.!
12-28-2012, 09:43 AM
#14
Burning Brakes
Good resource for camshaft info http://www.drcamshafts.com/911profiles.htm
I would speak with Schrick or FVD about the use of their cam as opposed to the RS cams and see what feedback they give. It sounds like you builder is very capable and is giving you good advise.
I would speak with Schrick or FVD about the use of their cam as opposed to the RS cams and see what feedback they give. It sounds like you builder is very capable and is giving you good advise.
